I've been watching the 442's especially the convertibles, at Mecum today. So the last one of the day, a black with red stripes, black interior and top comes to the block. It jumps almost directly to $150k , stays there and sells at that price. It looked like a nice car but $150k for a non-W30 71? Anybody got any thoughts as to what hat was all about?

 

Money laundering?

 

I never thought of that, good call.

 

You kill me Brother and exactly. 150k. How loud can you yell sham. Sham shill whatever. Auction cars suck more and more.

Were red stripes even available in 71?

 

The Mecum website says "the bid goes on", meaning that it did not sell.

 

Nope. White, Black, Blue, Gold, or Green were the only options (again, except for the RPO codes for special paint)

 

1.The '71 convertible is a 4 speed air car. Rare 4 speed convertible with air. Really is a beautiful car
2. Also saw a '71 W-30 automatic with air? I was under the impression that air was not available in '70 W-30's? What did the car sell for?
3. I'm seeing more cars with tubular suspension. Why? Advantages and disadvantages?

 

The 1970-71 W-30s with automatic came with the same milder cam used in every other 442 with automatic in the same year. As a result, the AT motors did make enough vacuum for power brakes and A/C, and they were available with those motors. The MT motors got more radical cams and thus were not available with those options.

 

Money laundering??? How is is buying a car money laundering.......

 

How is buying a car money laundering?? Why is this a sham? What difference whether or not red stripes were available on '71's? Are you suggesting a black convertible with red stripes is not a good looking color combination? Why the hysteria? I don't get it.

 

Tubular control arms, along with other parts improve the factory suspension by a lot..

 

If somebody is paying that kind of money for a restored car they expect it to be correctly restored down to every detail. Nobody said red stripes didn't look good on a black car. I think they look great but were not available in 1971. There is no hysteria. $150,000 is a lot of money even for a car this is correctly restored.

 

I don't really care for the "derp ellipses," but I'll answer your question anyway. Money is paper or digital, and when you make some of it illicitly, you need to spend it. Usually this involves knowing or being both parties.

Example. I have a hundred thousand dollars that I got from under the table transactions that I never paid taxes on, hypothetically. That cash money doesn't exist officially, so I need to do something with it. I have put it into bank accounts that are on the cooked books temporarily. My buddy and partner in crime has a 442 worth $40k. We take that thing to Mecum and, with another partner, shill bid that mother up to $110k. My buddy gets $100k for his car, and he gives me the car, and he has $40k, and the $60k is now clean and ready to be used on something.

So, whenever something goes for way more than it is worth, that could be why; they're moving money.

Another kind of laundering is when you own all the sub companies in an endeavor, and the O&P comes back to you, so you can pay your sub company full ticket, but the O&P comes back in your pocket, but is now clean. This could be done on a high dollar resto where one guy owns all the resto companies, take a big cash payment, then pays himself.

I'm not a crook, at least not in this way, so I only know the theory.

 

Watch Ozark with Jason Bateman and Laura Linney.

 

So when the IRS asks how did you get $100K cash (or put it on the books) you say what ?

 

The factory front upper and lower control arms were stamped steel. Which is flimsy and will deflect on hard cornering. Also, the factory A-Arms had really poor/bad geometry so that also made for bad handling.

Going to aftermarket tubular upper & lower control arms, they correct the geometry problem and tubular metal is way stronger than stamped flat steel. Handling is vastly improved.

 

I've been saving every $5 bill I got since I was 8, lol.

 

You have two sets of books. That 100k is not on the ones you give the IRS.

 

Of all the cars that roll thru these auction houses this car looks nowhere near worth 150k to me. That is my opinion of scam bidding.

 

Purchasing a car for $150,000.00 or greater does not constitute money laundering. Based on your "theory", you have gifted the United States Attorney's Office with a case for Federal indictable charges of conspiracy, tax evasion, money laundering and wire fraud. The amount of restitution and incarceration is dependent on the amount you have defrauded the United States of America.

 

Exactly!!

 

Earlier you wrote that the bid was a sham. Now, according to you, it's a scam???? Try to stay consistent.

 

Oh really?? The Internal Revenue Service Agents have never run into such a novel idea...!!! And moreover, the Internal Revenue's Special Agents are completely dumb??

 

"WE" do not know if there were any real bids on auction cars that are not "SOLD"

"reserve not met" or "the bid goes on" cars are "bid" up to close to the required $$$ figure to buy the car, often by empty seats or chandeliers

 

Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

 

Thank you for sharing your knowledge.

 

yes, sometimes .............. Tubular control arm failure - ClassicOldsmobile.com

 

I mistakenly took your question as in good faith. Now, you're simply being an ***.

 

I have thought this too. It's either some ultra rich dude that doesn't know or care about the value of money, a scam, or something like money laundering.

By way of scam, multiple people in on the bidding to drive up the price and hope an outsider gets in on the bidding.

 

Or have your buddy / scam bidder help you out. Make your car look like it is worth way the f more than it really is. So many ways to scam. To play stupid is not playing stupid. You just stupid. Of all the cars we all watch. This car is worth 150k+... I call bullshit. Zero bids past 150. Zero. Scam Sham whatever.

 

There is a reason they offer drinks at these places.Alpha males sauced up with an ego. only takes two in the room.
I'd bet most of these auctions have shill bidders, the sellers buddy. to help get the price up, they know they are not on the hook for it, till it meets the reserve. If you watch the room. When at one of these things, There is a few people that bid on a bunch of cars, but stop once the reserve is met or taken off. Things that make you go, hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

I could be wrong, but I think that is a Thorton restored car that sold at BJ Scottsdale a 3-4 yrs ago. I spoke to the owner, etc while there, looked the car over. It was gorgeous. The list of people that buy $50k 70/72-442 verts, then send them to high end resto shops and spend another $100k+ on them to make them better than new is a very, very long list of owners over the past 15 yrs. So they sell them for less than $150k (usually much less) and everyone misses the small point that the owner lost at leat $20-40k. Comically they moan about it as if the owner made money on the sale/auction are evil vs the reality of bringing a car back to pristine condition that will look incredible for decades to come simply to enjoy the car and pass the gorgeous example onto another owner that likely got the better of the deal vs the seller. Resto shops that do A+ work are very, very expensive, but there work is amazing