On Going Big Block Problem
June 24th, 2007, 07:38 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 19
On Going Big Block Problem
This Is The Readers Digest Version Of An On Going Problem With A 455 That I Have Been Having For About A Year Or So.
I Started Out With A Bought Rebuilt 1969 455 Bored 60 Over And A Pair Of C Heads That I Had Ported. I Put The Engine In A 53 Olds That I Started Building About 4 Years Ago, But Didn’t Notice The Problem Untill I Took The Car On A Shake Down Cruise. Previous To This It Spent Most Of The Time In Myshop For Mechanicals, Two Different Body Shops And An Interior Shop.
Problem: Smokes Profusley From Left Pipe Due To A Great Amount Of Oil In The # 1 Combustioin Chamber. So Much Oil That Its In The Intake Runner. Since The Block Was Bored, And Every Cylinder Had Very Good Compression , Good Leak Down Tests , And The Guides Had Been Checked And Or Replaced I Concentrated On Leaking Intake Gaskets, ( See Threads Posted 5/21 & 10/06/06).
After Changing Three Different Manifodls About 6 Times With Various Gaskets And Adhesives, Changing Heads ( C To G) Midway Through This Process, And Consuming Various Adult Beverages, I Have Waved The White Flag And Decided To Change The Engine. Which Brings Me To My Question.
I Have A Spare 72 Engine That Had The G Heads That I Used On The Problem Engine . The 72 Engine Has Dished Pistons That I Assume Is A Low Compression Engine Probably 8.50 : 1 Or So. The Problem Engine Has Flat Top Pistons. What Would Be The Best Combination Of Pistons And Heads, Dished , Flat, G Or The Ported C? What About The Cam With Either Set Up, Any Suggestions? I Know A High Volume Oil Pump Is Recommended And I Have Heard That Something Shoud Be Done To The Oiling System, Can Someone Advise? I Don’t Intend To Race This Car At The Strip, But I Have Been Known To Drive It On The Street The Way I Did When I Was Much Younger And I Wouldn’t Want To Have Any Pistons Coming Through The Hood.
Most Of My Experience With Oldsmobiles Has Been With The First Generation Kettering Blocks 50 Through 64. Any Help, Tips Or Advice Would Be Greatly Appreciated.
I Started Out With A Bought Rebuilt 1969 455 Bored 60 Over And A Pair Of C Heads That I Had Ported. I Put The Engine In A 53 Olds That I Started Building About 4 Years Ago, But Didn’t Notice The Problem Untill I Took The Car On A Shake Down Cruise. Previous To This It Spent Most Of The Time In Myshop For Mechanicals, Two Different Body Shops And An Interior Shop.
Problem: Smokes Profusley From Left Pipe Due To A Great Amount Of Oil In The # 1 Combustioin Chamber. So Much Oil That Its In The Intake Runner. Since The Block Was Bored, And Every Cylinder Had Very Good Compression , Good Leak Down Tests , And The Guides Had Been Checked And Or Replaced I Concentrated On Leaking Intake Gaskets, ( See Threads Posted 5/21 & 10/06/06).
After Changing Three Different Manifodls About 6 Times With Various Gaskets And Adhesives, Changing Heads ( C To G) Midway Through This Process, And Consuming Various Adult Beverages, I Have Waved The White Flag And Decided To Change The Engine. Which Brings Me To My Question.
I Have A Spare 72 Engine That Had The G Heads That I Used On The Problem Engine . The 72 Engine Has Dished Pistons That I Assume Is A Low Compression Engine Probably 8.50 : 1 Or So. The Problem Engine Has Flat Top Pistons. What Would Be The Best Combination Of Pistons And Heads, Dished , Flat, G Or The Ported C? What About The Cam With Either Set Up, Any Suggestions? I Know A High Volume Oil Pump Is Recommended And I Have Heard That Something Shoud Be Done To The Oiling System, Can Someone Advise? I Don’t Intend To Race This Car At The Strip, But I Have Been Known To Drive It On The Street The Way I Did When I Was Much Younger And I Wouldn’t Want To Have Any Pistons Coming Through The Hood.
Most Of My Experience With Oldsmobiles Has Been With The First Generation Kettering Blocks 50 Through 64. Any Help, Tips Or Advice Would Be Greatly Appreciated.
June 25th, 2007, 12:59 PM
#2
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Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Southern CA
Posts: 2,212
Such a long post to contain so little information.
Who did the machine work and what do you know about them? Who did the assembly? Who did the initial startup?
Did it do this from the beginning? If not, when did it start? Did it/does it fire on all 8? What does the #1 plug look like?
Do you know that the #1 piston has oil rings on it?
The protocol is: you post links to them.
Did it have thin steel gaskets? How deep are the dishes? When they are at TDC, what is the distance from the tops to the deck of the block.
They are aftermarket. It's possible, it has the same static compression as your '72. No way to know without measuring both.
Not much difference between C and G heads. On the assumption the ported heads were done right, use them on either shortblock.
I see three choices. Without knowing your piston specs, 2 and 3 are a crap shoot.
1) Do a complete tear down to find the problem, then do whatever in takes to insure the reassembly is done correctly. (recommended)
2) Use the '72 short block.
3) Put the '72 back together and use it while you redo the '69.
What about it?
Only if you increase the volume of the oil flow back to the pan.
You can slow the oil flow to the heads by using restricted push rods, which will reduce the amount of oil returning to the pan. You can increase it slightly, by using 5w 30 oil.
Anything else would depend on your combination and its intended use.
Norm
Who did the machine work and what do you know about them? Who did the assembly? Who did the initial startup?
........ Smokes Profusely From Left Pipe Due To A Great Amount Of Oil In The # 1 Combustion Chamber. So Much Oil That Its In The Intake Runner ........
........ Every Cylinder Had Very Good Compression , Good Leak Down Tests ........
........ (See Threads Posted 5/21 & 10/06/06) ........
........ The 72 Engine Has Dished Pistons That I Assume Is A Low Compression Engine ........
........ Problem Engine Has Flat Top Pistons ........
........ What Would Be The Best Combination Of Pistons And Heads ........
I see three choices. Without knowing your piston specs, 2 and 3 are a crap shoot.
1) Do a complete tear down to find the problem, then do whatever in takes to insure the reassembly is done correctly. (recommended)
2) Use the '72 short block.
3) Put the '72 back together and use it while you redo the '69.
........ What About The Cam With Either Set Up ........
........ A High Volume Oil Pump Is Recommended ........
........ Something Should Be Done To The Oiling System ........
Anything else would depend on your combination and its intended use.
Norm
June 26th, 2007, 07:18 PM
#4
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 19
Such a long post to contain so little information.
Who did the machine work and what do you know about them? Who did the assembly? Who did the initial startup?
Engine was rebuilt and assembled by an unknown machine shop. I know it was bored 60 over and the crank is 10 over. new cam, chain etc. I bought it from another builder that bought it from the machine shop when they went out of business. I wonder why? I did the initial start up and dont' remember it smoking while running in the cam.
Did it do this from the beginning? If not, when did it start? Did it/does it fire on all 8? What does the #1 plug look like?
Most of the time on this engine after initial start up was in and out of the shop, on short drives to body shops, it did smoke somewhat but i just attributed it to sitting for long periods of time.
It fires on all 8 and # 1 is oil soaked. Oil puddles up behind the valves in the head ports and in the intake runner feeding #1.
Do you know that the #1 piston has oil rings on it?
Yes I had all the pistons out at one time everything appeared okay.
My next step is to tear it down again and see what i missed.
The protocol is: you post links to them.
I wasn,t aware of this. I will have to brush up on my computer skills to find out how to do that
Did it have thin steel gaskets? How deep are the dishes? When they are at TDC, what is the distance from the tops to the deck of the block.
No it did not have a steel gasket. I haven,t been to the shop I will measure when i get there. 6/27/07 Measued the dish in the 72 block pistons 3/8 inch.
They are aftermarket. It's possible, it has the same static compression as your '72. No way to know without measuring both.
Not much difference between C and G heads. On the assumption the ported heads were done right, use them on either shortblock.
I believe the C heads were done right I had them on the 69 engine and only changed them thinking they were causing the oil problem
I see three choices. Without knowing your piston specs, 2 and 3 are a crap shoot.
1) Do a complete tear down to find the problem, then do whatever in takes to insure the reassembly is done correctly. (recommended)
2) Use the '72 short block.
3) Put the '72 back together and use it while you redo the '69.
The 72 engine has also been gone over by someone. It came wrapped in plactic with a proffesional logo on it. I bought it from a street rod builder that was going to use it in a 36 Olds and then decided to use a Big Block Chevy.
It hasent been bored, it loos lik somebody put a set of standar rings and bearings in, a new cam and lifters and timing set. I didn't need it, I just bought it to buy it.
What about it?
Only if you increase the volume of the oil flow back to the pan.
You can slow the oil flow to the heads by using restricted push rods, which will reduce the amount of oil returning to the pan. You can increase it slightly, by using 5w 30 oil.
Who has the restricted push rods and high volume pump?
Anything else would depend on your combination and its intended use.
Norm
Who did the machine work and what do you know about them? Who did the assembly? Who did the initial startup?
Engine was rebuilt and assembled by an unknown machine shop. I know it was bored 60 over and the crank is 10 over. new cam, chain etc. I bought it from another builder that bought it from the machine shop when they went out of business. I wonder why? I did the initial start up and dont' remember it smoking while running in the cam.
Did it do this from the beginning? If not, when did it start? Did it/does it fire on all 8? What does the #1 plug look like?
Most of the time on this engine after initial start up was in and out of the shop, on short drives to body shops, it did smoke somewhat but i just attributed it to sitting for long periods of time.
It fires on all 8 and # 1 is oil soaked. Oil puddles up behind the valves in the head ports and in the intake runner feeding #1.
Do you know that the #1 piston has oil rings on it?
Yes I had all the pistons out at one time everything appeared okay.
My next step is to tear it down again and see what i missed.
The protocol is: you post links to them.
I wasn,t aware of this. I will have to brush up on my computer skills to find out how to do that
Did it have thin steel gaskets? How deep are the dishes? When they are at TDC, what is the distance from the tops to the deck of the block.
No it did not have a steel gasket. I haven,t been to the shop I will measure when i get there. 6/27/07 Measued the dish in the 72 block pistons 3/8 inch.
They are aftermarket. It's possible, it has the same static compression as your '72. No way to know without measuring both.
Not much difference between C and G heads. On the assumption the ported heads were done right, use them on either shortblock.
I believe the C heads were done right I had them on the 69 engine and only changed them thinking they were causing the oil problem
I see three choices. Without knowing your piston specs, 2 and 3 are a crap shoot.
1) Do a complete tear down to find the problem, then do whatever in takes to insure the reassembly is done correctly. (recommended)
2) Use the '72 short block.
3) Put the '72 back together and use it while you redo the '69.
The 72 engine has also been gone over by someone. It came wrapped in plactic with a proffesional logo on it. I bought it from a street rod builder that was going to use it in a 36 Olds and then decided to use a Big Block Chevy.
It hasent been bored, it loos lik somebody put a set of standar rings and bearings in, a new cam and lifters and timing set. I didn't need it, I just bought it to buy it.
What about it?
Only if you increase the volume of the oil flow back to the pan.
You can slow the oil flow to the heads by using restricted push rods, which will reduce the amount of oil returning to the pan. You can increase it slightly, by using 5w 30 oil.
Who has the restricted push rods and high volume pump?
Anything else would depend on your combination and its intended use.
Norm
Jim
June 26th, 2007, 07:23 PM
#5
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 19
YES THERE IS AN OIL BAFFLE.
THE PCV IS ONE OF THE FIRST PLACES I LOOKED, I HAVE HAD IT DISCONECTED WHILE CHECKING FOR THE PROBLEM
THANKS
JIM
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