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So, I'm banging away at work, and my frequent hi-jinks co-conspirator motions me over and says, hey, don't bid against me on what I want, but there's one of those Hurst Olds cars you like on this auction this weekend. I look it up, it's a 69 H/O
"Item Description: Translate description
Color: Cameo White/Firefrost Gold, VIN: 344879M406304 One of 906 produced in 1969, frame nut & bolt rotisserie restoration, 455/380 HP Olds Rocket V-8, original D-heads, 4-barrel carburetor, Hurst Olds air cleaner, turbo 400 auto tranny, H/O 455 hood scoop, New black interior, bucket seats w/ gold striped head rest, Hurst dual gate shifter, Air conditioning, Am radio, Rear wing, Hurst Wheels, Goodyear white letter tires"
79,xxx miles. PDF attached for posterity of the ad.
So, I'm like, I don't need another car, but I'll drive down there and look it over. I get there, it's under a big top queued up with other cars, mostly corvettes and other chevies to be sold. I pull the passenger door and my first thought is why is the driver's door handle in the passenger seat. Look it over, low option but has AC car. Go to drivers side, check lock ferrule, comes off in my hand. Put it back, see it has non sport wheel and idiot lights. About this time I am realizing this thing is a medium condition 3 car and the online bids are getting there.
Determined it was fake pretty quickly once under the hood. Flag this vin as a clone.
Something smells here. Even not counting the VIN numbers appearing really odd.
The VIN puts it in the last 50 cars built (if it even IS an H/O) but the cowl tag has a build week of 4B, 2nd week of April and NOT built at Lansing. It was built at Fremont, CA plant, as noted by the BF for build plant and those weird numbers following the build week numbers that for some reason only Fremont used and know what they mean. And another tell- the 34487 designator may be correct for a Fremont, car, but Lansing cars got 33687.
For reference, my car is 336462 VIN and was built 3D.
Body tag does have all the "right" RPO's on it. 930 black buckets, bright drip rail moldings, and it's white all over. An interesting note as well, it's a rare sight to see a white with black interiored 442 running around in the wild as it is if that body tag is for real. It's not like white/black was a very popular 442 color combo, unless it was going to be converted to an H/O.
Another comparison, a very well documented H/O from the day it was purchased, with a build week of 5D, HPR car #551 (not the Demmer conversion number- this was the owner's dash plaque #), VIN 399667 has body tag # 399838.
Although the straight bar steering wheel and idiot lights were standard on an H/O, like you say, the numbers under the hood and at the base of the windshield aren't adding up. My suspicion is that the car was built as a white 442 hard top with black interior, and someone just tried to make themselves an H/O out of it. I'm also betting the OH transmission isn't an OH transmission. Or the rear end isn't the right code either.
At best? Decent clone. If it was advertised as such I'd have no issues with it. Not a SHRED of paperwork to prove authenticity, but none needed, since that would likely be fake as well. I just wonder if the VIN used was an actual H/O VIN.
Your knowledge is most appreciated. I am not a 69 expert. I think it was a deliberate reconstruction, where the guy knew about date ranges, vins, option codes, and paint colors (and I think the 50's got re stamped), but didn't know about the plant codes. It's fortunate that the cowl from the original car didn't come along, if there was an original car.
It sold for 46k, which is more than I paid for a restored matching 72 H/O.
Man I hate scammers. Now it gets passed on to some unknowledgeable fool. Come on people. Do your research. Hell ANY research. Wasn't even Lansing built you dumbass. Now this car will get passed down and down. Seller smiling like a lottery winner. Stupid is as stupid does.
The VIN tag looks like it got sent through one of those aluminum tag stamper deals. Except there was no alignment of the letters. Looks hand-made. I.E., illegal.
The VIN tag looks like it got sent through one of those aluminum tag stamper deals. Except there was no alignment of the letters. Looks hand-made. I.E., illegal.
I thought the exact same thing. Then there is the body tag. Looks like someone used paint able caulking.
So many sketchy things going on. Some genius paid 46k for a reworked whatever. Fools.
Last edited by no1oldsfan; Jun 27, 2021 at 11:59 AM.
I do submit it seems like a Fremont 69 442. But looking at the body tag again more closely, I don't think it was Cameo white to begin with. I agree it does look like a restamp on the 50 50.
Regardless, it does pay to do your due diligence in homework if you're buying something like this. They say a fool and his money are soon parted. I hope the purchaser is OK with this car not being what it's represented to be.
I feel for the folks that buy their dream car not knowing enough about it. When I first started looking for a Cutlass 8 years ago i would have never known if I was looking at a clone. After working on mine the past few years I have learned a lot and would have a good idea what I was looking at but not back then. It will be quite the disappointment when the find out the truth. Who knows maybe ignorance ie bliss after all.
