Distributor gear for billet cams
April 10th, 2015, 02:45 AM
#1
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Distributor gear for billet cams
Just felt that I should share what I have discovered this far on the topic of cam/distributor gears.
I have bought a Comp Cams steel billet roller cam from Mark, cutlassefi. I had earlier ordered a custom ground Lunati from him, ground on a Sadi core, but due to my bad timing it wasn't ready when i visited Mark to pick it up. Mark, a man of his words, set me up with this Comp instead, as he had it in house. Anyway, a Comp roller for Olds is on a billet core, they do not list anything else.
Thats when the problems begin, if you dont want to use a bronze gear, that everyone tells you must.
There is supposed to be a Mallory composite gear available, but since MSD bought Mallory it seems like it has vanished from the face of earth, tech at MSD doesn't even admit that they had a bronze gear for Olds, now discontinued, until I wrote the pn in my mail to them. MSD ready to run dist #8529 has a melonized iron gear btw. Melonizing is a fancy word for nitride hardening.
Tech at Comp Cams also said the only choice was a bronze gear.
I was not happy with the answers given, so I started searching, and found www.powerperformancenews.com where Billy Godbold of Comp Cams states that a melonized steel gear is compatible with almost all cams, including billet steel.
I mailed him, and he confirmed this, and Comp is going to update their recommendations soon.
Long story short; a melonized steel gear should work on a steel billet roller cam without issues, words from Billy Godbold, Comp Cams.
Happy weekend /Anders
I have bought a Comp Cams steel billet roller cam from Mark, cutlassefi. I had earlier ordered a custom ground Lunati from him, ground on a Sadi core, but due to my bad timing it wasn't ready when i visited Mark to pick it up. Mark, a man of his words, set me up with this Comp instead, as he had it in house. Anyway, a Comp roller for Olds is on a billet core, they do not list anything else.
Thats when the problems begin, if you dont want to use a bronze gear, that everyone tells you must.
There is supposed to be a Mallory composite gear available, but since MSD bought Mallory it seems like it has vanished from the face of earth, tech at MSD doesn't even admit that they had a bronze gear for Olds, now discontinued, until I wrote the pn in my mail to them. MSD ready to run dist #8529 has a melonized iron gear btw. Melonizing is a fancy word for nitride hardening.
Tech at Comp Cams also said the only choice was a bronze gear.
I was not happy with the answers given, so I started searching, and found www.powerperformancenews.com where Billy Godbold of Comp Cams states that a melonized steel gear is compatible with almost all cams, including billet steel.
I mailed him, and he confirmed this, and Comp is going to update their recommendations soon.
Long story short; a melonized steel gear should work on a steel billet roller cam without issues, words from Billy Godbold, Comp Cams.
Happy weekend /Anders
April 10th, 2015, 05:50 AM
#2
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Anders, great post.
However I may have been unclear about the cores used by both Lunati and Comp.
They use the same core, exactly the same core. And the Mallory gear I mentioned is in fact steel, not bronze. Bottom line is you can't always trust the guys answering the phones on those "Tech" lines. I've said that many times. You did exactly the right thing by going to the source. There are some reputable engine builders out there that never took this as far as you did and still believe otherwise. Again kudos to you.
Consider this, starting in the 80's there are thousands of Ford and GM engines out there that came with roller cams from the factory. Did anyone ever hear about needed dist gear replacements on those? No. That's because those cores were/are the same material as what's being used now.
Thanks again for sharing the facts.
However I may have been unclear about the cores used by both Lunati and Comp.
They use the same core, exactly the same core. And the Mallory gear I mentioned is in fact steel, not bronze. Bottom line is you can't always trust the guys answering the phones on those "Tech" lines. I've said that many times. You did exactly the right thing by going to the source. There are some reputable engine builders out there that never took this as far as you did and still believe otherwise. Again kudos to you.
Consider this, starting in the 80's there are thousands of Ford and GM engines out there that came with roller cams from the factory. Did anyone ever hear about needed dist gear replacements on those? No. That's because those cores were/are the same material as what's being used now.
Thanks again for sharing the facts.
Last edited by cutlassefi; April 10th, 2015 at 06:03 AM.
April 10th, 2015, 06:34 AM
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Thanks Mark!
Good to know about the cam cores, I must have goofed that up in some way.
Here's the link anyway:
http://www.powerperformancenews.com/...compatibility/
It also has some twist in what oil to use. I found it very interesting, as over here, everyboby seems to think an american v8 can't run on anything less than 20w/50. But maybe thats whats needed if you cannot believe in less than large bearing tolerances.
Good to know about the cam cores, I must have goofed that up in some way.
Here's the link anyway:
http://www.powerperformancenews.com/...compatibility/
It also has some twist in what oil to use. I found it very interesting, as over here, everyboby seems to think an american v8 can't run on anything less than 20w/50. But maybe thats whats needed if you cannot believe in less than large bearing tolerances.
Last edited by Backstrom; April 10th, 2015 at 10:33 AM.
June 23rd, 2015, 01:46 AM
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June 23rd, 2015, 07:59 AM
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June 23rd, 2015, 03:04 PM
#9
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Some vendors call an iron gear steel and a steel gear iron.
If you have a .500 shaft you need to have it reamed.
And please do not take it for granted that a melonized IRON gear will work, I think it needs more than a hundred miles to proove that.
Btw, Dick Miller sells steel gears for any shaft dia, but they are a little pricey.
Last edited by Backstrom; June 23rd, 2015 at 03:13 PM.
June 23rd, 2015, 05:56 PM
#10
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Location: Tinley Park, IL
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My $0.02:
I have an Erson roller 1050 steel core cam. I first used a bronze gear and it showed signs of wearing out too quickly. I am running an MSD Pro-Billet distributor. I communicated with Mark, Erson cams, MSD, and Howards cams. They all agreed that the stock MSD melonized gear was compatible with the 1050 steel cam. So that's what I put back on.
I pulled the dist last Fall after about 2,000 miles and both cam and dist gear looked great. I put about 2,500 miles on the car so far this year. Haven't pulled the dist, no reason to. Timing is still rock solid. I will pull the dist in the Spring next year to prime the engine for first start, and will check the gears then... but I anticipate no issue.
I have an Erson roller 1050 steel core cam. I first used a bronze gear and it showed signs of wearing out too quickly. I am running an MSD Pro-Billet distributor. I communicated with Mark, Erson cams, MSD, and Howards cams. They all agreed that the stock MSD melonized gear was compatible with the 1050 steel cam. So that's what I put back on.
I pulled the dist last Fall after about 2,000 miles and both cam and dist gear looked great. I put about 2,500 miles on the car so far this year. Haven't pulled the dist, no reason to. Timing is still rock solid. I will pull the dist in the Spring next year to prime the engine for first start, and will check the gears then... but I anticipate no issue.
June 23rd, 2015, 10:31 PM
#11
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My $0.02:
I have an Erson roller 1050 steel core cam. I first used a bronze gear and it showed signs of wearing out too quickly. I am running an MSD Pro-Billet distributor. I communicated with Mark, Erson cams, MSD, and Howards cams. They all agreed that the stock MSD melonized gear was compatible with the 1050 steel cam. So that's what I put back on.
I pulled the dist last Fall after about 2,000 miles and both cam and dist gear looked great. I put about 2,500 miles on the car so far this year. Haven't pulled the dist, no reason to. Timing is still rock solid. I will pull the dist in the Spring next year to prime the engine for first start, and will check the gears then... but I anticipate no issue.
I have an Erson roller 1050 steel core cam. I first used a bronze gear and it showed signs of wearing out too quickly. I am running an MSD Pro-Billet distributor. I communicated with Mark, Erson cams, MSD, and Howards cams. They all agreed that the stock MSD melonized gear was compatible with the 1050 steel cam. So that's what I put back on.
I pulled the dist last Fall after about 2,000 miles and both cam and dist gear looked great. I put about 2,500 miles on the car so far this year. Haven't pulled the dist, no reason to. Timing is still rock solid. I will pull the dist in the Spring next year to prime the engine for first start, and will check the gears then... but I anticipate no issue.
I've done some research before as you can see in my previous posts and it seems that even comp and msd have hard to make a difference between iron and steel. Melonizing seems to be what makes it work regardless of gear material.
Thanks for sharing Nick.
/Anders
June 24th, 2015, 08:15 PM
#12
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"Melonizing seems to be what makes it work regardless of gear material."
That's the impression I got too.
Reason I emailed Howards Cams is they seemed to have a large selection of composite gears. While they don't have one for an Olds, they did say long as my cam is a hardened 1050 core, the Melonized gear would work just fine.
That's the impression I got too.
Reason I emailed Howards Cams is they seemed to have a large selection of composite gears. While they don't have one for an Olds, they did say long as my cam is a hardened 1050 core, the Melonized gear would work just fine.
June 25th, 2015, 05:12 AM
#13
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"Melonizing seems to be what makes it work regardless of gear material."
That's the impression I got too.
Reason I emailed Howards Cams is they seemed to have a large selection of composite gears. While they don't have one for an Olds, they did say long as my cam is a hardened 1050 core, the Melonized gear would work just fine.
That's the impression I got too.
Reason I emailed Howards Cams is they seemed to have a large selection of composite gears. While they don't have one for an Olds, they did say long as my cam is a hardened 1050 core, the Melonized gear would work just fine.
The cam you got from me, was that a 4-7 swap or normal firing order?
July 31st, 2015, 05:03 PM
#15
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Location: Sacramento California
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Summit Racing® Steel Distributor Gears SUM-850006-12
Distributor Gear, Melonized Steel, 0.491 in. Shaft Diameter, Oldsmobile
Designed to be used with GM HEI distributors.
Melonized steel gear work with flat tappet or roller cam.
$24.97
Distributor Gear, Melonized Steel, 0.491 in. Shaft Diameter, Oldsmobile
Designed to be used with GM HEI distributors.
Melonized steel gear work with flat tappet or roller cam.
$24.97
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