My '23 Silverado had been having intermittent failure of the right front turn signal light. It would do the rapid-click thing that has long been the sign of a burned out bulb. Also, a message would pop up on the info screen. The problem was that it did it only intermittently, and no code was stored.

I had the truck in for an oil change and mentioned the turn signal problem. Turns out there was a software update to address the problem. Who knew? I remember the days when you would fix a burned out turn signal bulb by replacing the bulb. A 5-minute operation. Not anymore. The problem wasn't the bulb, anyway.

The first time the problem occurred, I actually lifted the hood to see how easy or not it is to access the turn signal bulb. The answer is, NO CHANCE. I think you'd have to disassemble most of the fender on that side to get at anything, unless it can be gotten at from under the vehicle. I didn't check that.

The turn signal is that reverse C-shaped lens right below the headlight. I don't know what the bulb is like, anyway, nor how many of them are there. It could be LEDs for all I know. Anyone know?

Life in the 21st century.

 

One has to wonder why software is necessary to operate the turn signals in the first place...

This, by the way, is why I dumped my 1999 Chevy truck and replaced it with a 1980 GMC.

 

A s/w update for an intermittent rapid turn signal issue? Soon there will be no wires on a motor vehicle - they'll operate via on-board WiFi modules. I'm your PCM, can I speak w/ your ECM, I'm your ECM can I speak w/ your electronic flasher module, please?
"This is Ground Control to Major Tom"

 

The exact wording of the service technician was that it was a "software update to a control module."

 

This leads me to a question I have pondered for years. Why is it I notice a far significant number Chevrolet/GMC trucks have one, not two, parking lamps illuminated on the front of the vehicle? This isn't just happenstance, I see it regularly and only on Chevrolet/GMC trucks. WTH is up w/ that?

 

I'm confused. You mean one parking lamp, like in the center of the vehicle's front end, instead of at each corner?

I'm getting the truck back from the dealer later this morning. I'll turn on the parking lamps and see what lights up.

 

Headlamps & or parking lamps turned on - truck traveling down highway.

One parking lamp illuminated on the front RH or LH side while the other opposing/opposite lamp is not illuminated. I can’t be the only person who’s ever noticed this I would not think? Some optional Chebby switch driver can decide one or the other or both will work? LOL

 

I’ve always ‘assumed’ it’s a manifestation of some inherent wiring issue on the trucks.

 

I don't have an answer for what you've seen.

Here's the lights on my truck, and they do just what you'd expect. In the park lamp only setting, there is an amber lamp that faces sideways and the C-shaped white lamp facing forward, and that's on each side.








With the turn signal on, the C-shaped white light changes to amber and flashes.





When the headlights are on, everything is the same with the park lights, plus the headlights are on.






If there's a way to turn off the parking lights on just one side, I don't know what it is.

 

Here's the entry on the service invoice regarding the repair to the turn signal issue.

The business about "lost comm with BCM" didn't have anything to do with the truck. The service guy had to get a second code reader when he was checking the truck in because the one he started with wasn't working. I googled it, and the code noted, U0140, just means that communication with the BCM was lost.

Anyway, they found that the "BCM had a new calibration." SPS is "service programming system." BCM is "body control module." They programmed it to the latest calibration. I hope it's fixed. The turn signals worked fine on the way home.

 

Norm I see that as well, one side illuminated and the other not, I just figured one side was burned out.

Jaunty I hope that is the only worry you have with your truck.

 

This is ominous-sounding. Do you know something I don't know?

I've had the truck for two years now, and it's been a joy to own. Smooth, quiet, powerful. Great for long trips and towing my trailer. Except for the turn signal thing, the only service it has received is routine oil changes and so forth.

 

Nope, no underlying messages! Glad you enjoy the truck. You can't beat a Silverado.

 

Mike - Boy Howdy plenty of them burned out.

 

"Could not duplicate concern" That tells me that it isn't fixed.

 

GM software is trash. I don't think I'll ever buy a GM vehicle again. I was an Oldsmobile fan from day one, then Pontiac and a reluctant Chevy owner. Too many sad vehicles from 2000 and up from GM.

My 2020 Traverse takes forever to boot up and have the system 100% available. The XM radio takes about 5 minutes to become active.

In contrast, my 2017 Fusion takes about 5 seconds for full system availability and the radio is available immediately.

The Japanese cars in my fleet have no delay in start up

My 69 Cutlass is 100% ready with a turn of the key.

 

Like I said, the problem was intermittent, and I assumed that they wouldn't be able to fix it unless the problem actually presented itself. The service tech said they would look into it anyway, and he said that there was a software update apparently related to the turn signal issue.

But who knows. I'll find out if it's fixed in due course.

 

Have you ever brought this to the attention of the dealer?

I have both this truck and a '24 Buick Encore. Both have the fancy display system, and both have satellite radio. The displays come up immediately when the vehicles are started, and the radios are playing music within about 10 to 15 seconds.

I wouldn't put up with what you're putting up with.

 

I drive a lot of relatively new rental cars, and boot-up time is a constant drag for me. Many of these are imports, so I don't agree with the "japanese cars have no delay". I think VW is the worst, however. Just waiting for my phone to connect to the infotainment system takes so long that I'm most of the way to the meeting before it connects. I'll never own a car with a touch screen for this reason (plus the electronic nanny crap).

 

I work on GM cars & software, PCM TCM AND BCM'S all day long. sounds like you have a faulty BCM possible.. GM software is pretty good, I THINK you got a monday or friday car.. You got lucky with a FORD ! Just my opinion, course I have GM tattooed to my ....

 

I'll throw in that, what Jaunty has is the daytime running lights DRLs are incorporated with the turn signal. It has been the logic for some time to shut the DRL off on the side indicating a turn for better contrast. The running lights have been divorced from the turn lights for some time now, even when bulbed.

To both of the Joes' comments, I think desired behavior is a splash screen with a picture of the car and some graphic and the name and some animation, then it's on. So 3 to 5 seconds. That's a programmed thing. I can inquire how fast the Toyota ECUs go hot after IG On. It's pretty fast.

 

Remember, all your electrical accessories like lights and power windows aren't just a switch connected to it directly with a wire. It's all computerized and run through microchips with software. When Uncle Tony's rants have been posted, this is exactly what he's been talking about. Honestly you're far better off in the long run rehabbing a 90s or earlier Chevrolet than spending a kings ransom on anything new. Not only is it way cheaper, if given a fair chance those older trucks will easily outlast anything being built today.

Couldn't agree more.

 

Does your truck have driver assist? That could be the reason it needs software for turn sigals

 

Great minds think alike!. So far no issues with mine 15 months of ownership

 

Ain't it the truth! 😞

Multiple reprogrammings, a rebuild and a replacement didn't do anything for the POS transmission in my 20 F150. The Kia I traded it for isn't much better.

 

Any of you Chevy truck guys with a 6.2 engine had it go bad? GM is in a heap of trouble with the 21-24 6.2's.

 

Oh that's what you ended up with? Trading a Killed In Action for a Found On Road Dead....you truely have my sympathies.

 

WE chevy guys do not want to talk about this !!

 

How could you possibly know this? Can you look 10 or 20 years into the future? Anything can last a long time if properly cared for.

 

Waaaaaa! You meanies are making me sad, I like my Furd...

 

You mean, does it have that feature that tries to push you back into the lane if you should veer out of it? Yes. So does my '24 Buick Encore and so did my '21 Mazda 6 that I traded for the Buick. Kind of hard to avoid that feature nowadays.

If everyone wants to complain about modern technology in newer cars and trucks, how far back do you want to go?

How about the 2002 Olds Silhouette minivan I once owned? Shortly after we purchased it (about a month), a problem arose where ONLY the headlights went on when you turned the switch. The running lights and interior dash lights would not light up, so the car really could not be driven at night because you couldn't see the dashboard at all. Of course, the dealer fixed it right away, but the fix required consultation with the factory, and the fix was ultimately a new control module. Sound familiar?

How about the 2002 Dodge Dakota pickup I owned from 2007 to 2013? The windshield wipers failed on it at one point. I thought it was a fuse or something, but I could not find anything that I could replace or repair, so I took it to the dealer. The solution? Replacement of a control module. Anyone detecting a pattern here?

Everybody acts like these computers in our vehicles arrived only yesterday or last week or last year. Nope. They've been part of our cars and trucks for at least a generation and probably longer.

 

Thanks. Nice-looking truck!

We modern types have to band together to fight off the luddites.

 

Has Chevy fixed the DoD and VVT issues yet? I wouldn't touch an 07 or later Chevy Truck (or almost any brand). I have a friend with a 21 or 22 that he just had to have like a $3500 cam and lifter job done and it only has around 100K. That's pathetic

 

As in....now the cylinder deactivation is an integrated thing where you can't turn it off, or program it out by yourself? Surrrre.... not.

If you want to see a lot of what's going on, get a scan tool for your vehicle. No scan tool is everything for every issue, but a bi-directional scan tool ($$) can be ultra-useful without taking it to the dealership. My truck is out of warranty now, so I got one of those bi-directional tablets with bluetooth connection where I can run tests, check code history, clear codes, generate and email pre and post repair stuff. I've saved a lot of money by buying one. It's not a Tech 2, but it does ok for what I need.

BCM's seem to be horrible on the 19-24 GM pickups IMO. They were ALWAYS having trouble with those, either the BCM is bad or always needs reflashing/updates. Also issues with the fuel pump driver modules. "Loss of comms" to anything and everything, cause could be anything from a loose/broken/corroded wire issue to changing out the battery, or random mess up. Lifter failure on the 6.2 can be problematic, too.

While under warranty during the covid aftermath, my 2020 GMC's BCM had to be replaced because the taillights simply never would come on. Brake lights were fine. Two weeks sitting at the dealership until they could get one. Supply issues. I just replaced the fuel pump driver module myself last week ($74 from rockauto) as it would randomly toss codes. Wouldn't set a hard code but it would throw up a CEL on the dash. Go figure. At least it didn't leave me stranded on the side of the road somewhere. New module fixed all that- at least for now.

 

I have a 08 Silverado with the 5.3 and I had the AFM turned off way back. I was told if you turned the AFM off before it had the lifter issue the chance of a failure was far less. My truck has 155K and I haven't had any issues with the engine @ all. I don't tow much at all with it any more but most of it's life it pulled a trailer and some kind of Oldsmobile.

 

I really don't know what, if any, new brand truck I would buy for any sort of decent to serious towing now.

 

Not if there's inherent issues that make failures significantly more likely. How do I know this? Because professional mechanics that deal with modern cars tell me this for one thing. Then you also have common sense, the biggest weak point is the electricals. The wires themselves aren't as robust as before, there's way way more of them, and they are interlocked in a way they weren't before further reducing overall reliability. Then there's also the engines, modern engines are overall less reliable than they were 20 years ago. Obviously there were duds here and there like the Northstar, this is why I say average. But today you have industry wide adoption of technology like low friction piston rings and gas direct injection which are very prone to major problems with carbonation.

For me personally I'd say for a passenger car mid 70s through maybe early 90s. My next driver is going to be a 78. I dont believe all complexity is bad but there has to be a balance and that tipping point that was reached long ago.


Thanks for proving my point, notice how I said "90s or earlier". Some brands at various times have had significant quality issues when they were new, that's always been true. I mean when was the last time Chrysler wasn't making junk? That said we now live in an era where a bad backup camera or a leaking tail light lens could disable a vehicle, that's what I'm referring to. That proves what I was saying, more failure points that are more likely to fail and when they do fail have substantially more serious effects that cost way more to diagnose and fix.

 

Also why I plan on keeping my 99 Tahoe as long as possible. Mine is still the old body style. Tahoe's didnt change until 2000?

 

When I bought my 2015 F150 new I went to a local place that's been around forever for a cap and hitch. Mistake. The truck had 600 miles on it.

Really, really long story short .... my left eye is twitching ...... I got it back with all sorts of lights and codes, the auto start/stop wasn't working, all sorts of crapola.Brand new truck, an XL at that with no bells of whistles. Naturally they blamed 'the computer'. Uh huh. I went to the dealer a few times and got a similar story - cannot duplicate, no codes. One day after I was leaving I happen to run into one of the young mechanics/techs and after about a one minute conversation this actual mechanic used his Mark One Eyeballs to find the problem, not a scanner. Imagine that.

Seems the simian that should not be allowed to touch sharp things (or reproduce) who did the cap decided I had a BLIS sensor in my tail light. He didn't actually look mind you, he just decided that based on his personal intuition so to make my third brake light on the cap work he ran a #14 AWG cable all the way up front and into my cab. Thank God he realized there's an opening for that or he'd have made one. He took out his channel locks and crunched a Scotchlok with that #14 to the #26 wiring harness about an inch from the brake pedal. Eeeeeee.

They replaced the destroyed section of harness for me under warranty, I spliced the brake light into the tail light myself in about two minutes. Ten years later not a burp, not a fart it just fires up and goes and does truck stuff. Beyond basic maintenace it's asked me for nothing. So much for 'the computer'. It is often enough I suppose but it's still a machine under all that crap. I just replaced a cracked tail light lens assembly and it's easier than doing it on the Olds, no secret radar systems or missile defense hardware in there ........ just two plain old bayonet bulbs.

Coincidentally I just had my MEFI-4a ECM reflashed with a custom tune for the Ramjet 350 in my '68 Cutlass and it did fix the problems, it was 'the computer'. So when the North Koreans touch off that big EMP weapon it won't work - I'll have to jump in my '69 'vette sitting next to it as it'll still work.

 

My 99 is a crewcab dually, so also OBS. Still, it has 300K miles on it and it's starting to have electronics issues, so it has to go.