I have a buddy that wants to drag race his 65 Impala, 67 350 horse 327, 4 speed car against my 70 w30 4 speed car..this is for bragging rights, he owns a machine shop and has a lot of drag racing experience..as well he will cheat at every chance lol. Looking at simple power to weight of both cars as long as I can launch it effectively I definitely should have the edge..My 455 has had the pistons dished to lower comp to 9:1 compression, not the w30 cam but a crane cam intake lift 491, exhaust lift 518, duration 226 atdc 234 btdc @50, so still a decent camshaft..Factory F heads, factory aluminum intake etc, factory exhaust manifolds..
Here are my thoughts, just to help on launch and a little edge without spending a ton of money; change to 90/10 front shocks, new rear upper and lower control arm bushings, tighten them just enough to keep any binding from happening. Been getting wheel hop, hoping changing bushings and tightening on the light side will eliminate that..Going to use @ set of drag radials. Check all my tune, change rear posi fluid as its been in there a long time. Thought about cheatin a bit and welding a cheap set of exhaust cutouts 6’ from the exhaust manifolds.. any thoughts or suggestions to just make sure the car does its best?
thanks
Andy

 

Best thing you can to a manual shift car is relocate the upper rear control arms to change the instant Center, this will help separate the body and axle , which drives the tires into the track. You don’t want the rear to squat..you need it to separate …if it doesn’t do this, no slick or drag radial will help

cheap Lakewood or other brands works just as well. You don’t even see them unless you crawl right under. This is crucial on a stick to get off the line without breaking the tires loose…if they do break loose, you are done.

also need to learn how to gradually come into the throttle while easing off the clutch to prevent shocking the tires. Unless the track is prepped good.

Practice how to hold the throttle so rpms are around 3500 by ear, and when you let out the clutch easy, your throttle should then be wide open. Each car is different, find our the sweet spot where you can apply full throttle while easing off the clutch , ease off more each time until it loads to much…then go back to the previous rpm

 

Forgot to say, that old crane cam is waaay better than the factory W30 one 😎

what gears in the rear?

and, do you know what et/mph he has ran?

 

My car are 3:42 gears, do your talking putting a set of traction bars on it correct? Great advice on the launch, your thoughts on using 90/10 front shocks?
Not sure of his ets, I don’t think he has any because he’s just putting the car together..
Nice to know about the old crane cam I wasn’t sure how it compared to the true W 30 cam

 

Andy, he owns a machine shop = your screwed ! lol Haven't you ever heard of the Pure stock drags ? The cars look stock and run stock size tires, BUT they run 11 - 12 second 1/4 mile times all day long.
G O O D L U C K ! ! !

 

Lol. Your probably right but my buddy works at that shop and says its a stock 350 horse 327 out of a 67 vette they put a big block in. But then again its for bragging rights.. Lol

 

If he has a true 67 L79 in his Impala, that is a high revving powerful little motor even without a ton of extra work which I assume he did. Just remember, bragging rights are not worth blowing up the motor, trans, or rear in your w30.

 

Beware the wolf in sheep’s clothing with a machine shop employee! If he’s straight up on the contents of that 327, you should have no problem putting a few lengths on him but that combo is no slouch. IMO getting a clean launch and clean gear changes will be your #1 priority, way ahead of equipment details. If you’re gonna use the drag radials, practice a few launches before taking the field of battle so you don’t bog or stall it.

​​​​​​….

 

Lakewood No-Hop bars are what CanadienOlds is talking about. They work, they will eliminate your wheel hop. Also available thru different manufacturers.
Rear shocks should be a 50/50 ratio
90/10s on the front
Disconnect the front swaybar end links, or completely remove the swaybar
Advance your timing 4 to 6 degrees from stock Run premium
Only run 1/4 tank of gas, bring a gas can with more fuel. Gas is about 7lbs per gallon so you can shave 100lbs doing this.
Remove the spare tire, jack, and anything else you can get away with(passenger seat, back seat)
Add an MSD 6AL with rev-limiter. You'll get a hotter spark, and prevent you from scattering you engine should you over-rev or miss a shift. I have mine mounted under the dash.

You can always add a 100 shot of Nitrous if you think he's gonna pull some tricks.

 

yes , those shocks will help transfer the weight. And yes on the rear upper traction bars

im assuming you have the M21? With the 3:42 it’s gonna be tough to get off the line with that overall first gear ratio.

it will really pull the rpms down if you get good traction,, so you will have to soft pedal the clutch off the line before you can full engage it.

no way will you be able to dump the clutch if the tires bite.

try use the smallest rear tire diameter you can find to help you out.. there are some real small diameter ones out there

with that overall first ratio and traction, you will have to finesse it off the line

 

You do have to watch out for machine shop owners with 327 powered cars or trucks............

 

Thanks all, its going to be a fun thing..good to get to the track..I certainly have no intentions of pushing my car to win..not worth the cost of repair. Probably throw some 90/10’s on the front, new bushings in rear control arms as they are the originals so they need replaced..main thing is get rid of the wheel hop, drag radials in play etc. Play around with the launch and let it rip.. somebody on here was spot on about the tall first gear in an m21 with the 3:42 gear..should be fun, win or lose..hopefully at sea level, with dryer cooler temps coming I can get a mid 13’s without pushing it real hard

 

No worries. The L-79 ran 15 flat in a 3000-lb Nova back in the day. Unless it's seriously prepped, it won't have the torque (360 lb-ft. IIRC) to move a 3900-lb Impala out in any kind of hurry. Your 500 lb-ft of torque in an Olds of similar weight will be hard for him to keep up with.

 

Bushings will help with wheel hop. If you are upgrading the front shocks Calvert makes a reasonable priced shock that works well. They also have a decent rear shock. I would not use a drag radial, you will have better luck with a bias type. Check your drive shaft!

 

[/QUOTE]Check your drive shaft![/QUOTE]
Safety loop plus scattershield!

 

If you've never raced your car, you better go hit the test n tune and get some seat time. I would suggest leaving soft like a traffic light and quickly roll into the throttle. 3.42s aren't enough mechanical advantage to launch hard. You're just going to burn the clutch.

 

This ^^. Get the clutch fully engaged before you go sticking your boot in it. That 2.20 low is a bear to get rolling.

 

2.20x3.70 still ain't enough. Been there, done that, and smoked several clutches.

 

You can just about bet he will have "secrets" he isn't telling you. If you are getting wheel hop, something is different than stock. That car should smoke the tires, not dance on the pavement.
1. Leave the front sway bar on and connected. Use washers under the U shaped clamps to free up the front sway bar.
2. 90/10's will help weight transfer.
3. Pump up the air in the front tires to Max listed on the sidewall.
4. Get some Airlift air bags for the rear and have a separate hose to each one. Start with 5 PSI in the left, 8 PSI in the right.
5. Run a full tank of "race gas" and add 100 pounds of weight as far back in the trunk as you can get it. (Weight isn't your enemy, torque/HP/traction is). Try this street tires with and without the weight.
6. Then do burn outs to get a black mark the width of your rear tire. If its lighter in the middle, add air, do another burnout. If its dark in the middle and lighter at the edges let out a couple PSI, do another burn out.
7. Set total timing at about 34 degrees with all the centrifigal advance in. Use light springs and counter weights in the distributor so that advance is all in at about 2,000-2,500 RPM's. Plug the hose to the vacuum advance.
8. Back off the Secondary Air Valve spring 1/8 of a turn at a time til you get BOG......then turn it back 1/8 turn.
9. Use a NEW set of spark plugs for racing.

This is the very good advice !!!!! Learn to stage by just turning on the "Staged light".
Good luck.

 

So true, and make sure it’s in 1st gear!!!! 😁

 

 

Print out the list and check them off as you prepare the car. Are you racing on 1/8 or 1/4 drag strip ?

 

1/4 mile, bradenton motor sports track

 

Have you EVER been down the strip?
If not, you'll probably be just as big of a problem as your car.

I think your best bet is to go by yourself on a test and tune day and play around.
Best a base line for your car as is. See what it needs. Play with the timing, air pressure, launch RPM's.
Drag radials are a good bet.

You DO NOT want to bet the house against a seasoned racer when it's your first trip down the strip.
-peter

 

"You DO NOT want to bet the house against a seasoned racer when it's your first trip down the strip"

Now.........thats some good advice

 

You might want to look into a set of Headers and a Robmac fuel pump.
I would also recommend a rev limiter.
There are large gains in driving skill like the veteran drag racers have pointed out.

 

Yes, been down the strip many many times, automatic car running consistent 12.5. drag radials, converter, header car..Power brake to 2800, leave on the yellow light, worked great with that car..Street raced 4 speeds a long while back. As stated in my original post I plan to do a few test and tune nights at the strip to get a baseline of how the car reacts, get some launch time etc. no money involved it’s just two friends.

 

What are you thinking your friends car runs at the track? The only reason I've commented on this thread is because I also own a machine shop, and also own a NA 327 powered C-10 shop truck which happens to run high 11s, just considering the possibilities.

 

Here is the thing, he just bought a 65 impala car, no engine, they had pulled a 350hp 327 out of a customers 67 vette and installed a 427 for the customer. The engine is stock, he has the heads off so I saw it had the stock hump pistons, looks like its got some mileage as there is a decent ridge on cylinders. Now he is telling me he is just replacing the head gaskets andI stalling it as is..my other buddy works for him and is my mole, letting me know if thats all he does as Steve is known to cheat anyway to win..lol. I am not discounting that small block as they are very strong motors, especially the 350 factory horse engine. Obviously his car isn’t ready to go yet so I got time. Not going to spend a ton of money to try to win..just going to do the basics along with the one list of things to do that was posted. Not buying traction bars, headers etc as I don’t wantto alter my car really. I figure if he leaves that engine alone, not pulling internal shenanigans and both being 4 speed cars it should be a fun little run or two or three..I-am sure we will do best of 3.. most important thing for me is a solid launch, not bogging out or spinning etc. we shall see..should be fun either way

 

Don't let the cubic inch fool you on that little 327... I have seen many 327s run low 12's with minimal medications.

 

I have never saw any 327 run low12’s with headers only, even LT1 350..Only way is if you have it in a 1600 lb roadster

 

You've got a few things in your corner: his car is a tank, 327s need to rev to make power, and Muncies don't like to shift at high rpm

 

Despite the size, the weight of the cars will probably be pretty close, so I would not bank on that as a deciding factor. In fact, the factory curb weight ratings actually put a 65 2 door hardtop 327 4 speed impala about 100 lbs lighter than a 70 w30 442. Remember that the olds 455 is a monster (weight wise) compared to a SBC. Really it comes down to the options on each car.

 

Andy has a Muncie too.

 

We bought a stock 327 out of a news paper and put new rings, bearings, isky cam, headers, single plane manifold, and 488s. No other modifications! We lapped the valves ourselves! We put this in a 68 camaro and it ran 12.20s all day. So, don’t let the cui fool you.

 

I think you better find out what rear gear he has.

the only way he’s gonna beat you is with a bunch of gear..or you have real problems .

He’ll have way more problems getting that barge to leave better than you unless he has some steep gears.

you better find out from your mole 😎

 

I ran high high 12s-13.0 2.1 60 foots, with a 3.08 open rear in my 4100 pound at the time NA 327 shop truck. The nice thing about Bradenton is its a fast track. The OP needs a set of drag radials or slicks, I raced on street radials last night and when they start spinning the time it takes for them to recover you lost the race. My plan was to drive out of the whole and roll into it in 1 st gear, which worked, BUT on the 1st to 2nd gear change it blew the tires off, then your done. From what the OP describes here I wouldn't worry, I'd bolts some slicks on there and go for it.

 

So, do I, but we'll be shifting at 55-5800, not 8500-9000

 

Good! Glad you’ve been down the track.
Didn’t mean to sound insulting, but now you know how important seat time is with a new car.

One thing to think about is how much gas you show up with at the track…and how little you can have in the tank without suffering from fuel slosh.
14 gallons of gas is 100lbs. 100lbs could be worth a tenth.

Good luck!!!
-peter

 

I would run hi octane pump gas over race gas as long as you don't run into detonation or pre ignition. Race gas is only faster if your engine has high enough compression to require such fuel.
There is a lot of et in tuning and simple modifications like not running the factory air cleaner. An aftermarket ignition box is a good investment and can be easily hidden. Indexing a fresh set of correct heat range plugs can net et. Good Luck and looking forward to hearing about your track visits.