the future of our hobby.
July 15th, 2017, 06:30 AM
#1
the future of our hobby.
This is not a repair related thread first of all I am stating a issue we all need to address. I received a phone call back from a true pioneer in the Chicago area Mr Bill wildt of Motor Sports unlimited. Mr wildt explained the changes that have come from track closures and no attention to motorsports in the news. I agree with mr wildt that in time this can have major ramifications to our hobby ,parts places to go etc and of course our future. We as a group have to keep the movement going forward and look at all positive angles to do this. We have to frequent tracks more often and spread the word period among younger people and keep there and our interests alive in our hobby. there are too many outlets nowadays for our time and entertainment dollar,so I want to end this on a positive note lets get back to the heart and soul of our rides and secure our future it is our responsibility and up to us as a group to make sure we all do our part to keep it going. Here is his website msutv.com or motorsports unlimited on the web He is our pioneer and a man we should all respect. jfb
July 15th, 2017, 08:51 AM
#2
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,574
This is not a repair related thread first of all I am stating a issue we all need to address. I received a phone call back from a true pioneer in the Chicago area Mr Bill wildt of Motor Sports unlimited. Mr wildt explained the changes that have come from track closures and no attention to motorsports in the news. I agree with mr wildt that in time this can have major ramifications to our hobby ,parts places to go etc and of course our future. We as a group have to keep the movement going forward and look at all positive angles to do this. We have to frequent tracks more often and spread the word period among younger people and keep there and our interests alive in our hobby. there are too many outlets nowadays for our time and entertainment dollar,so I want to end this on a positive note lets get back to the heart and soul of our rides and secure our future it is our responsibility and up to us as a group to make sure we all do our part to keep it going. Here is his website msutv.com or motorsports unlimited on the web He is our pioneer and a man we should all respect. jfb
July 15th, 2017, 09:01 AM
#3
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,574
Why are the high performance /race car threads that are in the major project thread posted there instead of in the race Forum. Gee i guess a thread catagory could have been made but no interest. Back to the regular way of doing things. OPPS i jumped on a soap box again.
July 15th, 2017, 12:01 PM
#4
The hobby is alive and well. NHRA sucks and has pushed the sportsman out pretty much. Im actually going to byron to watch the meltdown drags. 530 registered cars to run and show !!!! 4 day even people coming from all over the country and canada etc. Its a grassroots sport. Lucky for me the local tracks are cemented in. Byron dragway brings in a lot of money to local communities and they are all supportive .
Go to an RSD even at the grove / The sport is alive and well. last year we when to the groves midnight mayhem YOU wanna talk about packing the house. The place looked like woodstock. Then the drag week came through all 3 tracks cordova / byron / GLD. Record crowds showed up.
Go to an RSD even at the grove / The sport is alive and well. last year we when to the groves midnight mayhem YOU wanna talk about packing the house. The place looked like woodstock. Then the drag week came through all 3 tracks cordova / byron / GLD. Record crowds showed up.
July 15th, 2017, 01:14 PM
#5
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: KANSAS CITY, KS
Posts: 2,030
yeah..its alive and well...ya just have to travel a little bit more than in the past...
any big race is streamed live on the net etc..and there can be 20k people watching online..
anything in the south east has been bringing record crows etc..
any big race is streamed live on the net etc..and there can be 20k people watching online..
anything in the south east has been bringing record crows etc..
July 15th, 2017, 01:32 PM
#6
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Braceville, Ohio
Posts: 1,972
There are so many reasons not just the car hobby but all hobby (interest) are declining. I just read about Harley sales decline. They showed graphs of age of buyers and basically younger adults aren't into motorcycles for many reasons. The same can be said in the car/racing hobbies. Lack of disposable income IMO is one of the factors. Plus the young people are into phones, media, and yada yada. Some like me, I like drag racing plus driving and having older cars. Drag racing use to be a social event when I was younger but at 67 nobody I know is into racing anymore due to death or left the car hobby. I really don't like going by myself so I don't. Racing is a $100 bill, more if something goes wrong. Last night, we took my Grandkids to a Drive Inn theater. The opening was a piece about how there use to be over 4,000 drive inn theaters, now just over 300. How selling food is keeping them going. So, it's just not "whatever your hobby" is, it's all venue's that costs money and time. Jmo.
Last edited by Kennybill; July 15th, 2017 at 01:47 PM.
July 15th, 2017, 09:03 PM
#7
same but different
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Central Missouri
Posts: 2,861
Every american past time has to keep up with the changes like many other industries. The modern profile seems to always include a www social experience. And everyone of them has to keep the youth interested.
The movies, music, all the ball sports and racing are trying hard to keep that currency flowing. I don't see it dyeing any time soon, just changing. I see the challenge as keeping it affordable if you want to see it in person.
Its real easy to watch a game,race or concert at home on our wonderful full screens with bathrooms and munchies only a few feet a way.
It doesn't replace the real thing. You can't feel the rumble or smell the smoke unless you are in person. I hope that never changes.
The movies, music, all the ball sports and racing are trying hard to keep that currency flowing. I don't see it dyeing any time soon, just changing. I see the challenge as keeping it affordable if you want to see it in person.
Its real easy to watch a game,race or concert at home on our wonderful full screens with bathrooms and munchies only a few feet a way.
It doesn't replace the real thing. You can't feel the rumble or smell the smoke unless you are in person. I hope that never changes.
July 16th, 2017, 02:20 AM
#8
'87 Delta 88 Royale
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Margate, England
Posts: 2,513
It seems to me that the upcoming generations want instant gratification. And will settle for virtual satisfaction rather than go through the tedious process of travelling to a show/race meeting/ball game or whatever.
Drag racing in particular I think is so much better at the track rather than watching it on tv. On the other hand I am following the Tour de France bicycle race, being there means you will only see a tiny bit of the action, on tv you see all the action.
Roger.
Drag racing in particular I think is so much better at the track rather than watching it on tv. On the other hand I am following the Tour de France bicycle race, being there means you will only see a tiny bit of the action, on tv you see all the action.
Roger.
July 18th, 2017, 08:06 AM
#9
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Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Nassau County, NY
Posts: 1,019
[QUOTE=rustyroger;1030262]It seems to me that the upcoming generations want instant gratification. And will settle for virtual satisfaction rather than go through the tedious process of travelling to a show/race meeting/ball game or whatever.
It requires them to actually get up and do something.
It requires them to actually get up and do something.
July 18th, 2017, 11:19 AM
#10
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
This hobby, The members are the problem.. For decades it's been this way..
And I'm sure it was the same before I started going to events..
In the 80's if it wasn't a rod with billet everything it was shunned, muscle cars needed to be painted with great paint job and better than factory fit.
Street/strip cars needed to be pro engineered.. The newbie That home built his car with the skill and tools he had was again shunned, god help you if you rolled in with a primered work in progress.
The next group that was into cars but drive imports, Were shunned and pushed away.
The #'s match everything correct down to chalk marks crowd hate the hot rodders, and the chrome it show car crowd hate both.
The shows play 50's music and /or classic rock, rockabilly That be great if anyone born after 75 never showed up..
Then the old guard mock the younger crowd car, their threads, their music.
And wonder why the younger crowd doesn't want to be part of the hobby..
Some of this has slowly changed, as more events are more driving and less lawn chair, and the pantina fad and rat rods..
But you can go to any car based forum and any car based facebook group and read post of crapping on the younger car guys, They read this stuff, and steer clear of it.. Why spend time, money, sweat on a hobby only to go to an event and get mocked..
Then The older guys expect the younger crowd to respect them and can't understand why they don't..
I'm 47 now.. And I still see this at events..
I don't dress like my dad, nor is my music like his, or choice of cars, nor was any of his the same as his dads.. yet in the car hobby, the boomers expected everyone to follow their lead, or get mocked.
I'll give more prop's to the kid with limited tools and still learning that has not picture perfect welds, odd part placement, and different taste in cars than I, than the guy my age that is crapping on the kids, and forgot their first cars where not show winners..
This hobby needs one thing, The generation gap, differences to be left at the front gate,and when posting on car forums and facebook pages.. If this does not start to happen, The hobby will keep contracting..
A lowered import does nothing for me, but I'm sure my mid 80's car does nothing for them. or the hot rod..
But they belong as much as the rods, the muscle cars , the 80's cars and the new breed muscle, and everything else..
I has a T/A as a teen, and it was a cop magnet but police were more willing to rant at you and give a warning, Today no flipping way I'd drive a fast looking car if I was a teen or 20's. It look like the family car most drive now.. a boring bland colored box on 4 wheels.. Even if I was a teen/20's and could afford a muscle car or pony car , I'd not be driving one.. And that is sad that the bias of police officers automaticly see a worked over car and think speeder , street racing , and the zero tolerance stance today..
And I'm sure it was the same before I started going to events..
In the 80's if it wasn't a rod with billet everything it was shunned, muscle cars needed to be painted with great paint job and better than factory fit.
Street/strip cars needed to be pro engineered.. The newbie That home built his car with the skill and tools he had was again shunned, god help you if you rolled in with a primered work in progress.
The next group that was into cars but drive imports, Were shunned and pushed away.
The #'s match everything correct down to chalk marks crowd hate the hot rodders, and the chrome it show car crowd hate both.
The shows play 50's music and /or classic rock, rockabilly That be great if anyone born after 75 never showed up..
Then the old guard mock the younger crowd car, their threads, their music.
And wonder why the younger crowd doesn't want to be part of the hobby..
Some of this has slowly changed, as more events are more driving and less lawn chair, and the pantina fad and rat rods..
But you can go to any car based forum and any car based facebook group and read post of crapping on the younger car guys, They read this stuff, and steer clear of it.. Why spend time, money, sweat on a hobby only to go to an event and get mocked..
Then The older guys expect the younger crowd to respect them and can't understand why they don't..
I'm 47 now.. And I still see this at events..
I don't dress like my dad, nor is my music like his, or choice of cars, nor was any of his the same as his dads.. yet in the car hobby, the boomers expected everyone to follow their lead, or get mocked.
I'll give more prop's to the kid with limited tools and still learning that has not picture perfect welds, odd part placement, and different taste in cars than I, than the guy my age that is crapping on the kids, and forgot their first cars where not show winners..
This hobby needs one thing, The generation gap, differences to be left at the front gate,and when posting on car forums and facebook pages.. If this does not start to happen, The hobby will keep contracting..
A lowered import does nothing for me, but I'm sure my mid 80's car does nothing for them. or the hot rod..
But they belong as much as the rods, the muscle cars , the 80's cars and the new breed muscle, and everything else..
I has a T/A as a teen, and it was a cop magnet but police were more willing to rant at you and give a warning, Today no flipping way I'd drive a fast looking car if I was a teen or 20's. It look like the family car most drive now.. a boring bland colored box on 4 wheels.. Even if I was a teen/20's and could afford a muscle car or pony car , I'd not be driving one.. And that is sad that the bias of police officers automaticly see a worked over car and think speeder , street racing , and the zero tolerance stance today..
July 19th, 2017, 07:34 PM
#11
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: northwest indiana, near gary
Posts: 130
midnightleadfoot hit it on the head for me. im a 21 year old car guy and i see all this go down. im an oddball bc most of the guys my age i know aren't into delta 88's and drive tuners. the old guys hate my car cause its a not so perfect black mid 80's delta coupe on gangsta spokes. the police think im a wanna be thug or something and stop me for anything they can( i do live in gary indiana)
the car game is weird out here yo
the car game is weird out here yo
July 20th, 2017, 05:16 AM
#12
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,561
This hobby, The members are the problem.. For decades it's been this way..
And I'm sure it was the same before I started going to events..
In the 80's if it wasn't a rod with billet everything it was shunned, muscle cars needed to be painted with great paint job and better than factory fit.
Street/strip cars needed to be pro engineered.. The newbie That home built his car with the skill and tools he had was again shunned, god help you if you rolled in with a primered work in progress.
There are 2 types of car shows, one as you describe (usually a National/Regional event) where top notch cars are judged and the local style shows where anything goes.
The next group that was into cars but drive imports, Were shunned and pushed away.
I can see the indifference to this part of the hobby as the hobby was basically an American car based thing. Look back to when Toyota wanted to participate in Nascar.
The #'s match everything correct down to chalk marks crowd hate the hot rodders, and the chrome it show car crowd hate both.
This is not new and has been going on for decades, it will not change.
The hobby needs both.
The shows play 50's music and /or classic rock, rockabilly That be great if anyone born after 75 never showed up..
This is a majority rules sort of thing. Are you there for the music or the cars?
Then the old guard mock the younger crowd car, their threads, their music.
And wonder why the younger crowd doesn't want to be part of the hobby..
Are we mocking or corrective criticizing? Some younger people have very thin skin and any critique is taken as condemnation. This hobby evolved /grew through indifference and by following the road less traveled. New ideas take a while to be accepted.
Some of this has slowly changed, as more events are more driving and less lawn chair, and the pantina fad and rat rods..
Again this is a choice to which type of event you prefer to attend.
But you can go to any car based forum and any car based facebook group and read post of crapping on the younger car guys, They read this stuff, and steer clear of it.. Why spend time, money, sweat on a hobby only to go to an event and get mocked.
If you are trying to be a round peg in a square hole, your trying to participate in the wrong forum. I've found this site to be one of the most tolerant where members have really stepped up to help the younger crowd ranging from supplying advice, free parts, to even providing cash to people. We have a fair mix of purists, hot rodders, racers, and the run the gamut in between.
There will always be a difference in opinion. Again are you spending your money to build a car for other people or building it for you?
Then The older guys expect the younger crowd to respect them and can't understand why they don't..
Respect goes both ways.
I'm 47 now.. And I still see this at events..
I don't dress like my dad, nor is my music like his, or choice of cars, nor was any of his the same as his dads.. yet in the car hobby, the boomers expected everyone to follow their lead, or get mocked.
If anything we boomers understand this statement better than any other group. I find that we don't mock but steer away from elements of which do not fit our tastes.
I'll give more prop's to the kid with limited tools and still learning that has not picture perfect welds, odd part placement, and different taste in cars than I, than the guy my age that is crapping on the kids, and forgot their first cars where not show winners..
This again boils down to who are you building your car for, who cares what others think as long as you like it. Do you think this situation is limited to just the young? I assure you many older people build cars that other older and young people don't like.
This hobby needs one thing, The generation gap, differences to be left at the front gate,and when posting on car forums and facebook pages.. If this does not start to happen, The hobby will keep contracting..
If you read through your entire post, you'll find that you and the younger people are just as intolerant as the older people in car style, dress, music, etc... Car shows will eventually move towards the likes of the majority, currently the majority are boomers.
A lowered import does nothing for me, but I'm sure my mid 80's car does nothing for them. or the hot rod..
But they belong as much as the rods, the muscle cars , the 80's cars and the new breed muscle, and everything else..
Again, who are you building your car for?
I has a T/A as a teen, and it was a cop magnet but police were more willing to rant at you and give a warning, Today no flipping way I'd drive a fast looking car if I was a teen or 20's. It look like the family car most drive now.. a boring bland colored box on 4 wheels.. Even if I was a teen/20's and could afford a muscle car or pony car , I'd not be driving one.. And that is sad that the bias of police officers automaticly see a worked over car and think speeder , street racing , and the zero tolerance stance today..
This is nothing new, we had the same issues as young people. However, this is not how the majority of police act.
And I'm sure it was the same before I started going to events..
In the 80's if it wasn't a rod with billet everything it was shunned, muscle cars needed to be painted with great paint job and better than factory fit.
Street/strip cars needed to be pro engineered.. The newbie That home built his car with the skill and tools he had was again shunned, god help you if you rolled in with a primered work in progress.
There are 2 types of car shows, one as you describe (usually a National/Regional event) where top notch cars are judged and the local style shows where anything goes.
The next group that was into cars but drive imports, Were shunned and pushed away.
I can see the indifference to this part of the hobby as the hobby was basically an American car based thing. Look back to when Toyota wanted to participate in Nascar.
The #'s match everything correct down to chalk marks crowd hate the hot rodders, and the chrome it show car crowd hate both.
This is not new and has been going on for decades, it will not change.
The hobby needs both.
The shows play 50's music and /or classic rock, rockabilly That be great if anyone born after 75 never showed up..
This is a majority rules sort of thing. Are you there for the music or the cars?
Then the old guard mock the younger crowd car, their threads, their music.
And wonder why the younger crowd doesn't want to be part of the hobby..
Are we mocking or corrective criticizing? Some younger people have very thin skin and any critique is taken as condemnation. This hobby evolved /grew through indifference and by following the road less traveled. New ideas take a while to be accepted.
Some of this has slowly changed, as more events are more driving and less lawn chair, and the pantina fad and rat rods..
Again this is a choice to which type of event you prefer to attend.
But you can go to any car based forum and any car based facebook group and read post of crapping on the younger car guys, They read this stuff, and steer clear of it.. Why spend time, money, sweat on a hobby only to go to an event and get mocked.
If you are trying to be a round peg in a square hole, your trying to participate in the wrong forum. I've found this site to be one of the most tolerant where members have really stepped up to help the younger crowd ranging from supplying advice, free parts, to even providing cash to people. We have a fair mix of purists, hot rodders, racers, and the run the gamut in between.
There will always be a difference in opinion. Again are you spending your money to build a car for other people or building it for you?
Then The older guys expect the younger crowd to respect them and can't understand why they don't..
Respect goes both ways.
I'm 47 now.. And I still see this at events..
I don't dress like my dad, nor is my music like his, or choice of cars, nor was any of his the same as his dads.. yet in the car hobby, the boomers expected everyone to follow their lead, or get mocked.
If anything we boomers understand this statement better than any other group. I find that we don't mock but steer away from elements of which do not fit our tastes.
I'll give more prop's to the kid with limited tools and still learning that has not picture perfect welds, odd part placement, and different taste in cars than I, than the guy my age that is crapping on the kids, and forgot their first cars where not show winners..
This again boils down to who are you building your car for, who cares what others think as long as you like it. Do you think this situation is limited to just the young? I assure you many older people build cars that other older and young people don't like.
This hobby needs one thing, The generation gap, differences to be left at the front gate,and when posting on car forums and facebook pages.. If this does not start to happen, The hobby will keep contracting..
If you read through your entire post, you'll find that you and the younger people are just as intolerant as the older people in car style, dress, music, etc... Car shows will eventually move towards the likes of the majority, currently the majority are boomers.
A lowered import does nothing for me, but I'm sure my mid 80's car does nothing for them. or the hot rod..
But they belong as much as the rods, the muscle cars , the 80's cars and the new breed muscle, and everything else..
Again, who are you building your car for?
I has a T/A as a teen, and it was a cop magnet but police were more willing to rant at you and give a warning, Today no flipping way I'd drive a fast looking car if I was a teen or 20's. It look like the family car most drive now.. a boring bland colored box on 4 wheels.. Even if I was a teen/20's and could afford a muscle car or pony car , I'd not be driving one.. And that is sad that the bias of police officers automaticly see a worked over car and think speeder , street racing , and the zero tolerance stance today..
This is nothing new, we had the same issues as young people. However, this is not how the majority of police act.
July 20th, 2017, 05:55 AM
#13
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,574
The op posted about getting people to race tracks and how this hobby is dying. He wasn't referring anything about car shows. Funny how this thread went off track!LOL I think car shows are great i don't care what type of car is there i look at all of them. Sure i have my favorite ones but you have to be open minded enough that you may see the hard work,craftsmanship,and style.
July 20th, 2017, 06:30 AM
#14
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
Blowing off real issues in the hobby is why it is contracting,
But most don't care to look it in the eye, but they will comment on how no new blood . And wonder why..
I'm sure there is a Gorge Carlin line in there somewhere..
As seen as I'm not young.. And I see how anyone that doesn't follow the theme/style of vehicle as the older guys are treated.. it is an issue..
Sorry the guy or gal into cars or speed, isn't going to be buying and driving a 30-50 year old car.. as they only have ONE. it will be a newer one, something they can afford, Something that they can afford to insure.. For most it won't have the word Camaro/mustang/cutlass/ta/ect on the fender.. It'll be a cheap import fwd with the words Honda/kia/ hyndi/Toyota/ maybe if the stars aline, focus, or colbalt. Not many younger car people have 2400.00 for 6 month coverage of insurance for the more mainstream auto hobby nameplates..
There is a 2002 Camaro in my driveway that is parked there because The kid bought it after saving up for it, then found out it be 4800 a year to insure it.. So it sits, and he drives a 250k pos camry. and gets raped for only 2300 a year ..
national or local shows, don't matter. much of those in the hobby, Don't want the younger people there.. Sad really..
July 20th, 2017, 06:32 AM
#15
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
The op posted about getting people to race tracks and how this hobby is dying. He wasn't referring anything about car shows. Funny how this thread went off track!LOL I think car shows are great i don't care what type of car is there i look at all of them. Sure i have my favorite ones but you have to be open minded enough that you may see the hard work,craftsmanship,and style.
July 20th, 2017, 07:07 AM
#16
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,561
Blowing off real issues in the hobby is why it is contracting,
But most don't care to look it in the eye, but they will comment on how no new blood . And wonder why..
I'm sure there is a Gorge Carlin line in there somewhere..
As seen as I'm not young.. And I see how anyone that doesn't follow the theme/style of vehicle as the older guys are treated.. it is an issue..
Sorry the guy or gal into cars or speed, isn't going to be buying and driving a 30-50 year old car.. as they only have ONE. it will be a newer one, something they can afford, Something that they can afford to insure.. For most it won't have the word Camaro/mustang/cutlass/ta/ect on the fender.. It'll be a cheap import fwd with the words Honda/kia/ hyndi/Toyota/ maybe if the stars aline, focus, or colbalt. Not many younger car people have 2400.00 for 6 month coverage of insurance for the more mainstream auto hobby nameplates..
There is a 2002 Camaro in my driveway that is parked there because The kid bought it after saving up for it, then found out it be 4800 a year to insure it.. So it sits, and he drives a 250k pos camry. and gets raped for only 2300 a year ..
national or local shows, don't matter. much of those in the hobby, Don't want the younger people there.. Sad really..
But most don't care to look it in the eye, but they will comment on how no new blood . And wonder why..
I'm sure there is a Gorge Carlin line in there somewhere..
As seen as I'm not young.. And I see how anyone that doesn't follow the theme/style of vehicle as the older guys are treated.. it is an issue..
Sorry the guy or gal into cars or speed, isn't going to be buying and driving a 30-50 year old car.. as they only have ONE. it will be a newer one, something they can afford, Something that they can afford to insure.. For most it won't have the word Camaro/mustang/cutlass/ta/ect on the fender.. It'll be a cheap import fwd with the words Honda/kia/ hyndi/Toyota/ maybe if the stars aline, focus, or colbalt. Not many younger car people have 2400.00 for 6 month coverage of insurance for the more mainstream auto hobby nameplates..
There is a 2002 Camaro in my driveway that is parked there because The kid bought it after saving up for it, then found out it be 4800 a year to insure it.. So it sits, and he drives a 250k pos camry. and gets raped for only 2300 a year ..
national or local shows, don't matter. much of those in the hobby, Don't want the younger people there.. Sad really..
I have found that trying to insure a 2006 Mustang coupe is quite reasonable compared to its peers.
The reality is that we as young people had more choices in viable V8 powered cars than the young people today. I can only come up with a handful of cars from the late 70's to about the early 2000's that most would even consider playing with. So a 10-15 or even a 30 year old car today is not the most desirable start. Most of the Camaro's, Mustangs, pick your muscle, was a muscle car in name only with a mere 150-200 ground pounding HP. That is the difference between today and yesterday. The young people today still do what we all did and are still in 2 camps. The majority invest in a wheel and tire choice of their liking, bolt on things like spoilers carbon fiber, shiny dress up things, loud exhaust and obnoxious stereos, camp 1 all show and no go. Then there is camp2, the ones that experiment with NO2, super/turbo chargers, and other real performance mods and don't care what the car looks like because shiny paint does not make it go faster. Camp 3 is the group that will never be interested and a car is just for transportation. Do you really think times have changed that much?
July 20th, 2017, 07:18 AM
#17
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
^^^^ missed point.. as the cars they are forced to drive, the older guys mock..
When I was a teen, you could get a 15 y/o rear drive car that was a mirror image of that bad @$$ 442.. just it had a 2 barrel and a bench seat.. but the body lines where there..
This is not the case today, even tho, much of the 15 y/o vehicle they have to drive can keep up with the halo cars of my time.. heck many are faster than.. but not welcome at most car hobby event's..
Do you see the difference, or is it still going over thy head?
I'm out I made my opinion.. If I was king, there still be mid sized rear drive 2 door cars for cheap.. but sadly this isn't the case.. That ended 30 years ago when the last g body's got shipped to dealers.
When I was a teen, you could get a 15 y/o rear drive car that was a mirror image of that bad @$$ 442.. just it had a 2 barrel and a bench seat.. but the body lines where there..
This is not the case today, even tho, much of the 15 y/o vehicle they have to drive can keep up with the halo cars of my time.. heck many are faster than.. but not welcome at most car hobby event's..
Do you see the difference, or is it still going over thy head?
I'm out I made my opinion.. If I was king, there still be mid sized rear drive 2 door cars for cheap.. but sadly this isn't the case.. That ended 30 years ago when the last g body's got shipped to dealers.
July 20th, 2017, 07:27 AM
#18
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Ranch Ca.
Posts: 7,721
Well said Eric.The hobby will survive, just different, as a youth I went to shows and they featured brass radiatored cars and hot rods made out of brass radiatored cars with a few customs. I'm sure in the future we will see more hot rod ricers and custom import luxury cars and what ever is in vogue at the time.The general public still loves their cars, we as a nation have more cars than any other country, besides we like to play with them and show them off. There will be something for every one still,just different..... Tedd
July 20th, 2017, 07:35 PM
#19
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Nassau County, NY
Posts: 1,019
Midnight the whole thing went over my head. Kids don't drive 30 year old cars because they do not relate to them. Insurance companies have rapped everyone since the begining of time. It's a business and business doesn't survive in the red. Insurance is a necessary evil. To run modern day foreign cars into an american show is like a woman wearing red shoes with a purple dress. They have their clubs and fan base. What do they have in common with a classic car show unless they are driving a 240Z or 70's Toyota which I see at car shows. I have nothing against modern cars but they have nothing in common with classics. And they have no interest in my cars. No offense taken, it's what makes the world go around.
Delta I will admit I don't get the big tire thing but, as Eric said, it's your car and if you like it who cares what others think. As far as five-O goes, we all went through it. I had a red convertible Cutlass back then & I couldn't tell you how many times I was pacing traffic between 70 & 75 MPH (55 nationally back then) . Guess who got picked out for a ticket? Yep the long haired 20 something punk in the red vert with the Judas Priest cranking. Your car and age are going to draw attention. This is nothing new. Hell, I've been pulled out of a crowd with the one in the picture a few times because it looks fast. & I'm 49. It's the old analogy, "You want to be the bad boy, you're gonna get spanked".
Delta I will admit I don't get the big tire thing but, as Eric said, it's your car and if you like it who cares what others think. As far as five-O goes, we all went through it. I had a red convertible Cutlass back then & I couldn't tell you how many times I was pacing traffic between 70 & 75 MPH (55 nationally back then) . Guess who got picked out for a ticket? Yep the long haired 20 something punk in the red vert with the Judas Priest cranking. Your car and age are going to draw attention. This is nothing new. Hell, I've been pulled out of a crowd with the one in the picture a few times because it looks fast. & I'm 49. It's the old analogy, "You want to be the bad boy, you're gonna get spanked".
July 20th, 2017, 10:00 PM
#20
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
Since when has car shows been limited to American cars?
I'm not into imports, but come on, cut the bull, opals, holdens, pantara's, shall I go on.
or in olds case the 80's French econo box. They turn those " whe whe cars from france "away at an olds show?
Insurance had always been costly for new drivers, but nothing like now..
my 3 y/o t/a with me 18 was 1872.12 a year , in '88
same age driver same type car (Camaro) and it is 4800 a year.. That is quite a jump..
You are 49, So you know what it was like back when you were a teen 20's , cops wrote a lot of warnings, today nope, zero tolerance. Get the flashy car and be the ticket magnet or get the applance on wheels and hop that up, sleeper style..
When I had my light charcoal HHR I could drive 15 over with the flow of traffic and not a trooper would notice. Do the same thing in my cannary yellow (77 vette yellow) c-10 and the gumball machine will light up and take chase..
But at my age they tend not to try to find extra crap to ticket for when they do light you up..
The land of the free is not the same as it was on the roads anymore.. tolerance for fast cars is not there anymore in the hands of younger drivers.. They know it.. and Those that want to drive are not going to drive a "look at me, ticket me" to loose the ability to drive.. when the earth tone blob on wheels will go un-noticed by the po-po
I'm not into imports, but come on, cut the bull, opals, holdens, pantara's, shall I go on.
or in olds case the 80's French econo box. They turn those " whe whe cars from france "away at an olds show?
Insurance had always been costly for new drivers, but nothing like now..
my 3 y/o t/a with me 18 was 1872.12 a year , in '88
same age driver same type car (Camaro) and it is 4800 a year.. That is quite a jump..
You are 49, So you know what it was like back when you were a teen 20's , cops wrote a lot of warnings, today nope, zero tolerance. Get the flashy car and be the ticket magnet or get the applance on wheels and hop that up, sleeper style..
When I had my light charcoal HHR I could drive 15 over with the flow of traffic and not a trooper would notice. Do the same thing in my cannary yellow (77 vette yellow) c-10 and the gumball machine will light up and take chase..
But at my age they tend not to try to find extra crap to ticket for when they do light you up..
The land of the free is not the same as it was on the roads anymore.. tolerance for fast cars is not there anymore in the hands of younger drivers.. They know it.. and Those that want to drive are not going to drive a "look at me, ticket me" to loose the ability to drive.. when the earth tone blob on wheels will go un-noticed by the po-po
July 21st, 2017, 08:54 AM
#21
Beer Connoisseur
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Daly City, California
Posts: 2,090
Another problem is the attitude of old timers. Around here there are a lot of young guys that own classic cars, the problem is with people who can't accept the fact that younger crowd is not into your 14" wheels, hubcaps, drum brakes, points ignition and 100% original car. Not saying you have to like it, but show some respect to a fellow car enthusiast who is putting money and work into his car regardless of the way the car (or the owner) looks.
JMO
JMO
July 21st, 2017, 12:02 PM
#22
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,915
Another problem is the attitude of old timers. Around here there are a lot of young guys that own classic cars, the problem is with people who can't accept the fact that younger crowd is not into your 14" wheels, hubcaps, drum brakes, points ignition and 100% original car. Not saying you have to like it, but show some respect to a fellow car enthusiast who is putting money and work into his car regardless of the way the car (or the owner) looks.
JMO
JMO
July 21st, 2017, 01:41 PM
#24
Administrator
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Poteau, Ok
Posts: 40,561
Or one with a non-olds engine... Nobody is perfect and we've all been guilty of engaging our mouths before the brain is in gear. You are not going to change human nature. Again be proud of what you build or buy, the only person who needs to like it is you. These things you describe have been going on for decades, we have all been through it. Find people who have similar tastes.
Nobody is perfect and we've all been guilty of engaging our mouths before the brain is in gear. You are not going to change human nature. Again be proud of what you build or buy, the only person who needs to like it is you. These things you describe have been going on for decades, we have all been through it. Find people who have similar tastes.
July 21st, 2017, 07:39 PM
#26
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 3,574
Or one with a non-olds engine... Nobody is perfect and we've all been guilty of engaging our mouths before the brain is in gear. You are not going to change human nature. Again be proud of what you build or buy, the only person who needs to like it is you. These things you describe have been going on for decades, we have all been through it. Find people who have similar tastes.
Nobody is perfect and we've all been guilty of engaging our mouths before the brain is in gear. You are not going to change human nature. Again be proud of what you build or buy, the only person who needs to like it is you. These things you describe have been going on for decades, we have all been through it. Find people who have similar tastes.
July 22nd, 2017, 09:34 AM
#27
hey guys everything is a viable comment and worthy to everyone. I personally feel that all of us as a group need to work together and find a middle ground. the man in the Chicago area who has carried this burdern is mr bill wildlt or msutv.com he called me a while back. this is all of what I have been posting about we have to correct all of these areas for our hobby to thrive and survive. lets all stand up doing one part or another it comes together in the end for all of us. contact him or post on his facebook page it is our future. every thing that is corrected will fix the problem as a whole puzzle is put together.
July 22nd, 2017, 04:07 PM
#28
The hobby morphs. Its not going anywhere anytime soon. I dont do car shows. They are boring., most people at shows try to talk the talk but dont actually know the real facts. Im 28 and have tried to tell people real facts and they figure what do i know since im young. I have more fun hanging out with the race crowd i learn more and we all help each other out in an unspokenly clubish way. I was at the track on thu. And saw lots of younger guys my age racing newer camaros , imports. Damn fast too. The hobby isn't dying at all the old car stuff is dying off to an extent because not relateable for younger guys. Why buy an old car and spend 20k bringing it up to snuff then invest more to make it fast. You can buy a new mustang ad a few bolt ons a good tune and its a solid 11 sec. Runner with all the ammenities. For me i grew up around old cars and do body work for a living so its cheap for me to do the hobby but for most guys my age its not east or cheap. Maybe the hobby needs to die to make these cars affordable again.
July 23rd, 2017, 01:03 AM
#29
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
Different taste, it is a good thing.. If everyone only liked 1968-70 cars it be a might boring hobby..
July 23rd, 2017, 07:57 AM
#30
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Ranch Ca.
Posts: 7,721
I drive a ricer Miata, show it a few times a year for giggles. It is a social thing and I get to talk to a different group of people with different ideas and interests. I love the fifties and older stuff but for awhile in my youth I raced bug eye sprites and midgets so I get to do the reminisces thing, as you get older you will understand this more. You can't physically do what you use to do but you can pass on your knowledge to some one who can.
As far as car shows being boring if you don't interact well with people it can be slow three to five of sitting on a lawn chair waiting for a question or someone to show a special interest in your car . Luckily I was born a salesman and can find ways to interest me or educate people whether they know it or not( kids are the best candidates for this ), they are our future.
So in conclusion if I can go from the classic fifties to a ricer Miata there is hope for our hobby... But it will be different but fun... From old fart who hates change....Tedd
As far as car shows being boring if you don't interact well with people it can be slow three to five of sitting on a lawn chair waiting for a question or someone to show a special interest in your car . Luckily I was born a salesman and can find ways to interest me or educate people whether they know it or not( kids are the best candidates for this ), they are our future.
So in conclusion if I can go from the classic fifties to a ricer Miata there is hope for our hobby... But it will be different but fun... From old fart who hates change....Tedd
July 23rd, 2017, 10:05 AM
#31
ph_ckstick1
Join Date: May 2017
Posts: 450
I like the cruises more than the old school type show and shine.. As you can stay the whole time or get up and pull out and do whatever..
I've killed more good threads going to a cruise and ending up at a house helping pull heads or a transmission on a car someone was talking about at the cruise.. but hasn't been able to find time to work on..
I now pack garage rags to put on , just in case..
Or re-curve a timing curve right in the lot the cruise is at..
The show and shine has it's place, but I'd rather be cruisin'
I've killed more good threads going to a cruise and ending up at a house helping pull heads or a transmission on a car someone was talking about at the cruise.. but hasn't been able to find time to work on..
I now pack garage rags to put on , just in case..
Or re-curve a timing curve right in the lot the cruise is at..
The show and shine has it's place, but I'd rather be cruisin'
July 24th, 2017, 04:16 PM
#32
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Nassau County, NY
Posts: 1,019
Can't argue with you there Midnight. That's what it's all about. If I go to a show it's to check out cars not show mine off, although I do support my local chapter with the LI - NYC spring dust off. Last 2 shows I went to, I drove my Cutlass. One was Musclepalozza at West Lebanon Valley, NY about 180 miles one direction then back home that night. The other was Friday 60 miles away in Brewster, NY. I sort of make my own cruise and I'm good with that. Myself and a friend hit the shows & work on the cars together and are trying to get some neighborhood guys involved to get there stalled projects going again. So far not much success with the other guys. Some of the Boy Scout's we are assistant Scout Masters with want to get into the cars with us and earn the automotive merit badge. The kids seem to come and go, but they are always welcome to join in. We usually start them out with the sand blaster. Then step them up to turning wrenches.
I know there is a cruise that runs though the Green Mountains, in VT I'd like to get involved with but never seem to have the time.
I know there is a cruise that runs though the Green Mountains, in VT I'd like to get involved with but never seem to have the time.
July 26th, 2017, 10:39 AM
#33
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Poconos, Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,029
Might not matter if this occurs in US, with sure to follow laws to ban sale of gasoline so as to end operation of gas operated vehicles in the usual underhanded way without an outright ban on their use, stemming from the unrealistic average fleet MPG set by our so-called representatives, with the US EPA & DOT charged with implementing it by 2025.
Britain to ban sale of all diesel & petrol cars/vans from 2040:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ment-102689319
Britain to ban sale of all diesel & petrol cars/vans from 2040:
https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ment-102689319
Last edited by anthonyP; July 26th, 2017 at 10:41 AM.
July 26th, 2017, 05:11 PM
#34
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 135
Well as WR1970 said, this thread may be derailed a bit from the OP's original question, but I'd offer a counter point to at least the "future of our hobby" subject line based on my personal experience...
While it may be harder to find people with similar specialty cars (race/muscle/stock/modified/hoopdie-ified) who are local to you may be diminishing; social media (this site, other enthusiast sites, facebook groups, etc.) make it pretty easy to connect with tons of like-minded folks around the world; and also find groups of like-minded people that you may not happen to run across at the track or the local show-n-shine.
I've been exclusively a CO guy for several years now because I like the membership here, what they say, how they say it, and the advice they give.
But I recently bought a '60 Chrysler (fin era) coupe, and after joining one website (forwardlook.net) was subsequently invited to join several local facebook groups who do cruises and meets for either Mopar or "jet age cars 55-61", and after the lightbulb went off have found other groups for makes/interests that I like although I may not currently own or be involved in.
I've heard it said that people as they age and have a few extra bucks may go back to cars that they lusted after in high school (case in point - my GF gets excited about Honda CRX's and 90's Acuras ?!?) so of course the fan base for older cars dwindles over time.. but occasionally the torch does get passed down to the new generation, and they aren't all putting cars on air ride etc. etc.
I'm definitely in the camp of trying to appreciate what anyone is doing in the car hobby when they are spending whatever time, money, and skills they may have to be involved. Of course like most there are cars I just can't stomach so I may take a pass in engaging, but social media - for all it's other f'd-up issues - does allow us to connect like never before.
All just my opinion... great topic though, thanks.
Here is a pic of me and a couple daughters at a car show this weekend with the 'new' chrysler. They've been around my classic cars since they were born (many low-dollar basket cases), and too bad for them - I can already see they have an appreciation that will carry on whether they like it or not!
While it may be harder to find people with similar specialty cars (race/muscle/stock/modified/hoopdie-ified) who are local to you may be diminishing; social media (this site, other enthusiast sites, facebook groups, etc.) make it pretty easy to connect with tons of like-minded folks around the world; and also find groups of like-minded people that you may not happen to run across at the track or the local show-n-shine.
I've been exclusively a CO guy for several years now because I like the membership here, what they say, how they say it, and the advice they give.
But I recently bought a '60 Chrysler (fin era) coupe, and after joining one website (forwardlook.net) was subsequently invited to join several local facebook groups who do cruises and meets for either Mopar or "jet age cars 55-61", and after the lightbulb went off have found other groups for makes/interests that I like although I may not currently own or be involved in.
I've heard it said that people as they age and have a few extra bucks may go back to cars that they lusted after in high school (case in point - my GF gets excited about Honda CRX's and 90's Acuras ?!?) so of course the fan base for older cars dwindles over time.. but occasionally the torch does get passed down to the new generation, and they aren't all putting cars on air ride etc. etc.
I'm definitely in the camp of trying to appreciate what anyone is doing in the car hobby when they are spending whatever time, money, and skills they may have to be involved. Of course like most there are cars I just can't stomach so I may take a pass in engaging, but social media - for all it's other f'd-up issues - does allow us to connect like never before.
All just my opinion... great topic though, thanks.
Here is a pic of me and a couple daughters at a car show this weekend with the 'new' chrysler. They've been around my classic cars since they were born (many low-dollar basket cases), and too bad for them - I can already see they have an appreciation that will carry on whether they like it or not!
July 29th, 2017, 04:48 AM
#38
contact bill wildt @ msutv.com or watch motor sports unlimited on Comcast cable channel 19. I agree with all of you I also fly alone it leaves more time for my interests. I go to race tracks a couple times a year on weekends and vacations and never on week nights I work in a bodyshop and usually get off between 5 and 6 pm the usual time for shops plus driving time so there is little time there. I will go to car shows during the winter and occasionals during the summer. I drive my olds most anywhere. I have lived this hobby my entire life and we all need to participate at all levels we are at. I also read and wow it is staggering around 3000 nowadays for insurance holy s--t! I had five 0 problems also but never insurance that high. I also do not have crashes to my name either then or now there is a place and time for everything safely at the track. I like to cruise then do my thing at the track.
July 29th, 2017, 10:00 AM
#39
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: McMurray, PA
Posts: 1,781
Who in the heck do you guys insure through? The quoted prices are crazy!
I have eight vehicles - including two Corvettes, four 70-72 Oldsmobiles, and a vintage truck tractor - insured for under $2,000 a year. Only one is a daily driver ('05 Acura TL) and the rest are under a classic policy.
Those numbers sound insane, and I can imagine your discouragement if you're being hit with those premiums even with a good driving record.
I am selling several of my classics with an eye on getting a newer Scat Pack Shaker Challenger - guess I should investigate what Erie will charge me for that, although I was a lot younger when I bought my 1996 LT4 Corvette and they didn't beat me up very much on that at the time.
Terry
I have eight vehicles - including two Corvettes, four 70-72 Oldsmobiles, and a vintage truck tractor - insured for under $2,000 a year. Only one is a daily driver ('05 Acura TL) and the rest are under a classic policy.
Those numbers sound insane, and I can imagine your discouragement if you're being hit with those premiums even with a good driving record.
I am selling several of my classics with an eye on getting a newer Scat Pack Shaker Challenger - guess I should investigate what Erie will charge me for that, although I was a lot younger when I bought my 1996 LT4 Corvette and they didn't beat me up very much on that at the time.
Terry
Last edited by vette442; July 29th, 2017 at 10:02 AM.
July 30th, 2017, 04:28 AM
#40
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Nassau County, NY
Posts: 1,019
I guess that's why a majority of people that live in NY have PA or CT plates. Insurance is insane in Lower NY. I pay $3,800 for my commercial van. 11' Traverse and 06' Silverado combined aren't far behind in the mid 3's. The Cutlass is about 300. There's nobody watching them so they are free to rob us at will.
