Yeah you heard that right. I'm not proud. Please don't make me explain it or I'll puke again.
1968 ninety eight four door. A/c. PB. HEI. 400 tranny.
I have to slap this 84 vin 9 307 in.
I should have all the stock stuff for both engines. I might need a 307 PS and bracket.
Can't use either carb because the 307 is CCC and the 455 is a 850. I don't have a Rochester 650 laying around or I'd use it. I do have a Holley spread bore 650 tho.
Im hoping to get some tips on here for a few things...
Ign module part number that'll be good. Centrifugal advance spring weight. Converter stall or should stock be fine. Are the starters the same?
can I use the 68 ps pump with a 307 bracket?
Exhaust manifolds? Are they lined up the same with the crossover and everything?
I think that's it. Please give me all the tips you think I may need. Thank you in advance.

 

You mentioned the 455 had an 850 carburetor. Is that a square bore Holley? You can use a square bore carburetor on the 307 intake. Just get an adapter.

Don't use the CCC Quadrajet or OE HEI ignition from the 307. Just get an aftermarket OE style HEI distributor, like the Cardone 841893.

 

Your biggest problem will be the exhaust manifolds. The 1965-70 full size cars used a unique driver side manifold on the SBO installations - casting number 380145. This is a center dump manifold - the SBO installations in the 65-70 full size cars were never offered with dual exhaust. Due to the smaller deck height, 380145 is shorter than the center dump BBO manifold (casting 384785). In either case you'll be bending a new crossover pipe. The passenger side manifold needs to be either 381921 or 398704. No, the current 455 manifolds will not clear.

You'll need the water pump and pulleys from the 455 to make the accessory brackets work, since that 455 would have used a 5.1" pump with non-A/C and a 5.6" pump with A/C. The 307 has a 6.1" pump. You'll probably need to move the head bolts with the accessory studs to accommodate the brackets. You'll need to use the SBO holes in the 68 brackets instead of the BBO holes, and you'll need V-belts for a 68 350 in a Delmont.

Obviously you'll need the 2262/2263 motor mounts from the 455 and be sure to bolt them to the forward two of the three motor mount bolt holes on either side of the block.

 

It's the stock Rochester for the 455.
I'd imagine it'll drown the 307.
As I mentioned I'll be using a Holley 650 spread bore that I have laying around and the HEI that I have on the 455.
If I had a 650 non CCC Rochester I'd use it.

 

There is no such thing as a 650 Qjet. GM put the 750 Qjet on the 250 cu in Pontiac OHC six. The air valves on the secondaries won't open if the engine doesn't need it.

 

Ok. So the center dump driver side manifold that's on the car won't work.
I have a stock driver's side rear dump for the 307. Is there a passenger side manifold that will attach to the 68's downpipe? If the stock passenger side 307 manifold and crossover is used will I need to alter the downpipe? Can I get older sbo manifolds and everything (manif, cross, down) will bolt up?

Are you saying the 68 bbo brackets and accessories will work on the 307 with just using the water pump, crank and fan pulleys from the bbo? I don't remember there being "sbo holes" on the bbo brackets. I easily could be mistaken tho. So in 68 you're saying the water pump, pullies and brackets were all the same between bbo and sbo? I guess that would be ideal to just have to swap the water pump, crank and fan pulley. That's all stuff I have. Also I just looked on a running 307 and there's no head bolts with bracket studs. Neither does the bbo. The 307 upper alternator bracket attaches by three bolts to the front of the head, lower alternator bracket to the front exhaust manifold stud and tip of the PS bracket. The PS bracket bolts to the water pump studs, timing mark studs, and engine mount front hole. The pattern of the three holes on the front of the head for the upper alternator bracket is the same for both engines?

I apologize for making you repeat yourself.

 

Than 750. Unfortunately I still don't have one laying around. Is the 455 Rochester a 850 or 800? I just assume it's too big for a 307 either way. What do you recommend? The 455 stock Rochester or the Holley 650. Mind you it is the 5a HO 307. Obviously I'm not looking for performance but I'd like it to tug this heavy car down the way. Thank you for your replies. I appreciate you.

 

Small block version on the left, big block version on the right.





Scroll up and read what I posted about the passenger side manifold. If the 307 manifold would have worked, I would have said that. Just because it has a port for the crossover doesn't mean it's the same shape.

This is the manifold you need.





This is your 307 manifold.




Sure, the manifolds you have can be made to work if you pay to have someone bend new pipes. At some point it's cheaper to find another BBO than to mess with the 307.

I assume you have the brackets for the 68 already. If you have A/C, the driver side alternator bracket bolts to a stud on the head bolt between the no. 1 exhaust port and the no. 3 spark plug.







If you do not have A/C, the alternator bracket has two holes for the link.





The link that joins the PS pump bracket to the front exhaust manifold bolt has two holes, one for BBO, one for SBO.




If you want to use the 307 alternator and PS pump brackets, the 68 water pump and pulleys may not align. Once again, USE THE WATER PUMP, PULLEYS, AND BRACKETS AS A MATCHED SET.

I don't understand why people think I'm lying the first time I provide an answer. Many, many times I'll write "you need to do X" and the person will respond "Did you mean I need to do X?"

 

​​​​​​I didnt think you were lying. I just needed it spelled out a little more. The pictures and descriptions in this latest reply are fantastic. So was your explanation in the first post. I just had a hard time visualizing some of it.
the car has AC but when I got it the compressor was in the trunk with the brackets. Also the rear alternator bracket wasn't on the engine. Now that I see it in the picture I recognize it from what was in the trunk. I now remember the PS stabilizer having the two holes.
there is head studs in the location you stated but when I got the car all that was bolted to them was AC and PS hoses. Which I thought was overkill but also had bigger fish to fry than think about it. Lol. Are 307s the only sbo that uses their manifolds? The ones I need are the more common ones? I have access to the manifolds and crossover from a 78? 403.
also I'll be using the 455 brackets and accessories as you recommended.

I've only had CCC Rochesters on these 307s which I have no prob with. What do you think about the Holley 650 spread bore on one? I understand it's no powerhouse. But would you recommend the Holley or getting a 750 Rochester?

I'm grateful for your time and expertise.

 

You can rejet the 455 quadrajet to work on the 307.

 

If it's an 84 VIN 9 CCC carb number 17084554, it had an 800 cfm rating from the factory. Get just about any Olds non-CCC quadrajet with a hot air choke and it can be made to work on the 307, though. Most are 750 cfm anyway.

 

I'm trying to get away with something I already have seems this whole project is temporary. What I have available is a Holley 650 spread bore, CCC Rochester, and 455 Rochester. Thanks for your input. I just want to bolt one on. What do you recommend?

 

Wow does this bring back some memories!! I bought a 68 98 with a bad 455 back in about 1981. I found a 73 88 with a good running 350 2 bbl but no title and bad brakes. I never checked if it would work, but I put that 73 350 in the 68 98. I used the manifolds and crossover from the 73, never even took it off, Only thing I remember having to modify was the flange of the original exhaust pipe. I had to elongate the holes inward as the flange and pipe was bigger than the 350 manifold, but it did seal. Everything off the 350 worked fine as far as PS, etc. Pretty sure I removed the a/c compressor or it was already gone- It's been a lot of years. I drove that car as a winter beater for 2 years. I used to joke that I had a Omega with a 455 and a 98 with a 350- combinations that were never offered from the factory.

 

Lol. Love it! I traded a 41 Chrysler for a 68 ninety eight. I drove the Chrysler to Portland from Seattle flawlessly for the trade. The guy vouched for the engine and said the brakes were shotty. I said PERFECT! It sounded good and had fluids hen I got there so I made the trade and drove about 50 miles. Just far enough to be in the middle of nowhere in the rain. Well..... After doing the autopsy I found two completely broken springs, those valves ended up in the exhaust manifolds and oil pan along with the corresponding pistons. The oils pan had about 10 holes in it. The cam was broken in three. The timing gear went through the timing cover and pushed the water pump fan through the water pump. The fan pulley came off with the fan and slapped around a bit. The timing chain was sloppier than my ex wife's tw... Nevermind.... And the c heads cracked in multiple places along with the block.... I was very impressed with my first 455 let's just say.... I called the guy I traded and he offered me 2k$ to make it right and I accepted it. Which I appreciated. My friend towed me to his house and I bought a 455 that someone built for a jet boat. 0 mile rebuild. After digging into that I realized the cam was to much and the springs were too heavy and the pistons are 10:1. So I ordered those and kept the bottom end as I bought it.. No biggie. Then I found that there wasn't oil holes in the front or rear oil runner plugs. Tha was cool. I pulled the torker intake and cleaned up a stock intake. Bought a oil pan and new oil pump. Slapped a HEI in and boom... Thought I had something.... Got it in the car and broke in the cam. Got it mosty dialed in.... First time I drove it it developed a rod knock after 10 miles on the highway. So I had to bring it to my ex wife's place last night and leave it there. Then had to get a ride from her to my trusty rusty 82 ninety eight with my pride somewhere in the bushes on the side of the highway. I have a good running, low mile 307 vin 9 that I was planning putting in the 82 and keeping it CCC. Now I'm trying to slap it in the 68 just to get it home. Ive driven this car for about 60 miles like a gandpa and I'm getting ready for engine #3. The cherry on top is now it's at the ex wife's place and I get to spend a weekend doing this engine swap in her presence. That's why I'm just trying to use parts that I have laying around. But also trying to get everything I need completely lined out before hand so I don't have to be there long. Lol..

 

I am sure you are aware of it, but you 1968 ninety eight, is barely going to move with a 307. I feel for you, I am sure this was not your preferred replacement.

I remember when i was a teen in the 1970s and working on customers cars. Customer had a Datsun B210. I floored it at a light and the old lady next to me with blue hair in a Valiant blew by me like I was standing still. Of course she was just driving normally.

 

better plan on more than a weekend. have your buddy tow it to your place, take your time if this is what you want. my opinion is find a good running 455 or find a 68 88 with a 350, i believe it will drop in.

 

Well... The only ninety eight I've ever driven that wasn't completely gutless was a 90s one with a 3800... Lol... This may all just be theory but.... The 68 is 700 lbs more than the 82. I usually have a thousand pounds of tools and junk along with 4 kids in the 82 and it goes down the highway just as good as I'd want with the 140hp vin y 307 and CCC... The 68 is going to get the (drumroll) 180 hp vin 9 without the CCC... If I keep my junk out of the trunk it'll weigh less than my 140 ho 82. Also I imagine the vin 9 reacts better to the slightly less sleepy power train in the 68... Another plus is I don't care about performance much. If it can putt down the road I'm happy.... Another plus is that its not going to cost me anything except maybe a exhaust manifold... I'm trying to stay positive.... Honestly... If I can drive normal in it and the mileage is ok I might keep it... Lol...

 

​​​​​​I Have a few engines lined out. I have a different need for this 307 anyhow. Although I just found a 260 that might fill that need. I think I'll just leave the 307 in until I get my 455 sorted out. I don't plan on driving it much. If it can be mobile while I do body work and whatnot it would be helpful. And if I can do what I need to for next to nothing that would keep money in my pocket for the more permanent moves I need to make.

 

Man, you've sure had your share of bad luck...

 

Bad luck is my middle name. I always sneak out of it immaculately tho. It's really weird. I'm becoming less and less trusting with used car stuff everyday.

 

Personally I'd stay with the Qjet. I've tried those Holley spread bore carbs and been unimpressed.

 

I dont think th O P realizes the 455 Rochester Quadrajet , rejeted will work on the 307 And he wont have to mess with the linkage like he will with a holley

 

Can the rods and jets come out of the CCC Quadrajet and go into an older one?

 

I intend to get a 455 going soon and use the carb I have for it. I also intend to use the CCC carb as intended soon. So I won't be taking them apart again. If it came down to it I'd buy a used 750 Rochester.
the intention of this "project" isn for anything to work well. It's for it to work okay. I'll probably just slap the big Rochester on and nurse it around like that.
It's a long story but the car has to get another 70 miles before it's home. Then I have to move twice between now and June. It would be greatly helpful if my cars can move on their own. Otherwise I'm out 2000+$ in tow bills before I could possibly get this car's long term engine in.
​​​​​

 

unfortunately, no. They're completely different between the two in the primary jet department. The CCC primary rod specs are usually 57U on the VIN 9 carb, but the primary jets are typically around 75. Rods are stepped, not really tapered. Solenoid cycles determine the rod position within about a 1/8" lean to rich position window on the CCC carbs and cycle up and down. How quick that happens is dependent on the ECM signal. No vacuum controlled primary rods.

Interestingly, the secondary rods are completely interchangeable with older Q-jets and the CCC has no bearing on the secondary operation. The 84 VIN 9 secondary rods are typically DA rods with lettered hangers that could be found on nearly any Q-jet, CCC or not, btw.