Roger Dodger '69

I have a '69 cutlass s project that was put on hold for too long. I have a thread in the major builds and project section show overall progress of my car. In this thread I plan on sharing with you guys my progress from the tear down process to when it's ready to be put in.

I believe its the 350 rocket but I'm not a 100% I don't know much about how to work on engine, but we all start somewhere, right? This will be the first engine that I work on and I want to work on it on much as I can myself without having other people have some of my fun, but I know some stuff should be left to professionals. Since I plan to have this car this car for a long time and hopefully pass it down to my son so I want it to be a bad a** machine. I plan on buying a bunch of new performance parts, but still not sure what parts and brands would be best to get. I would greatly appreciate help along the way and links to helpful resources. Ill post pictures here in a bit.

Question for right now, what parts are worth upgrading to get a powerful engine. I want a good balance of torque and horsepower, but leaning a little more on the Hp

Roger Dodger '69

Just a few images of my progress

Roger Dodger '69

and more

Roger Dodger '69

and more. .

Roger Dodger '69

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Roger Dodger '69

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Roger Dodger '69

I don't think I have come across any major problem so far, but the top(?) of one of the lifters was off and in the valley of the engine. The pushrod was still in place and didn't look too crooked, but ill have to double check.

Magna86

69 was a good year for the 350 because you have the higher compression pistons with good heads. But to double check what number is cast on the heads. Should be near the edge would have been forward on the drivers side head or rear on the passenger head. Should be #5 but could be 6, 7, 8 etc. Really if you have the good heads with smaller compression chambers then you can get them cleaned up with a port and polish, headers, a better cam, edelbrock manifold and flat top pistons if yours need replaced. The stock ones would work as well. Cutlassefi can help you on can selection. Take the engine to machine shop and have them tell you what it needs. Then you can plan based on that.

MDchanic

The Block. To a 455.

Seriously, it will cost the same money to rebuild a 455 as a 350, so if you're interested in power, that's the best way to go.



True.

But irrelevant, as this is a '74 or later smog motor.



But he doesn't.



All reasonable, but since you'll need to change the pistons, bore the block, and probably grind the crank (while you're going down that road, you MAW...), you'll have a low power 350 on a 455 budget.

By the way:


- Eric


edit: I should clarify -

Your motor could be a '74 or later motor or it could be a '69 motor with a '73 or later intake, which has been carefully repainted blue everywhere.
Doesn't really matter, but so that you know, tell us the number stamped on the pad at the bottom left of your picture that I posted above.

70cutty

I agree with Eric. Don't waste your money on 350. I did the same mistake. Built my 350, went all out with the performance parts, porting, bigger valves, etc. Now I am having a 455 built. You want a bad *** machine, build a 455.

olds 307 and 403

All you need is flat top pistons, much better cam and the exhaust bowls unshrouded and 2" intake valves with a reasonable amount of milling to bump compression. I say the CP pistons if the block can clean up with a hone. Headers and duals are also a given. If you are happy with 350 HP and 400 ft/lbs then go 350. If you want more the 455 is much easier and much more street able.

Sampson

No replacement for displacement!

coppercutlass

If you want all new then build a big block. Now If it was me and one of the reasons I like small blocks is because everyone under builds a small block gets disappointed then goes big block so you can pick up small block stuff slightly used cheap. Im closer to the 400 hp range est. guess and im running compression in the 10 to 1 range. It all has to be set up properly. I think my current set up once I button up my frame work will see atleast high 12's in 1/4 mile. But I also had a really mild 9 to 1 compression 350 with a really mild cam and stock heads run 13.8's in the 1/4 mile.

Now you could freshen up that lower end assuming everything specs out and buy some older heads like #6,7 or 7A and get the compression around 9 to 1 with a mild cam a decent converter and 3.73 gears. You wont be disappointed. My 13.8 combo was essentially that the rockers where stock the only thing that was not stock on the long block was the intake and the cam., of course all the wear parts where replace but no forged pistons no fancy valve job just a freshen up .

Roger Dodger '69

I can already tell I'm going to learn a lot in this forum. Thanks for the feedback everyone. Well i got the casting number is 395558. I looked it up online and it is an oldsmobile 350 rocket. The intake is from a later engine.

Hmm so 455 engine. I do want to buy most parts new so if some of you guys think that it will cost about the same then I don't see why not. But just because I want to get most new don't mean I have all the money lol I'm shooting for having the engine complete by September, or so. What can I do to this engine to get a great price for it? and what kind of money could I get for the engine so I can put on the 455?

Once again thanks for the great feedback everyone.

MDchanic

That casting number is for every 350 between '68 and about '76 or '77, so it may or may not be the original intake.



Why not take a look at this week's recurring engine ID thread and tell us the engine number so we can be certain?

- Eric

coppercutlass

Core engine prices are about the same. A running engine with proof will probably get you between 700 to 900 appx. for a stocker. A mystery running engine probably 500 ish and I think what you have can probably bring in about 250 to 300.

Eric I think his 350 is the 73 and newer I believe the older ones had a smaller diameter dish but deeper. That's from what I have seen.

MDchanic

I agree with you Copper, that's what I said at the beginning, but I can't say it 100% without the number.

Bottom line is why would anyone paint an entire '69 engine blue?
Makes more sense that it's a '74 or later motor.

- Eric

coppercutlass

Yeah unless it got freshened up and painted with gm blue.

MDchanic

Does that motor look "fresh" to you?

- Eric

coppercutlass

Hey I had a relatively low mile 350 look like it went through hell and back lol. Ran like a scalded dog but looked like crap lol.

coppercutlass

The lifter valley looks to be clean and the pistons don't have a huge carbon build up. The pushrods will rush up in a hurry though. I guess it could described to be previously enjoyed after freshening lol.

Fun71

My '70 Supreme 350 got painted blue after its first rebuild in 1982. Sometimes it's easier to find GM corporate blue than Oldsmobile gold at the auto parts store.

MDchanic

What a horrifying travesty!

- Eric

coppercutlass

if blue is a travesty whats this lol. I still have 2 cases of cat yellow engine enamel .

MDchanic

My eyes!!

- Eric

Nop

But Sir! That's common! (At least it's not Hemi orange... )



WW2 paint scheme?

coppercutlass

I too did a 350 olds in chevy orange

holiday88

For the record, my 72 350 will be painted blue.

455man

My girlfriends 79 Trans Am has an Olds 403 painted Pontiac blue instead of the corporate blue. It's a way lighter color. The rest of the car is factory looking.

MDchanic

You guys are killin' me!

- Eric

Professur

I have to ask .. how many of the guys touting swapping in a 455 ever actually drive their 455 anywhere? I'm not trying to call anyone out ... I'm serious. You all know I'm looking at updating my powerplant and rebuilding a 307 makes even less sense to me than rebuilding a low compression 350 does to you ... but I drive my 307 everywhere. Whatever replaces it will be sucking my wallet dry all the way to Detroit and back sooner or later. So, does anyone spend more time driving their 455 than they do looking at it? Coz my priority is to make something useful .. no matter what colour it's painted.

Octania

OOOOH the rare "X" intake!!

But seriously, is that an "X" on the runner?

I say the engine is a 73-76 EGR equipped 350 with #8 heads.

How about the stamped-in VIN derivative on the block at the front left corner? Vertical surface about 2" wide and 3/4" tall. Should say

36M100123

or similar.

455man

Good point professur. I love driving my 455 everywhere but when it's out of gas the V6 gets its turn. I'll be building 350's for my kids cars.

coppercutlass

I drive my 355 all over the place but with 3.73's and all the goodies to get this sbo rocking down the track I'm lucky to see over 8mpg. But its more fun than a prius lol.

70cutty

That is a valid point BUT OP said that this is a project car and he wants more power. So it makes perfect sense to recommend a 455 as it is the easiest way to make power in our cars. My Cutlass is a weekend warrior not a daily driver so for me 455 makes perfect sense.
I speak from personal experience as I wasn't happy with the power output of my 355 so I am having a 455 built.

Professur

Let's see ... 675 miles to Woodward, times 2 to come home, divided by 8mpg means 169 gallons at $4/gallon comes to $675 for gas alone. That'll put a dent in the holiday budget. With a 20 gallon tank, 9 fillups. Someone check my math, ... my 307 only needed two fill ups each way, not 4. Damn ... maybe rebuilding the 307 makes more sense than I thought.

Professur

I understood that. I was asking for my benefit, not his. I'm counting on the personal experiences like yours to guide me in my decision making, and hopefully discussing it like this can help the OP too.

coppercutlass

I can get close to 15 mpg with a edelbrock 600 cfm the holley double pumper kills the mpgs.

Professur

.. and the Goodyears too.

olds 307 and 403

I can get 350's for $120-$200 here. 455's fetch $700+. Each a piston cam or early head and cam swap would big time wake it up