Hey guys I have a 1966 442 convertible that I am looking at and noticed that the 5v is not present on the data plate. Actually the data plate is very plain and does not list many acc's at all other than trim and paint. This is a fremont car but I thought that the fremont car with no 5v/4v was only a 1965. This is also a convertible to no way to distinguish via the ao smith and pontiac frame. Basic items check out like louvers/fender, emblems boxed control arms and rear sway bar, but is there any thing else you guys could let me know on how to spot a clone for a fremont 66 442. I attached the number on the data plate for you guys to spot.

ST 66-33867 BODY BF 00617
TRIM 983 C-1 Paint
032926

Appears very plain to me but then again I have never owned a Fremont built car. Appears to be a factory white with white convertible top with blue bucket seat interior and console shift. Also my other 66's Lansing car all have the option section (2) with either X, G, L(G) or B(G) which tells you what the original shifter config was. Any other way to know in this car. It has the correct 66 jetaway console and shifter.
Please any help would be apprecaited.

 

Fremont cars do not have the Lansing style fisher codes on the cowl tag.

 

Does the car have the correct E-block 400 engine in it? If so, can you check the date code by the base of the distributor? You didn't post the car's build date (usually located at the top left of the tag), but you could compare the engine's date to the car's, and if its shortly before, its a good sign (though certianly not definitive) that its original to the car and thus a real 442.

Also, are the 442-specific trim pieces (such as the dash emblem, grille, grill bars, taillights, trunk lid trim, fender louvers, etc) are there and do they appear original (i.e. not too perfect, also all in comparable condition to each other and the car)? Does the car have a 442 hood (no center hood trim)? 1966 442s are perhaps the hardest to clone, because of all the unique trim. If the motor and all that other stuff is correct and appears orignal to the car, its likely a real 442. If the 442-specific trim looks repro and the motor is not correct in terms of casting or date, maybe not.

Remember, its not a fake until its PROVEN a fake.

 

Thanks for the info. All the numbers looks correct, I need to look for a broadcast or buildsheet when it gets here. I was just mainly concerned with the 5v not being present on the data plate. Again I only thought that Fremont cars only didn't include this in 1965 but apparently in 1966 as well. Thanks for the help.

 

Its not real until it is proven real. Otherwise it is a fake.

 

ok

 

032296 will be on the buildsheet if there is one. Thats the manifest sequence number, the build sheet number. It represents the number to date of Oldsmobiles built at Fremont. 64-67 Fremont cars were all like this. BUT......sometimes there are option codes on the cowl tag. Not Fisher style codes, RPO codes. Fremont did things some odd ball stuff.

If the car has the POP, the head number will be in the book. If the original engine is still present and it matches the POP, you have proven the car as a real 442.

 

Bullshit. The car below has no paperwork, no protecto-plate, no window sticker, no owner history, and was built at Fremont. Is it fake?

redlines-2.jpg

 

That has to be the most asinine statement I've ever read on a message board. You guys who think that unless a car has documentation,it's a clone/fake/recreation etc. need to get a life period. I've said this many times,nobody back in the day knew these cars were going to be what they are,so why keep the paperwork? How about this,64-67 & 72,442 was an option. Why is a Cutlass with all of the correct 442 parts/option not a 442? If you put a OAI hood on a non OAI car,is it still an OAI car? Sure it is,it was an option. I guarantee you I can clone up a 66 and NOBODY can tell,NOBODY. Why am I taking the stance about the above statement when I have all of the wallpaper for my car? because every car without documentation is not a fake.

 

The Master says,

"Follow your breath, and consider: What IS reality, anyway?"

... and presents his own koan:

"It's not queer unless it's tied to the pier."

- Eric

 

Thanks Mike your statement makes alot of sence. Everyone talks and talks especially at shows and or on the phone about numbers this and numbers that and 90% of them dont even own a car let alone an Oldsmobile. No sense in getting upset over anything anymore I learned that a while ago and I still remember you telling me on the phone, "your car, paint it and option it the way you would have wanted to in 1966". You changed my whole perspective on the data plate and the letters/numbers, who cares what color it came, its yours now and no one can take that away from you. My 66 4 Speed is becoming a black car, and I wrote you last week about the 66 Tricarb (not factory 1/54 either dealer or customer installed) I am getting hopefully this month, It was originally white and will wear a proud coat of black when she gets restored. I wasn't around in 1966 at least not to buy a car so I never had the opportunity to check off the options list, well now 40 years later I am, and it as much fun if not more than doing it at the dealership 40 years ago.

 

Another 2 cents. I hear "is it real?" Gee, no it is a hologram. lol As Mike said, the 442 was just an option and to GM, nothing different from any other option except it might be more complex to add all its components afterwards. If you add the L69, L78, or W29 (codes for the 442 option in 66-7), is it a dirty, nasty "clone?" OK, now lets add a radio, wheel covers, or power steering to a car. They were options too. Is that car a clone?

 

I have 2 '67 4-4-2's, a convertible and a post body.
I've owned the post car since 1969.
I lost the original engine many years ago (long stupid story) and replaced it with another '67 4-4-2 engine.
I worked as a lot boy in 1967 at the local Olds dealer. I washed this car when it was new on the lot.

I've owned the convertible since the mid '80's. The previous owner, a good friend, owned it since the '70's.
It also doesn't have the original engine.
So, neither car is a matching number car. I have no documentation.
Does this mean these cars are fake?