Johnd

Hey Guys,


Let me first start off by thanking everyone for their responses to my posts over the past few months. As some of you know, I bought a 1970 442 back at the beginning of December. The engine, transmission, and rear are all original, and I plan to restore it back to its former glory, which is no easy task considering the amount of rust around the bottom of the rear window and trunk lip. On the plus side I ordered these sections from DVAP and paid a little extra to have them cut at the factory welds, so no one will ever know there were replaced. The question I have now is how much of the following needs to be numbers matching:


- Carburetor
- Waterpump
- Trunk lid - can I go with a newer style one
- Front Fenders - can I go with NOS - 71/72 not after market


I'm just wondering how much these things would detract from the value and should I keep searching for the right parts. From an investment standpoint how much less will the car be worth if I went the route above?




I am curious to know how authentic some of your cars are, as the pictures I've seen are really nice. BTW attached is a picture of the color my car will be when it is done. This isn't my car but I had one just like it 20 years ago

oldcutlass

Period correct and properly restored are 2 different things. My car is period correct, but nowhere near properly restored.

Johnd

The 70 442 convertible I did a frame off of 20 years ago was too nice to drive when it was done, and I ended up selling it to buy my first house. I want to restore this car to drive, but also know at some point I might have to get rid of it, like when my 4 year old goes to college, job loss, etc. I want to make sure the car is built so it is worth value, and want to know how much 71/72 fenders, 71 trunklid, etc would kill the future resale value. Every car that pops up on ebay I am checking the fenders for crumple zones

jensenracing77

How correct you make it is up to you. Correct numbers help on resale value but when it comes to correct 70 only trunk lid and front fenders I don't think it is going to have much affect on value. I am building my W-30 with correct body parts but I will not have the correct number distributor or carburetor. I feel for my situation, It is best to worry about correct body because after it is painted I can't just go change to the correct body parts. I can over time find the correct carb and distributor and add them later. I don't have the budget for everything at the same time but will get there. The correct body parts are something that would bug the crap out of me if they were wrong on my car but I am among a smaller group. Not very many people are that worried about it when buying one.

jensenracing77

On a second note... The 71-72 trunk lid will have no effect. There are maybe 200 people that even know there is a difference. The front fenders will have little effect on value but will have some effect on desirability. If you had two cars priced the same and in the same condition most would pick the one with the correct fenders.

Johnd

The funny part is when I restored the convertible 20 years ago I had no clue about the fenders and just bought 2 at the dealership - come to find out now that they were the wrong ones. The car has the original ram air hood and I am replacing the aftermarket spoiler with a real one I picked up yesterday. I think I might keep hunting around to find a decent set of fenders and a correct style 1 trunk lid - My body guy said he can repair mine but I am really trying to go rust free so it will last

tru-blue 442

X2. Find some 70 fenders if you can.
Good luck with it. Are you going to start
a build thread? Post up some pics!

69ishHoliday

My car is 69ish for a reason. The car is just an S Holiday and I'm blending in some things I like that are not 1969 issue. When the day comes to sell it and move on it should appeal to someone not particularly interested in a boring hood, points ignition, factory suspension, etc. Or I'll just keep it.

jensenracing77

What is the build date of your car? late May they made a change to the trunk lid. I have a second style and 70wcar has a first style. see this thread

https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...rust-free.html

Koda

I believe it depends on the market. High reserve auction, yes, it will matter some. "Normal" sale, probably not. It also depends on the caliber of the restoration, cars that are better and cost more are scrutinized more. I'd try for the correct parts if you currently have neither the 70s or the 71/72s.

Johnd

The build date on my car is the 5th week of January. I will start a build thread late today - so far the only progress I have made in the past 5 weeks is to remove the interior, front bumper, most of the chrome trim, the windshield and rear glass. I have been more focused on buying parts than taking them off. So far I have bought the following:


- 2 rust free doors
- Interior floors
- New console
- Bumper brackets and bolts - it came with a new front bumper
- correct spoiler - needs some work on the screw holes
- Shop/Service manuals


It will be a long project but I am looking forward to the end result

joe_padavano

First, let's clarify. The only parts of your car that can possibly be "numbers matching" are the frame, engine block, and trans case. These are the only parts with a factory VIN derivative stamp that MATCHES the VIN of the car. There is only one unique copy of each that is stamped to match the VIN.

There are many other parts with part numbers and date codes that need to be CORRECT for your car, but there are no numbers that "match" the VIN. Unlike a numbers matching block or frame, there are hundreds if not thousands of carbs, water pumps, intakes, etc, that have the correct numbers for your car. These are important restoration details, but they are not "numbers matching", since there are no numbers that "match".

Also, let's differentiate "period correct" from "correctly restored". Period correct is a term coined by people who didn't want to go through the effort of building a correctly restored car but want it to sound like it's something special. "Day two" build is a similar term, which seems to give the builder carte blanche to perform whatever modifications they want within the guise of what was available about when the car was new.

Don't get me wrong, I personally prefer that customization, but its nothing special. From the sound of your post, you are asking about a totally correct factory restoration. This requires much more work and attention to detail, and I applaud you for it.

Gary M

If you have the build sheets you can restore the car to original. If you are truly going for accurate restoration. My car has parts (options) that are not on my build sheet so it is not restored properly.

Johnd

Unfortunately, the build sheet on mine was to far deteriorated to save - it was under the passenger bucket and was nothing but a bunch of letters sticking to the seat. I will start a build thread to give people an idea of the car and what I have done so far.

dc2x4drvr

My take is as long as the motor and trans were in the car when it was born, you're good to go, water pumps, alternators, distributors, etc, are items that in the course of 40 years were replaced just to keep 'em on the road..

Gary M

I agree. The other small items can be found along the way if necessary. The main thing is to enjoy the project and share pics with us. Good luck.

pcard

All the above is on target. When I did mine I thought about what options I wanted on my car for functionality(it is a driver). For example I knew I wanted things like a passenger side mirror, a trunk light and a posi diff. I wanted to have heavy duty cooling. These were not on the car originally (as per build sheet), but I added them.
I made every effort to keep the car "authentic" in that nothing I added was not available at the time of purchase, and any part I bought was as close to correct as I could get within my budget. I did buy repro parts because NOS were either very expensive, or hard to find in my time frame (I had a limit). That being said, if a repro part was obviously not true to form then I passed on it.
If you are working in a budget, money or time, then focus on the big things that you cannot change later, like body parts. You can pick up the "right" distributor or mirror when the car is already on the road.
For me this is an ongoing journey which will likely never have an end.

1964f-85

My 64 is period correct, 1976! I did swap out the aluminum slots and mile high stink bug rear end stance, oh yea, cd player, 5 speed, demon carb, mosier 9" and crap, never mind....

Johnd

Thanks for all the great replies. I think you pretty much answered my question on which direction to take with the car. Hopefully in the end it will come out as nice as some of yours...

gearheads78

My take is there is a very small group of people that really care that every serial number is right on every part and each bolt has the right stamping in the head of it. Most are on the internet surfing web sites and ebay and make a mission to tell other people what is not right. My real experience is most people at shows, cruises clubs ect don't know the difference and don't care. They enjoy the cars becuase they are cool old cars that bring them back to days gone by.

aliensatemybuick

My car is correct enough for me. Period.

costpenn

Richard, how have you been? No posty posty in a long time !

The Bug Man

You nailed it ! Many are forgetting what period correct REALLY is. Hell we couldn't wait to change wheels, tires, butcher the exhaust system, jack em up in the rear, slap an 8 track in the glove box screw some Kraco speakers in the package tray. That's all before we dove into the motor and trans !. I still can't believe we put those ugly bright yellow Accell plug wires on.
In other words in my mind "period correct" is 180 degrees from OEM "as was" from the factory, but to each his own !

gearheads78

Been really busy and little time online I have had I have been spending learning about building a retirement portfolio using a dividend growth and reinvestment strategy. Been thinking about my time after work a lot lately and strarting from scratch its the only way I have found that will get me close to where I need to go without the downside risk of the market. I just wish I had learned this 10 years ago. The traditional way to go that a retirement planner will tell you to go and 401K's just have too much risk to a downside of the market and inflation.

Also been sorting out a guys 71 Cutlass convertible be just purchased a few months ago.

oldcutlass

When you figure it out let me know.

Fun71

And mine are still there today!

Jamesbo

X2 and well said Richard.

FWIW my 69 drop top was incorreclty repaired at an Oldsmobile Dealer Body shop 40 years ago. So technically it's period incorrect

KeithA0000

Mine is neither "period correct" nor is it "properly restored". Unless you give me 1968 and 1969 are together a "period" then mine is "period correct".
It's a 69 with a 1968 front end. When I bought it, my intent was to change that when I had the time/money. Now unfortunately/fortunately, I have fallen in love with the 68 look, and I ain't changin' it now. Unfortunately, now I need to do some engine work, body work, ragtop work...