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Has anyone here played around with moving this cam?,Not sure I want to change it but if there is a little to be had by moving it would do that. I know on certain engines this will work,
Prob not worth it... do you know your true/actual compression ratio? What's your cranking compression? If you retard the cam (later intake valve closing) and don't have compression ratio to go with it, you can create real turd in the low/midrange. The factory W31 cam is already pretty big for a 350, arguably too big for exhaust manifolds.
For the time to retard the cam, you could put on 2.5" exhaust, which is worth 1-2 mph and a few tenths.
Has anyone here played around with moving this cam?,Not sure I want to change it but if there is a little to be had by moving it would do that. I know on certain engines this will work,
they are in 6 degrees advanced form the factory. I recently built a bone stock W31 four speed. It pulls great through the whole rpm range.
Headers are in the works as well as fuel injection. A performer rpm intake will go on when the injection goes on. And yes a 2 1/2" exhaust also. When the new Edelbrock heads come along will put those on,
I know I'm very late to this thread. But..... In all the dyo testing we did we did move a stock W30 cam 4 degrees both ways and both ways lost power. We also tried a hydraulic roller and both ways lost power. I have realized that I am NOT smarter than the camshaft engineers. So, leave it alone.
I know I'm very late to this thread. But..... In all the dyo testing we did we did move a stock W30 cam 4 degrees both ways and both ways lost power. We also tried a hydraulic roller and both ways lost power. I have realized that I am NOT smarter than the camshaft engineers. So, leave it alone.
jerry
as they came from the factory, the W31 was installed 6 to 7 advanced while the W30 was in at 2 to 3 advanced from straight up.
by the way you explain it, both W cams should be installed straight up…which isn’t what the camshaft engineers did.
as they came from the factory, the W31 was installed 6 to 7 advanced while the W30 was in at 2 to 3 advanced from straight up.
by the way you explain it, both W cams should be installed straight up…which isn’t what the camshaft engineers did.
I didn't explain anything anyway in particular. I haven't ran a W31 cam, and won't on the big block. But you assumed that you know where I installed the cam at and no where in my testing did I talk about what the intake centerline is when I had the W30 camshaft in the engine. What is straight up? Do you know the camshaft engineers? Did you talk to them? Again, being a hater. Love haters.
I didn't explain anything anyway in particular. I haven't ran a W31 cam, and won't on the big block. But you assumed that you know where I installed the cam at and no where in my testing did I talk about what the intake centerline is when I had the W30 camshaft in the engine. What is straight up? Do you know the camshaft engineers? Did you talk to them? Again, being a hater. Love haters.
jerry
you replied here to a thread about a W31’s cam timing , asking if it should be advanced or retarded.
why did you respond to a W31 cam question then by saying leave the W30 cam alone, when that has nothing to do with the original question? you were actually insinuating to leave the W31 timing alone as well…that’s what your response meant
the other point is ..you said the W30 cam lost power going +4 and -4 , but made best power at 0. they were not at 0 from the factory. so, what does leave it alone mean? you either don’t know how to explain cam events or didn’t know they were not at 0 from factory , which is straight up.
the only hate here is from you…you hate being asked to explain anything and hate when you know you can’t
Oh the internet, this is what we get for a guy that's trying to be helpful? and spend all this money and time ? You sir you should throw your own Dyno test out here for the world to see and let us make our own minds up. I for one appreciate what he is doing and look forward to his smallblock testing next year. So please restrain from the nonsense.
Canadianolds....... Since it seems that no matter what I say, what data I provide, or what experience I have mean nothing to you because you have a come back with some sort of snide remark to say to try to discredit me, especially your criticizing the dyno work we are doing for the Old's community I cordially invite you to come down to Michigan for our next session in August. You bring whatever parts you want to test. We will show you live and in person that you, sir, are absolutely incorrect with the words that are coming out of your mouth. Also please at some point provide any real data or work you've done that can discredit the work we are currently doing. Yes numbers generally don't lie. However in a real life situation there are always variables that can't be explained. So come to Michigan and bring your math we welcome you or anyone else that disagrees with us to come and see for themselves.
Oh the internet, this is what we get for a guy that's trying to be helpful? and spend all this money and time ? You sir you should throw your own Dyno test out here for the world to see and let us make our own minds up. I for one appreciate what he is doing and look forward to his smallblock testing next year. So please restrain from the nonsense.
I answered you question long time ago..it’s proven and I have dyno’d the W31 completely stock. they run best at 6 deg advanced,, that’s where they were designed to run.
isn’t that your original question? learn from that..not from someone who admitted he hasn’t tested the W31 cam, in any engine.
his first post here was useless and confusing.
Yes you did and I am thankful for that. But what this person is trying to do for us is wonderful. You may have more real world data for these cams then most people hear, but you can disagree as you have but this back and forth really is not needed. As most of us know you would be hard pressed to find any 2 engine builders that would agree 100 percent on building any given motor.That's the way it is, Just my take,
Yes you did and I am thankful for that. But what this person is trying to do for us is wonderful. You may have more real world data for these cams then most people hear, but you can disagree as you have but this back and forth really is not needed. As most of us know you would be hard pressed to find any 2 engine builders that would agree 100 percent on building any given motor.That's the way it is, Just my take,
the back and forth is essential…it’s not mean or anything like that. it’s just words on a screen. challenging someone’s theory of results is normal..except here for some reason
his data on the flow and unclear response to the cam question you asked is crap..simple as that. anyone can rip me apart for anything they want, I’m not a baby who gets all freaked out over it.
No, but you lash out and call people “stupid” and other derogatory terms.
We all know you’re a smart guy, but you need to brush up on your people skills, you’re a real ******* most of the time. Chill out.
No, but you lash out and call people “stupid” and other derogatory terms.
We all know you’re a smart guy, but you need to brush up on your people skills, you’re a real ******* most of the time. Chill out.
I just watched that video of the guy unboxing the new Speedmaster heads.it was a great video, he did a lot more than just look at them.
you called him an idiot. you do that a lot, like when you just lashed out at that guy about spark plug gaps. you are the worst of the worst, hypocrite.
you are the biggest ******* on here..and a dumb one at that.
I just watched that video of the guy unboxing the new Speedmaster heads.it was a great video, he did a lot more than just look at them.
you called him an idiot. you do that a lot, like when you just lashed out at that guy about spark plug gaps. you are the worst of the worst, hypocrite.
you are the biggest ******* on here..and a dumb one at that.
I’ve never hurled insults to other members on here anywhere near like you have. But sure, whatever you say.
Last edited by cutlassefi; Jul 1, 2025 at 08:30 AM.
Has anyone here played around with moving this cam?,Not sure I want to change it but if there is a little to be had by moving it would do that. I know on certain engines this will work,
Is this an original GM camshaft or an aftermarket replacement?
Canadianolds....... Since it seems that no matter what I say, what data I provide, or what experience I have mean nothing to you because you have a come back with some sort of snide remark to say to try to discredit me, especially your criticizing the dyno work we are doing for the Old's community I cordially invite you to come down to Michigan for our next session in August. You bring whatever parts you want to test. We will show you live and in person that you, sir, are absolutely incorrect with the words that are coming out of your mouth. Also please at some point provide any real data or work you've done that can discredit the work we are currently doing. Yes numbers generally don't lie. However in a real life situation there are always variables that can't be explained. So come to Michigan and bring your math we welcome you or anyone else that disagrees with us to come and see for themselves.
thanks for the invite ..but there’s way too much drama involved in your testing. the data is totally out of whack as well.
how about this..let’s me and you do an engine dyno challenge ?
big block or small block build, it doesn’t matter to me. you can make most of the rules up too. it would pretty cool to see two Olds engines go at it on the dyno. Heck, let’s invite others to the competition as well
after, we can tear down our engines and show everyone on here what made the most power. I’m the one with the huge disadvantage, you have two engineering degrees and a math degree.
Last edited by CANADIANOLDS; Jul 6, 2025 at 11:20 AM.
thanks for the invite ..but there’s way too much drama involved in your testing. the data is totally out of whack as well.
how about this..let’s me and you do an engine dyno challenge ?
big block or small block build, it doesn’t matter to me. you can make most of the rules up too. it would pretty cool to see two Olds engines go at it on the dyno. Heck, let’s invite others to the competition as well
after, we can tear down our engines and show everyone on here what made the most power. I’m the one with the huge disadvantage, you have two engineering degrees and a math degree.
Didn't you and Vortec say you were going to do this 2-3 years ago? How’s that coming along by the way?
You pretty much attacked my credibility on your very first post on here. Do you really want to go there?
Have a nice day.
I did attack your credibility, you do remember what you did to your customer in Sweden? And it wasn't because you had a failure, we all have had failures, it's how you handled the failure, that didn't sit well with me. Now that was a lot of years ago, I'm willing to let it go, hopefully you're learning from "pan print". Now that's not to say I won't bust your ***** a little here and there, but I always look forward to your posts. I do have a legitiment question for you, did you ever get any of the customers you built engines for to the Dragstrip to verify HP?
I did attack your credibility, you do remember what you did to your customer in Sweden? And it wasn't because you had a failure, we all have had failures, it's how you handled the failure, that didn't sit well with me. Who cares what you think?Panos, that was his name, actually referred a few builds my way. So I'd say he was ok with the resolution. That's all that matters to me. Now that was a lot of years ago, But you're still bringing it up anyway. I'm willing to let it go, Are you really? No you're not, you just proved that. hopefully you're learning from "pan print". Now that's not to say I won't bust your ***** a little here and there, but I always look forward to your posts. I do have a legitiment question for you, did you ever get any of the customers you built engines for to the Dragstrip to verify HP? Why are you asking me? Ask them.
I don't see you posting correction numbers, time slips etc., so........
And you did this last one on an L&S Dyno right? So why didn't you post this sheet along with your bsfc numbers for all to see? Btw, I don't believe your power numbers either.
Last edited by cutlassefi; Jul 9, 2025 at 09:19 AM.
I could go on for some time with dyno/track data, are you kidding, who has more? Not sure anyone on here is interested, but really I'd be happy to post it up, I've done so many it would take some time. And just to be clear I always show dyno HP @ the track. BTW that above seems like a lot of correction for 50 feet above sea level with a 30.50 baro..............just sayin, but thanks for posting!
Engine builders are the most self loathing crowd on the planet. Everyone hates everyone and egos are off the charts. This atmosphere is really unique to the industry.
Do you fellas realize that any prospective clients can see all of these posts, and could make a decision on where to spend their engine rebuild money based on how much of an ******* a poster appears to be? Think about that for a moment.
Do you fellas realize that any prospective clients can see all of these posts, and could make a decision on where to spend their engine rebuild money based on how much of an ******* a poster appears to be? Think about that for a moment.
I don't need your money or the clients.......................
One would think that a person would select competence over bedside manners. Has not the Oldsmobile performance community suffered do to bad actors that lacked ability. The used car salesmen's talked a lot of enthusiasts out of there hard earned money. How many people have been turned off building a performance Oldsmobile engine because of them?
Come to Florida in the summer and see for yourself.
Mark EFI
I will see if Dave the dyno operator over there on pan print can print that sheet for me on my last 455 Olds build so we can compare. For some reason his air turbine does not work so there was no BSFC numbers. The only data I had was EGTs and TQ and HP, they normally use O2 sensors but the customers headers were not drilled for them, so I was just guessing at the tune up. But this is what the conditions were 96 Degrees 82 % humidity 136 grains of water
900 feet elevation 28.98 Barometer 3900 DA
Last edited by VORTECPRO; Jul 10, 2025 at 07:16 AM.
Uhhh, you don’t need the hat for bsfc, just a correctly calibrated fuel flow meter. I just ran an engine this morning without the hat, but I got my bsfc numbers no problem cuz my fuel flow meter was connected.
For all, the hat is mainly for VE, not bsfc.
Op- bottom line on cam timing. You can’t take anything for granted when someone says to put it on this or that key way, unless you check. All these parts have tolerances, and sometimes they stack up the wrong way.
Last edited by cutlassefi; Jul 10, 2025 at 08:57 AM.
Uhhh, you don’t need the hat for bsfc, just a correctly calibrated fuel flow meter. I just ran an engine this morning without the hat, but I got my bsfc numbers no problem cuz my fuel flow meter was connected.
For all, the hat is mainly for VE, not bsfc.
Op- bottom line on cam timing. You can’t take anything for granted when someone says to put it on this or that key way, unless you check. All these parts have tolerances, and sometimes they stack up the wrong way.
I looked at your setup sheet, and I just assumed you got into a great Barometer, 30.50, but after checking the weather the day of your test, the baro was actually in the 29.98 area. I think you may be setting your barometer with the corrected barometer data, the baro should always be set with the (uncorrected barometer). Here's an example:
Not apples to apples.
You don’t live here so you don’t know, and I would appreciate it if you didn’t assume you know how things work here, weather wise that is
Most all of your local weather is taken from a local airport, which we have a little one here. However, it’s all the way on the other side of town, as is Auburndale Speedway. Plus, my dyno facility is literally right across the street from a very large lake. I can tell you on that day the wind speed was not nearly 8.5 mph for one thing. In addition, I have a secondary weather station that I monitor with my phone. That one, and the one used for dyno input, typically read the same, as they did on this day as well. The weather readings are taken from inside my dyno cell right behind the area of air intake, not outside in the uncompromised air. To some degree, although it does influence the air in the dyno cell, for the most part who cares what it is outside.
Lastly, if you get a passing shower on one side of town and not another, which happens quite often, you’ll get varying weather, sometimes significant, “in the same town”.
Thanks.
Last edited by cutlassefi; Jul 11, 2025 at 10:48 AM.
Not apples to apples.
You don’t live here so you don’t know, and I would appreciate it if you didn’t assume you know how things work here, weather wise that is
Most all of your local weather is taken from a local airport, which we have a little one here. However, it’s all the way on the other side of town, as is Auburndale Speedway. Plus, my dyno facility is literally right across the street from a very large lake. I can tell you on that day the wind speed was not nearly 8.5 mph for one thing. In addition, I have a secondary weather station that I monitor with my phone. That one, and the one used for dyno input, typically read the same, as they did on this day as well. The weather readings are taken from inside my dyno cell right behind the area of air intake, not outside in the uncompromised air. To some degree, although it does influence the air in the dyno cell, for the most part who cares what it is outside.
Lastly, if you get a passing shower on one side of town and not another, which happens quite often, you’ll get varying weather, sometimes significant, “in the same town”.
Thanks.
Just trying to help you with the baro setting, its not like its making you show more HP, its robbing you.
Just trying to help you with the baro setting, its not like its making you show more HP, its robbing you.
I gotcha, you’ve mentioned that before.
But I can tell you my overall correction factors are at or nearly the same as when I was using my friends Superflow 902 on a typical day here in Florida. So maybe I’m giving up something, but it’s no more than a few horsepower here and there.
But I do find it odd that you’re telling me I could probably add a few numbers to my Dyno sheets, when you have openly criticized and scrutinized my horsepower numbers to begin with, waiting for tiimeslips to verify what I’ve posted. Very interesting.
I gotcha, you’ve mentioned that before.
But I can tell you my overall correction factors are at or nearly the same as when I was using my friends Superflow 902 on a typical day here in Florida. So maybe I’m giving up something, but it’s no more than a few horsepower here and there.
But I do find it odd that you’re telling me I could probably add a few numbers to my Dyno sheets, when you have openly criticized and scrutinized my horsepower numbers to begin with, waiting for tiimeslips to verify what I’ve posted. Very interesting.
Where both engine guys, I hope the best for you. I scrutinize everyone's dyno testing and Dragstrip performance .Get yourself a Kestrel from Summit, use it to set your baro during testing.
