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I am preparing for the install of mild 455 in my 70 Cutlass. Questions:
1. Is a 4 core radiator necessary? Non A/C car. 500 HP max car. Fairly mild cam. Automatic later to be changed to 4 speed.
2. Can my 3 core radiator top plate be modified to accept 4 core radiator?
3. When I install a four speed, can I just plug the transmission cooling line ports in the radiator. What would the plug size and type be?
4. Correct me if I am wrong on the 4 core swap parts needed: 4 Core Radiator, 4 Core Top Plate with insulators, 4 Core bottom insulators?
5. What about mechanical water pump. This is a non A/C car. Will be using all the pulleys from the 350 CI originally in car as suggested on Classic Olds.
You can now buy repros of the saddle brackets and isulators for the the four-row core radiator to convert a three-row top plate and core support. I got a set from USA Parts Supply but most of the Olds specialty vendors sell them now. You do have to spot weld them in place on the core support and top plate.
The HD cooling cars used the long-snout A/C water pump with matching pulleys. These are not the same as the non-A/C pulleys. You can probably get by with the original non-A/C water pump and pulley set.
1. Is a 4 core radiator necessary? Non A/C car. 500 HP max car. Fairly mild cam. Automatic later to be changed to 4 speed.
I found that an aluminum radiator outperformed a factory 4 core radiator.
2. Can my 3 core radiator top plate be modified to accept 4 core radiator?
Not easily. The 4 core radiator is thicker, and would not fit right.
3. When I install a four speed, can I just plug the transmission cooling line ports in the radiator. What would the plug size and type be?
Inline Tube sells the plugs
4. Correct me if I am wrong on the 4 core swap parts needed: 4 Core Radiator, 4 Core Top Plate with insulators, 4 Core bottom insulators?
Fan shroud? Thermostatic fan?
5. What about mechanical water pump. This is a non A/C car. Will be using all the pulleys from the 350 CI originally in car as suggested on Classic Olds.
No issue on this
Am I forgetting something?
Be sure about the radiator hoses. Olds used a larger diameter on the HD cooling 4 core radiators. The standard cooling water pump may have a smaller inlet. The top hose is the same I believe. The best way to check is to use a site like Rock Auto, and change the configuration on the search from 350 to 455. If the part numbers are the same, you are good to go.
Is your current radiator a 3 core aluminum replacement?
If so, I might be interested in it. I've got the original radiator in my car, and it's only a 2 core. I cleaned and boiled it out a couple years ago, but this would be an upgrade for me.
So does your local hardware store. I bought a couple several years ago - I think they are 3/8" tubing plugs. Same thing as the tubing nuts that are on there, just without the hole in the center for the tubing.
I recently changed from a 3 core to a 4 core myself. I tried to "flatten" out the top plate and bottom saddles, but that didn't work so well. I ended up buying the correct 4 core top plate and saddles from The Parts Place and it fits great now. I already had the shroud and fan clutch, but your #4 question is correct.
As for your original question, do you really need a 4 core radiator? Around 500hp dosnt sound like a "mild cam." So a 4 core or a really good aluminum radiator might do you well. With my original 3 core, I was usually up over 200 constantly. With the new 4 core, I barely hit 180 now. Sitting for extended periods in traffic I may hit 190, but it cools down right away when I start moving.
FYI, I got a 4 core (A165) delivered to my door for $163 from Autozone. They had a 15% discount plus free shipping. Just had to pay for tax.
I recently changed from a 3 core to a 4 core myself. I tried to "flatten" out the top plate and bottom saddles, but that didn't work so well. I ended up buying the correct 4 core top plate and saddles from The Parts Place and it fits great now. I already had the shroud and fan clutch, but your #4 question is correct.
FYI, I got a 4 core (A165) delivered to my door for $163 from Autozone. They had a 15% discount plus free shipping. Just had to pay for tax.
That's a bummer. I don't want to have to buy a new top plate and saddles. Not for $119. 210* running temp doesn't seem too bad anymore. Autozone only otherwise lists single core radiator A161.
Was the part actually a spectra A165 though? Like does autozone have it listed wrong? Even Spectra ecatalog lists the A165(CU165) as a 2 core/row radiator.
Personally, it'd be happy with a new replacement 3 core aluminum, so I don't have to buy a new top plate, and it would still be better than my factory 2 core. But I have a 350, so I'm in a different group here. :/
Last edited by jpc647; June 10th, 2016 at 06:39 AM.
Was the part actually a spectra A165 though? Like does autozone have it listed wrong? Even Spectra ecatalog lists the A165(CU165) as a 2 core/row radiator. :/
The radiator that Autozone sells as a A165 is a 4 core all metal radiator. They have it listed as aluminum with plastic tanks, this is incorrect. The radiator pictured is what you get.
The radiator that Autozone sells as a A165 is a 4 core all metal radiator. They have it listed as aluminum with plastic tanks, this is incorrect. The radiator pictured is what you get.
I'll keep searching for a 3 core aluminum replacement for my 350, but to the OP, the Autozone one seems like your best bet.
Probably the cheapest aluminum 3 core I've seen are from Champion Radiators. They are a little over $200 and you can find them on eBay as well. I was going to go this route till I seen the Autozone radiator. I think they get pretty good reviews.
Probably the cheapest aluminum 3 core I've seen are from Champion Radiators. They are a little over $200 and you can find them on eBay as well. I was going to go this route till I seen the Autozone radiator. I think they get pretty good reviews.
Did you have to modify the saddles the 4 core sat in?
I just don't want to spend the extra $190 on a piece of metal to hold the 4 core radiator in place.
My current OEM part is a two row. A three row aluminum is going to be worlds better than what I have. No need to go overkill here. But It'd like one from a local supplier.
I recently changed from a 3 core to a 4 core myself. I tried to "flatten" out the top plate and bottom saddles, but that didn't work so well.
I did the same thing back in the late 80s and it worked fine for ~10 years. Then I had the original 3 row recored and I bent the saddles and top plate back to fit the narrower end tanks and that's what is in there today.
Here are some photos of a three row top plate that I cut the saddles off/shaped into square tabs mimicking a 4 row top plate. I then broke four row saddles out of the bottom of a '70 98 core support, smoothed and spot welded them onto the modified top plate. It is almost completely identical to my other factory issued unit.
Nice work. Clean install. Saved a $100 plus not buying a new top plate. Thx.
True. But where are you going to find the saddles from a car?
Looks like I'll be contacting champion to try and get one that will drop right in place. That's a lot of work to put a 4 core radiator in place. I don't think it's worth it on a stock low comp. 350.
Installation of the saddles in the core support is super easy... Placement is the biggest concern, it helps to have the shroud,radiator and top plate in place to ensure a nice fit with no interference. Four holes through the core support and four nice rosette welds will keep them in place, clecos will make it easier if you have access. I have converted two of these myself with great results. Good luck
The Champion 3 core didn't cool all that great in my G body. An A body should cool better having a much bigger rad and is yet another advantage of running the early cars.
The radiator that Autozone sells as a A165 is a 4 core all metal radiator. They have it listed as aluminum with plastic tanks, this is incorrect. The radiator pictured is what you get.
This is no longer a 4 core all metal radiator but an aluminum with plastic tank radiator. Just letting everyone know as I found this thread, bought the radiator, and now have to return it. Photo is now incorrect and description is correct.
June 9th, 2016, 05:55 AM
pjmid43737-8-11065
