Turbobuick

Hello
I am a new member and possibly will once again be an Olds guy soon lol!

I found a 72 HO hardtop with sunroof I am looking to buy. The car needs a full resto but appears to be pretty solid and mostly complete. I am going to look at it this weekend and it appears to be a 60k mile car with the original motor trans and rearend. The guy could not confirm it is the original motor but said the trans definitely is and the motor has the correct Ga heads. I know how to check the block VIN and where it is located along with the trans tag but would like to know if there is anything else important to check. It has the dual gate, original exhaust the hood and original air cleaner are present in the pics I saw. I verified the cowl tag with a W45 and the VIN indicates it is a U code 455. Someone removed the half roof and it may be missing the trim for the top which could be hard to find. He also said he does have the grilles but they are not usable but I am pretty sure they can be sourced aftermarket..

The car has one negative which I could use some advise with. The car has a clean title and shows the original VIN. The VIN plate however is a state of Georgia issued vin plate.that shows the original VIN which does match the title 3J57U2M....... My question is I feel I am getting a decent price on the car but it does need a full resto which I am prepared to do. If I spend the time and money to restore this vehicle and it is a numbers matching original 60k mile HO how much will the re-issued VIN plate affect the value? I am buying the car to restore it because I have always wanted a 72 HO not for re-sale but I dont want to put a ton of money in a car that gets hurt in value due to the stupid VIN plate. The guy who owns the car has owned it since 1989 and planned to restore it but never did.

My first car was a 1972 CS in 1986 and I loved that car. I owned several Olds since and restored a 1971 convertible in the early 90s that I built a really nice 455 for but ended up selling the car while i was in grad school in Chicago. I also got into Buick Grand Nationals and really never went back to Oldsmobile's. I still have several Buick but have been wanting a A-body BB car for awhile now. This one checks all the boxes for me except for the VIN plate.

Thanks
Chris

joe_padavano

A state-issued VIN tag means that the car has been either stolen or rebuilt at some point in it's life. That will definitely reduce the value of such a car, even when fully restored. If you want it and don't care about value, it's probably all legal, but the car will never be worth more than a fraction of the value of similar 72 H/Os with that state-issued VIN tag.

CRUZN 66

Welcome to the group... I would be concerned with the state issued VIN, but as Joe said, it could all be legal... Good luck with your 72 H/O search...

no1oldsfan

Are there any records that would show why the change in vin?

oldcutlass

Contact your DMV and see what the criteria is for a state issued vin# and if there are any records as to why.

joe_padavano

The typical reasons for a state-issued VIN tag are a theft recovery where the original VIN tag was altered or a fabricated vehicle assembled from several wrecked cars. It's also possible that ownership records were messed up due to a lien sale or abandoned car process. In any case, while I'm sure the tag is legal, the value of the car will be significantly diminished.

4+4+2=10

State issued VINs are out there and they are legal as proven by the title issued with the same VIN. In reality, this isn't a big deal, but it does prove that at some point in the car's existence the car went through a tough time by no fault of it's own. Buyer's will use this as a hammer to get a better price from a seller. It is hard to put a dollar amount on the discount because we really don't have any sales data to validate a percentage but I'd guess 25% wouldn't be far off the mark. I've owned a truck with a rebuilt title, it was a dang good truck that provided over a 150k miles of service. I paid less and yes I sold for less, but I would do it again without question.

If you can get past the stigma of the state issued paperwork/Vin tag you will be fine. Just keep in mind your endgame. Sellers of properly restored cars rarely get a full return on their investment anyway.

tc

joe_padavano

Legally it isn't a big deal. For a collectable car like a 1972 H/O, it is a VERY big deal as far as value. Without the original VIN tag, you can never prove the car is real. Value will be a tiny fraction of normal.

4+4+2=10

School me Joe, what in the 72 VIN "proves" an H/O ?

joe_padavano

Obviously, nothing in the VIN is unique to a 72 H/O (unless it starts out 3J57X2M... ), but without the original VIN, you can't ever prove that the car came with a "U" code L75 motor and TH400. Heck, you can't even prove that it came from Lansing. Sorry, without the original VIN, it will be a MAJOR hit to value.

4+4+2=10

Thanks, didn't think the VIN would prove an H/O but it can disprove one. Doesn't the Trim tag have a W45 or W46 identifier on an H/O? Trim tags typically are left intact on State issued VIN cases.

joe_padavano

Trim tags are not legally controlled and can be swapped or switched with no legal implications.

4+4+2=10

Yeah, This type of fraud is a problem for the entire Hobby (even Lansing built U code Supremes with a real VIN tag), not just cases like this one. Some states like Oklahoma are bringing the Trim Tag into their anti tampering legislation. Intent to commit fraud also counts in this aspect as well.