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When did it become a "concept"? They used to call this a "custom".
I have been building "custom " cars since 1981, taught by a man who showed a "full custom" 54 Merc here in NJ, and then went on to own a body and paint shop, still building customs, along with "pay work" until he quit in the late 90's. So believe me, I know customs.
This car is different in many things, than a true custom car. The whole idea is for it to look more like a concept car from the 50's, than a Barris or Winfield style custom. I am going to clean up the lines a bit, nose and deck, maybe shaved doors. But the philosophy is different. Stock type tail and head lights ( might have minor changes, as did so many of the concepts). Stock type hubcaps. Body lines stock, maybe even stock trim (if I can find the '98' trim). Everything I do to this car is more geared toward making it look like a brother to the Waldorf Nomad, or Starfire Olds. I really have to reel myself in, to keep from making it look too much like a Kustom. UNLIKE my 55 Old, built in 81, seen here......
Oh, my, I'm pretty far behind in posing pics here, sorry guys! Can't keep track, doing a lot of Facebook, on my shop's page, the 56 Olds Only page, and the 54-56 Olds page, as well as a couple Kustom car pages, and websites.
I'll try to catch up.
After tackling the tailgate, I decided to strip the quarters to get the whole back of the car finished. Then I will pull the body off, and do the chassis, before going on to the doors, and fenders.
Well, Olds had a spot high up on the quarters where they rotted out. This on was no exception. Both sides, and were actually patches a long time ago. Both sides also had pretty back collision damage. I had a hell of a time doing the patches over, as well as the crash damage. In between working on a Barris 40 Ford, full body and paint on a 41 ******, (along with fixing a TON of mechanical problems the owner did on the car), and doing a crash job on my good friend's 50 Chevy Kustom, and fixing some mechanical issues on that, too.
Lots of cutting, hammering, shrinking, stretching, etc, on the quarters, eliminated the gas door, too. Driver's side, cut out the old rot repair. After the new patch was in, did the gas filler door. The previous owner had bought and tacked on a 56 Chevy patch panel for the car. I cut it loose, just to be able to assess the collision damage on the R. quarter. Old patch, and mucho bondo! Decided to cut out the collision damage, and make a panel to replace it. Cleco'ed in. Welded and ground. A bit more hammer and dolly work to do.
I had bought a set of unused Foxcraft skirts at Carlisle, and tried to fit them up to the "new" quarters. Pete (the previous owner) had put a rough patch on the driver's side, and it didn't match the shape of the skirt. In his defense, he WAS using pointed bubble skirts on the car, so it didn't HAVE to match. I made a new front piece to fit the skirt. The Passenger side was off as well, the 56 Chevy opening is different. I cut off part of the curve, and instead of having to remake it, I found by rotating it up and back, it fit. Then I had to make the front 6 inches. Not bad.
The interior sheet metal of the hardtop is different from the wagons. The wheel well has a pinchweld that the sheet metal attaches to, to go up to the quarter window area. On a wagon it goes straight back to the tail lights, unlike the coupe. You also do not need an access panel for the quarter glass, but I made one so I could get to the side trim fasteners. I cut out most of the stock metal, to access the outer skins for hammer work. I also had to repair rot in the wheel wells. SO when I put it all back, I made them all work with the Nomad dimensions. They won't be seen, but it's fun making up your own designs! Lots cut out. Repairing the wheel well. Moving the pinchweld to line up with the bottom of the quarter window, too. Having fun with the bead roller! Tightened up! The back part will have to wit, as it is much more complicated in shape, and I have to access the gas filler tube there. Just a cool shot of my dirty, crowded shop, and mu other projects! Just so you know I'm not slacking on the Olds! 50 Chevy behind the curtains, Barris sectioned 40 on the lift, awaiting it's chassis, ****** in the middle, and my friend Kenny's chopped 54 Plymouth (he's building a new chassis with Vette suspension for it, on the frame table, to the far left)
Last edited by chopolds; May 1st, 2020 at 06:35 AM.
Just about caught up! Since the Nomad was the top of the line trim package (Belair) in the Chevy line, I want to do the Olds similarly. I was very lucky Pete had picked up a set of 98 tails a long time ago, and I found them in one of the many boxes of parts, that made up this car. Very different from the 88 lights, though, so out come the cutoff wheel, and welder! Frist a paper tamplate, then cut out of some 16 ga. sheet metal, the edge of the light. CUt out...fill in... Ready for a skim coat of filler! Now off to find a set of '98' side trim!
Backtracking a bit to fill in what I missed. The Olds of this era also had issues with the front of the hood rotting out, taking the inner structure with it. My old boss and mentor, John P. had filled in the huge Olds emblem on the hood, and Pete tried to MIG some patches on the rotted areas. Easier to cut them all out and start over! Got the outer done, and started fabbing the inner, and my buddy Kenny surprised me by punching holes in the big piece, and 'belling' the openings. Looks more factory than just a big flat panel! Pete didn't have any equiment, or experience in making compound curve panels, so he piecemealed it. Gotta go! Reall bad, have to do both sides. Filling in where the old brazed patch was, too. John also filled in the hood bird. Brass and copper pipe. Gotta go! Made the pieces carefully on the bead roller. The Olds used braces attached to the bird on the hood. SInce it was eliminated, I added some tubing. I may revisit this with some round tube, hugging the hood tighter, later on. Good job on lightening the inner structure, Kenny!
Welcome back.
Man that's the hard way to go, I myself would have sourced a better hood they are out there if you look. I had that issue happen to me a few years ago and it took a while to find one then shortly after I made a purchase they were everywhere.. Good luck in your build, keep us posted.... Tedd
“I really have to reel myself in” The whole notion of custom versus concept. It takes a great deal of self discipline to not express yourself when building a car that is perceived as a “what if?”, or a correct factory restoration. When you pour the countless time and money into one of these projects, it is human nature to want the world to know that it is your creation. I’ve been working on my ‘70 W30 flattop what-if wagon for decades, poured money, time and resources into it and still have the urge to put my mark on it. I would certainly not designate your car as a full custom. I really appreciate the idea as well as the work and craftsmanship it takes to pull it off. It will be stunning!!
I have been building "custom " cars since 1981, taught by a man who showed a "full custom" 54 Merc here in NJ, and then went on to own a body and paint shop, still building customs, along with "pay work" until he quit in the late 90's. So believe me, I know customs.
This car is different in many things, than a true custom car. The whole idea is for it to look more like a concept car from the 50's, than a Barris or Winfield style custom. I am going to clean up the lines a bit, nose and deck, maybe shaved doors. But the philosophy is different. Stock type tail and head lights ( might have minor changes, as did so many of the concepts). Stock type hubcaps. Body lines stock, maybe even stock trim (if I can find the '98' trim). Everything I do to this car is more geared toward making it look like a brother to the Waldorf Nomad, or Starfire Olds. I really have to reel myself in, to keep from making it look too much like a Kustom. UNLIKE my 55 Old, built in 81, seen here......
Are you planning to use all period correct mechanicals, drive train, suspension, instruments, electrics etc? I do enjoy watching the process. On the one quarter patch, I'm guessing the process was to drill and use the Clecos to hold and form the sheetmetal to the contour and then you scribe the patch shape on the inside to get a very accurate cut for the patch?
Daiv8or, as for mechanicals, no it is NOT going to be period correct. I don't even build my "period correct" leadsleds with all old mechanicals. #1. I like to DRIVE my cars, I mean, really drive! The Olds in the pic above, does have the original 324, with aftermarket Tripower. But I have no problem with adding on creature comforts, like AC, and a tilt wheel (helps see through the chopped windshield) The Olds above, I had driven 160,000 miles before retiring it. Drove all across the country to KKOA events. That was in the 80's when you could still get a front wheel bearing at an auto parts store. My new Olds will have a modern driveline and suspension, I plan on doing the same with it. Disc brakes, modern steering, even radials, really help.
#2 Just like showing a "custom" I prefer to show the car with it's hood and doors closed, so unless you ask to see it, the modern engine won't be known.
# 3 I build cars to please myself, so I don't really care when critics don't like my choices.
So while I want to make it look like a concept car, other priorities dictate the use of modern brakes, engine/trans, and suspension. Probably radials, and AC, too, so I can drive all summer.
And the clecos: yes, I use them to lock the panel exactly in place, while I work the contours, and bends. When finished, I scribe and cut away the excess metal, so I can butt weld the panel in, just leaving little tabs for the clecos. As I progress, I cut the cleco tabs off with a cut off wheel, and finish the butt welding. Time consuming, but worth it!
Welcome back.
Man that's the hard way to go, I myself would have sourced a better hood they are out there if you look. I had that issue happen to me a few years ago and it took a while to find one then shortly after I made a purchase they were everywhere.. Good luck in your build, keep us posted.... Tedd
Tedd, I agree with you if I was doing a nice stock rebuild/resto. But since I am, in essence, "butchering up" a car, I'd rather start with material that restorers would probably throw out. Helps with feeling guilty! Then I don't feel so bad about cutting up a nice car!
Tedd, I agree with you if I was doing a nice stock rebuild/resto. But since I am, in essence, "butchering up" a car, I'd rather start with material that restorers would probably throw out. Helps with feeling guilty! Then I don't feel so bad about cutting up a nice car!
Bravo!! I love this attitude. I wish more people building customs and hot rods felt the same way. So many seek the finest unmolested sheetmetal, just to then cut it up because they don't like rust. Recycling the discards as you are doing is fantastic. I guess it really helps that you are so comfortable with patching and sheet metal fabrication. I thank you for your consideration of the limited supply of original parts.
Bravo!! I love this attitude. I wish more people building customs and hot rods felt the same way. So many seek the finest unmolested sheetmetal, just to then cut it up because they don't like rust. Recycling the discards as you are doing is fantastic. I guess it really helps that you are so comfortable with patching and sheet metal fabrication. I thank you for your consideration of the limited supply of original parts.
i was just watching one of the auto tv shows where they were pointing how good a condition a car was in, they then proceeded to cut everything out the floor the firewalll the quarters etc because of the build they were doing
i was just watching one of the auto tv shows where they were pointing how good a condition a car was in, they then proceeded to cut everything out the floor the firewalll the quarters etc because of the build they were doing
Yep. They do that all the time. They seek out honest survivors just because they want "clean" sheetmetal to cut up and weld in something else. That's why I so happy to see the attitude of chopolds here.
A little something in keeping with the concept car theme. Cars like the Y job, and LeSabre usually had cool electrically operated features, like automatic convertible roofs that came up when it sensed rain. When considering where to put the gas filler, I originally was going to just flip it 180* and put it inside, Until my brother in law reminded me that this was now part of the passenger compartment, not the trunk, like on my 55. So I thought of doing the 56 Chevy trick, hiding it behind the tail light. A normal hinge probably wouldn't work too well with the shape of the 98 lense, so I came up with this idea. I used a 6 inch electric actuator, 3/8" shafts, and some linear bearings.
I am a member of the Motor City Rockets, in the Detroit area. I am the editor of our local club newsletter and would like your permission to use the photoshopped picture of that beautiful 56 Olds in our newsletter. wanted to ask your permission before publishing the photo. thanks (drop dead gorgeous concept).
Ted, it's not my Photoshop to say yes or no. It was made by Jim Laga. If you really want to do it right, you should ask him. He posts a lot on Facebook, Kustom Konstruction Zone, especially. But he also has his own page. He used to post on the HAMB as Kustom7777, but I'm not sure he goes there often, any more. Other than that, any pics you want of mine, go ahead.
thanks for the info. will see if i can contact him on the f/b page. 56 oldsmobiles have always been one of my favorites. my dad had a coupe that he rescured from a wrecking yard in San Jose Ca back in the early 60's and his sister had a 56 98 (i believe) convert. both nice cars. stay safe and thanks again
The fenders and doors need attention next. They all had rust repairs, and trim holes filled, with brazed patches. The rust was coming back through on the bottoms of the fenders. Mostly overlapped, and THAT is not good! So al got cut out, and replacement steel pieces TIG welded in.
Since I got both doors and fenders in primer I decided to do a quick mock up to get inspired to keep going. I even added some of the Olds '98' trim pieces I have been able to find (still need a few more). Next step is to pull the body off frame to restore/modify the chassis.
So al got cut out, and replacement steel pieces TIG welded in.
I really enjoy the metal fabrication and repair updates! I'm curious why TIG weld vs. most people's MIG weld? Do you find less distortion that way? I have both a TIG and MIG, but I've never used my TIG for steel yet, only aluminum. The MIG is so much simpler and faster, but then I am pretty novice at TIG admittedly.
Daiv8or, I use 3 different types of welding, depending on the situation. MIG is fast, easy and does the least amount of distortion. BUT, it makes a 'hard' weld that is difficult to hammer and dolly out the warpage. You can do it, IF you have good penetration, and then grind down the weld to the surface of the sheet metal. But even then, I've had it crack on me and had to re-weld. I do it on most customer stuff, to save time, and therefore money for them. I also do it on panels that I would have real difficulties in accessing the backside for hammer and dolly work.
TIG welds are much better, less weld bead, better penetration, once you get the hang of it, and a softer weld that is more easily corrected with H & D (hammer and dolly). Yes it does produce more warpage, but you can fix it easier, if you can H&D it. I've cut out the inner panels on many jobs (including this Olds-Mad project, here on the door, where I was going to replace the entire bottom 6 inches) so I could H&D the outer panels for a straighter finish. This is besides the use of TIG for SS or Aluminum.
Gas welds are even softer, and good penetration. I use this when I want more time to correct issues, or if I have to do some shaping when I H&D a panel. Example, if I weld together 2 panels that never belonged together, like putting different tail lights in a car, or if I chop a top, and the pieces meet with a dip, or ridge, instead of the panels being straight into each other. Gas lets me correct, or give the proper shape to panels that are 'mismatched', as I H&D them.
Daiv8or, I use 3 different types of welding, depending on the situation. MIG is fast, easy and does the least amount of distortion. BUT, it makes a 'hard' weld that is difficult to hammer and dolly out the warpage. You can do it, IF you have good penetration, and then grind down the weld to the surface of the sheet metal. But even then, I've had it crack on me and had to re-weld. I do it on most customer stuff, to save time, and therefore money for them. I also do it on panels that I would have real difficulties in accessing the backside for hammer and dolly work.
TIG welds are much better, less weld bead, better penetration, once you get the hang of it, and a softer weld that is more easily corrected with H & D (hammer and dolly). Yes it does produce more warpage, but you can fix it easier, if you can H&D it. I've cut out the inner panels on many jobs (including this Olds-Mad project, here on the door, where I was going to replace the entire bottom 6 inches) so I could H&D the outer panels for a straighter finish. This is besides the use of TIG for SS or Aluminum.
Gas welds are even softer, and good penetration. I use this when I want more time to correct issues, or if I have to do some shaping when I H&D a panel. Example, if I weld together 2 panels that never belonged together, like putting different tail lights in a car, or if I chop a top, and the pieces meet with a dip, or ridge, instead of the panels being straight into each other. Gas lets me correct, or give the proper shape to panels that are 'mismatched', as I H&D them.
Excellent information. Decades ago I used to do repairs with brazing like whoever worked on your car before. The theory was it was supposed to be lower heat and less distortion, but I never found it to be all that great. I still have a gas rig too. I'm assuming when you cut away inner panels, you just MIG them back when you're done? I'll have to experiment with the TIG. I plan to start my new restoration project either late this year, or next year and first up is rot repair. I'm collecting parts and sheetmetal now. The plan is to start with small floor pan repairs and some other small structure repairs, get my rusty skills up and then tackle the exterior quarter panel and rocker panel repair. What do you use to shrink the steel?
Shrink? Do you mean the warpage done when welding? The welding process produces shrinkage on the weld seam. THAT is what produces the warpage. To fix it, you must STRETCH the metal! Yes, hammer ON dolly, after the weld has cooled, If the weld proud is too high, grind it just about to the level of the sheet metal, and do hammer on dolly to stretch it back to shape. No need to shrink. And work only on the weld seam. Lot of people think you can get rid of the distortion by working on the flat panels outside the weld seam, but no. Just stretch the seam. All the warpage starts there.
Back in the day, the old timers would gas weld a seam, then immediately hammer on it, looking like they were shrinking. But they actually were flattening the weld seam, then as it cooled, with the colder hammer and dolly, they transitioned into stretching to fix the warpage.
Been a while but I've been busy. Pulled the body off the frame, right after those last pics. Had to do some straightening and welding on the chassis...The OP ran the car really low, and the bottom of the chassis was bumped a LOT. After sandblasting, I hammered the bottom as straight as I could and welded in boxing plates for more strength, and to keep this from happening again. Put it on the rotisserie, did more sanding, then 2 coats of Master Series silver, and 2 coats of black. Not sure I like the gloss finish (this paint wasn't available in satin), so I might sand and shoot it in a semi-gloss or satin black.
Location: Hamilton, Ontario Canada and Port Charlotte FloridaFlorida
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by chopolds
Since I got both doors and fenders in primer I decided to do a quick mock up to get inspired to keep going. I even added some of the Olds '98' trim pieces I have been able to find (still need a few more). Next step is to pull the body off frame to restore/modify the chassis.
Wow, just found your post, absolutely love what you are doing! I am now following.
Truly amazing work !!! Since I started restoring my 68 442 sport coupe I have become more interested in sheet metal and the work involved to get the metal the way you want it. I have been at the shop where my car is and the hours it takes to get the results we see in the pics you post are huge. In the posts we just see the changes, not the labour involved to get there.
Your work is nothing short or amazing and as said by a poster in a previous post, this is true craftsmanship in its purest form. I am a true fan of your work and this concept car is already a game changer. WELL DONE SIR.
Vince.
Well, I did wind up sanding out the whole frame and painting it with SEM Hot Rod Black, a semi gloss urethane. Looks much better. While waiting for the paint to fully cure, and painting/powder coating small stuff, I decided to drag out 2 1953 Lincolns I had 'laying around', and do something with them. I had a very nice 4 door sedan, and a rotten 2 door hardtop. I took the doors and roof off the hardtop, and converted the 4 door. Did a 2 inch chop, while I was at it. Going to put it up for sale after I get the front and rear glass in it. If it doesn't go, I'll keep working on it. In between welding, I am assembling the Oldsmobile's chassis. Also collecting parts to do the exhaust system (going to be unique!)
I had a 76 Impala rear end for the Olds, but it was too wide. I really didn't want to narrow it, but the rear had the Police package 12 inch rear brakes I wanted. SO I made a jig to drill the backing plate mounting holes from the Impala rear, on to the 56 Olds rear. So I can use the stock rear, with the big, modern brakes!
I'm using Jamco rear leafs, that were ordered with a 4 inch drop, and a reverse eye. I'll start with 2 inch lowering blocks, and adjust the ride height after I get the body back on. Using all grade 8 hardware on the chassis stuff.
Last edited by chopolds; August 17th, 2020 at 05:37 AM.
Update: I got the chopped Lincoln to the point where I will try to sell it, so the Olds is coming back in the shop. In the meantime, in between cursing Henry Ford, I managed to get the complete front and rear end put together on the Olds chassis. Put on KYB gas shocks, Addco rear swaybar, ran gas and brake lines, etc. But the big job was this:
I had the idea that it might be really cool to upgrade the exhaust. Well, if duals are better than a single exhaust, then QUADS must be better than duals!
I started with Ebay SS headers. Of course for a lowered car, they hung down too much, so first order was to shorten them by almost 2 inches. This caused interference with the oil filter, and A frame mounts, so cutting a replacing parts of the tubes were in order. I also wanted to pair up cylinders farthest apart in the firing order. One side worked out OK, but the other I cut one tube out completely, and reran it to match with the proper tube.
Being a 50's custom guy, I love Brockman Mellowtone mufflers. I ordered 4 steel packs form them, and cut off 1/2" on each side, welded in a separation plate, then welded 2 together. Once in place, i used straight and mandrel bent tubing, as well as water jetted flanges, to put together the system. I had to widen the openings in the chassis crossmember, to fit the side by side pipes. 1 3/4" tubing, with 1 inch spacing in between (that's why I had to cut the mufflers). One side is done, now I have to duplicate it on the other!
While my friend, Glen is working on putting his engine together, for the 66 Skylark I'm customizing, I had some time on the Olds-Mad. I used some 3/4" square tubing to build a frame to support the cargo area floor. I used 1/2" tubing to frame the floor panels. Two of them, hinged to fold on each other. Rolled some beads in for support. Not sure what i will cover them with, but I'm leaning toward using a 50's design linoleum, with half round stainless rub strips, similar to the bars on the Nomad tailgate. Also working on making "pockets" out of fiberglass for the area between the new cargo floor and the back of the quarter panel, for storage.
The spare tire fits nicely, flat under the new cargo floor, and the old spare well will house the battery and probably a small tool box.
Good luck with the project .
When finished , you will have the only 1955 Oldsmobile station wagon on the face of planet Earth.
Oldsmobile did not produce any station wagons in the 1951 thru 1956 era .
Thank you for that tid bit of information. I guess I hadn't thought about that. Information is always good.
Well, the undercarriage is finished. I cut out the spare tire well, and made a bigger one, to store the battery, and tools. Fixed some rust parts, replaced one body mount. Replace rubber between the quarters and wheel wells. POR-15 and undercoat. Painted the firewall, a second time, after the first mix looked a bit too pink or peachy. Now to put the body back on the frame. Then I can address the engine.
Still haven't accomplished much on the Old,s but I'm going to hit it hard (hopefully) next month. I did send the front bumper out for rechroming. Came back beautiful, if not inexpensive. Before I sent the rear one, I had to reduce the height of the license plate surround, as the tailgate wouldn't open all the way, without hitting it. Had to take out 1 1/4". Not usually difficult, but the vertical parts of the guard are angled. And there wasn't a lot of area to remove it from. TIGed it together, then added lead free solder to rough finish it. I'll have the plater copper it, so I can add more solder to it to perfect it.
I also finally got all the parts in, to build the engine. The cam and lifters I ordered in March, finally came last month. Just got the crank back from machining, so I ordered the bearings, and all are awaiting the rebuild.
I spent the last 30 or so years working on, and/or rebuilding engines at the 'day job'. So I lost my enthusiasm for building engines. But now, after 3 years of "retirement", I am excited to get back into doing one for myself! I cleaned the inside of the block, but the outside was not so clean, and a bit rusty from the hot tank. SO I started "cleaning" that, as well. And , of course, I got a little carried away.
May 1st, 2020, 05:35 AM
