DownBoy

So this is the newly named thread continuing from where my "hubcaps with RWL" thread left off as it now concerns the decision (made) to bring the 69 delta 88 back to life.
So it was a spun bearing after all. There is somewhat good news. PO built this engine not long ago so everything inside motor is fairly new. My mechanic will be taking crankshaft out to see if current one can be machined, the spun bearing is the front one, the one that bears the most. PO added a new carb and master as well. Yes, 2 bbl. We will see now how long that lasts. The car will also need a new transmission mount and control arms up front. Original A/C still intact.
Decision made to build it back up. Looking at 3k-3.5k for the teardown, machining, new master kit and gaskets, put back together and stick back into the delta.
Here are pic's taken today:

DownBoy

And the car:

MDchanic

1. There's nothing wrong with those hood hinges.




2. A black engine? How unattractive.
Also, makes me wonder about the rebuild and whether you've still got your original compression.

3. What, exactly, is that transmission hanging off of?




4. Is that an elusive 455 forged crank I see???





- Eric

DownBoy

1. Guess I will be have a forever dented head
2a. Will definitely be repainting, not sure of color
2b. Was told all parts inside engine including pistons, rods were new, or from a new longblock perhaps...can you tell me how to find numbers on block to let me know if its orig block
3. good question let me ask
4. Not sure, I do know the "spun" part is the first and front of crank.


as always your input is appreciated. I am looking at this being a 4 month project, just getting the engine back.


RC

MDchanic

The parts may be new, but that does not mean that they are the same as the original parts.

The engine VIN-derivative stamp is here:



- Eric

DownBoy

will look on Monday to see if numbers actually match. This will take some time....and money.....and money is coming in sections just like the car...
initial work:
get motor working and back into car. Add a new waterpump, seals, gaskets, already has a new 2 barrel carb for now.
repair trans mount
replace control arm bushings
change trans fluid, diff fluid
after that:
look at brakes, wheel bearings
has new master cylinder already.
start cleaning her up and look at rubber.
start thinking about color schemes and if I want to repaint and replace vinyl top. (currently green , like interior)
finish sometime around end of 2014.

need4speed

I like it. The full size cars don't get a lot of attention, but they are cool cars.

DownBoy

my thoughts exactly. I'm a big guy this car will be perfectly wrapped around me. Great weekend cruiser or to take to work once a week. I have a v6 lil Montero that I tool around in so between the two I should average 13 mpg....

MDchanic

I used to commute back and forth to work every day in a '68 88 in NYC in the '90s.

Got about 6mpg in heavy traffic, but it was worth every penny.

I used to drive that car like I stole it.

- Eric

DownBoy

NYC ? I'm originally from Staten Island. Now I pose an unorthodox non Olds question, being that baseball season is ramping up. I see your in Maine. Sox or Yanks ?
Lemme add in some Olds back east memories as well since I left the NY metro area back in the early 80's to move out west....the lines for gas in the late 70's as a kid getting ready to drive, and seeing how my parents can only get gas depending on what number was the last one on their license plate (odd or even)... my dad bought a 73 sebring satellite before he passed, we bought it in Pennsylvania to save money on sales tax and I remember all the larger American cars on the road back then... all goliaths only small car you would see would be a bug or a midget.....ahhhhhhh

MDchanic

Ha. Me too. Rotten Island, the Toxic Rock, where they use mobsters for fertilizer the way some people use horse s__t.

As for baseball, I've always been a Yankees fan when asked to choose - the Mets were always a poor substitute for the Brooklyn Dodgers or the old Giants up at the Polo Grounds.
That being said, I really don't follow sports. Watching a grown man hit a ball with a stick and run around in circles just doesn't make sense to me.

I remember the fuel crisis well. Even-Odd days and a five gallon maximum. People would go from station to station all day just to fill up. My grandfather had a collection of WWII jerry cans in his shed, all full, "just in case."
I had thought that the reason we invaded Iraq was to ensure a good supply of cheap oil, but apparently, I was mistaken.

- Eric

DownBoy

Rotten Island, haven't heard that in a long time. What part of the Island you from ? Went to Tottenville HS and resided in Great Kills and Eltingville. The particular gas station I really can't forget was on Richmond Ave and Amboy Road, and it was sllloooowww going. Get in line, the guy would check your registration along with your id and match it to your plate (in case you were switching plates)and then it was hurry up and wait. and every body would inch up in line then shut down their cars. Start em back up and move forward a few feet then start all over again. Good times the late 70's....then 3 mile island happens....

sicky olds

Love the 69 Delta 88, buddy of mine has a 2 door that is all original for about 1k that i would be tempted to get if i didnt have too many projects already lol. I notice that your location is Vegas, i will be moving out there in the next month and would love to come see the car and talk cars or something if you want.

DownBoy

absolutely. sounds like a good plan. does your buddies run well, any rust ? Where you located now ?

sicky olds

San Antonio, he parked it there when he got it. Only real rust issue that i see is in the trunk lid but he has a 70 98 that he is going to use the tray to fix it. 455 2bbl, A/C, same color as yours it seems

DownBoy

my crankshaft is cast, not forged. The tranny is chained up and (thankfully) not held up by my AC return line. Its held up by a bolt in the sidewall. sicky, my eldest daughter manages a jiffy lube down there in San Antone..

MDchanic

How do you know it's cast?

Your photos manage to avoid every important detail, but my sense looking at them is that 1.) the throws are drilled through, which I think is a characteristic of forged 455 shafts only, and 2.) the rear counterbalance weights have that smooth, forged look to me.



Now, if we had a clear picture of the parting lines of the casting, or even of the back of the crank, we could probably be sure, but, man, in those blurry pictures, that sure looks like a forged crank to me.


Funny, I grew up mostly on the North Shore, in St. George and New Brighton, but my old man moved to Eltingville, and still has a place there.
In the second grade, I was riding alone in the old B&O railroad cars with the wicker seats every day to school at the old Phone Company building in Eltingville.

I went to HS in the City, so I spent probably thousands of hours on the Ferry, or wandering the streets of Manhattan stepping over drunks and junkies.

Good times...

- Eric

DownBoy

Ah, I went the easy way on this one....I called my mechanic and asked him. Pictures aren't the best, he is sending crank to machine shop to see if there's anything left (its 040. already)
I will see him again next Monday, he might be getting ready for put together stage at that point although it really doesn't matter this won't be paid in full til about June.


Know where Assumption church is I think it was corner of Webster n brighton ave ? went there 3 years. Family originally from New Brighton, basically grew up next to defunct Italian grocery spot Malandro's on Brighton Ave.....I was born right there too at the old SI Hospital...

MDchanic

Sure. I lived over the hill on the other side of Jersey St.
Used to walk past SI Hospital, where my brother was born, every day on the way to school.

If you get a chance, get a few pictures of that crank - unusually smooth counterbalances, wide (like half an inch) casting parting lines and a "checkmark"-shaped cutout at the edge of the flywheel flange would signal a forged crank.

- Eric

DownBoy

I read some info on the differences between cast and forged, and forged seems to be a lot stronger crank, what other benefits are there if it is indeed, forged ?

MDchanic

For your purposes, probably no effective benefits at all, but they are very rare, and it could be worth a few extra bucks.

Mostly it's just "rare parts bragging rights."

- Eric

DownBoy

Got it. When I get back down to the shop I will take good pics and confirm.

DownBoy

update:
block is shot. someone put something similar to a bb in head or cylinder, need new block. I am not getting a new block or longblock for that. now looking for a350 olds motor to replace the 455.

MDchanic

Huh?!?

DownBoy

sorry been working like a dog. So mechanic says cylinder walls are messed up from something inside the cylinder bouncing all around in there. I am waiting for pics, I can't go see car for a few more days.




I am on a budget but want this car back on the road. Now what. I can find a used olds 350 that bolts right in maybe if I'm lucky a recently rebuilt one. I doubt I will find a 455 on my budget. I have a ceiling of $2500 that I want to initially invest to get her up and running. Maybe $3k, but that's pushing it.


I suppose I can raise some cash selling the 455 as is, dunno for what.


??

need4speed

If it were me I would stay with a 455 if at all possible. A 350 in a car that heavy doesn't sound like much fun.

DownBoy

Finding one for a reasonable price is my problem. There out there, $2k, 3k and more but I don't have that cash to put into this project. Yes, its a full size 455 powered delta, I will not be recouping anything out of it whatsoever, was doing this because the few moments I did drive her it was simply a feeling you don't get in todays cars. And the smell... but I need to stay within a monetary limit and for the motor and back into car, its $2500 which was achievable right before I found out some idiot dumped something down into it or whatever occurred. Its a gamble, that looks to be one I most likely will lose. I want to eventually get it painted, finish the top and interior, replace the control arms and throw some 'caps or rims inside the rubber, that's another 3-5k. total investment about 6-8k. Damn.

sicky olds

Why not just resleeve the damaged cylinder wall or bore it out?

need4speed

I hear you, the full size Olds are great cars. It bugs me that last spring there was a 100% complete rust free 69 Delta 88 with a 455 in the junkyard near me. Since the place is a Pick A Part yard, the car only lasted 6 weeks.

DownBoy

I will talk to my mechanic tomorrow about options. Give me a ballpark on a re sleeve if you know so I have an idea what I'm in for. This is unchartered territory for me, any input would be appreciated, but I am stuck on 2-3k as far as cash is concerned tho.

DownBoy

today's update:
Just visited car and mechanic. And I took pics except I took em with my cell phone instead of my camera so I can't upload them. I gotta figure that out. But here's what we are going to do:


replace the piston and rings in (cylinder rear of engine, pass side)
replace connecting rods in front two cylinders and rings
either repair current crank or install new one
do valve job


again, I took pics of piston that has about eight little round indentions on the top of it- as well as better pics of the crankshaft which is definitely cast-hope I can download.

need4speed

Cool, fixing what you have is the best option. Hopefully your mechanic knows what he is doing. Are you changing any of the valve train?

DownBoy

he hasn't gotten into the heads yet. Any suggestions ? I don't expect to be modifying much via performance route, this will be my weekend cruiser and taking the family out on a sunday drive type vehicle, no racing except for passing the rice burners with the pseudo pipe in the rear on the 215 freeway here in vegas.
I agree, keeping within my monetary parameters about keeping the 455 instead of going with the 350. And my mechanic agrees, he wants to keep it original as much as possible.


Just seeing her again was nice, sat in her for a few minutes and whiffed the aroma of the 69 interior.......mmmmmm.

DownBoy

New Pics.
I took pic's of pic's so Eric, I am apologizing in advance for the blurry pic's.

DownBoy

front of block, just to the right of oil fill is this number: 396021 F. What does it mean.

MDchanic

Wow. Those sure are blurry.

That number is the casting number for all '68-'72 455s. It means you have a 455.

- Eric

DownBoy

update on my 455:
block and crank are in machine shop. Saved piston as well. Most likely won't return from machine shop for a while so I will update accordingly. In the meantime my 69 88 sits. And waits for its new heart...

MDchanic

Sounds good, and cheaper than finding and rebuilding a different one.

We'd love to see some photos of the damage and cure.

Make sure they don't change any of the engineering specifications of the engine without you approving it, such as lowering the compression by installing a thicker head gasket (unless you want that).

- Eric

DownBoy

I will drop by shop this week and take correct pic's this time.. also will mention what you just said to my guy. I had a dream last night I stuck cooper cobra's on cragar ss rims on the 69 88. Looked pretty damn good in my dream..

need4speed

Sounds good to me. It would remind me of high school.