I just acquired a 65 F85 Sports coupe V6 2sp auto. ( It looks like the V6 is called an F85, if it was a v8 they called it a Cutlass?). Anyway

this cars has std brakes and std steering. Power brakes I can figure out but how hard is it to upgrade to power steering?

 

Not hard at all, both are pretty simple conversions from a mechanical perspective. Great job pushing to get the car...you followed car buying 101. Bring cash, be honest, and be the first one there!

 

F-85s were available with either V6 or V8. The Cutlass was the top of the line and only came with a V8. Here are all the A-body models offered in 1965. FYI, for the 1965-71 model years, the third digit of the VIN will be odd if the car was originally equipped with a six cylinder engine and will be even if originally equipped with an eight cylinder engine.

 

Thanks guys. I'm gathering lots of useful info.
I've been able to on line source most of the parts, ie. pump, pulley, steering box, pitman arm, and the hoses. I've not had any luck with the pump to engine brackets which I would imagine used would be my only choice. I done some searches also including Buick and jeep 225's and even Buick 340 v8. I've found a few but just not sure which will fit as some look different.

 

The V6 is just a small block Buick with two cylinders cut off. The 300 and 340 V8s share architecture, front cover, timing chain, water pump, and valvetrain components.

 

I've not done this, perhaps another member has but I'm guessing the pump and brackets from a 75 or 76 3.8 Buick V6 Oddfire fire engine would work. IIRC about the only difference was .010 in bore between the 225 and Oddfire 231. Very similar motors.

Good luck!!!

 

How do I figure out if it's an F85 Club Coupe or F85 Deluxe Sports Coupe? Hard top or Pillar?

 

The VIN. Those "Model Code" numbers in the table represent the second through fifth characters of the VIN. Your photo shows that the car is NOT a hardtop, by the way.

 

 

I realize it's not a hard top but was wondering if Sports coupes were hard top, and Club coupes were pillar.

 

Olds used both Sport Coupe and Club Coupe to refer to post cars. Typically the lower end cars were club coupes and the higher trim cars were sport coupes. As an example, the V6 Sport Coupe was really a Cutlass Sport coupe but with a V6 instead of the Cutlass V8. Club Coupe and Sport Coupe body shells were exactly the same. Hardtops were called Holiday Coupes in Olds marketing speak.

 

From the '65 Olds Prestige brochure. The OP's car has the chromed, rather than body-colored, B-pillar, which makes it a Sports Coupe and not a Club Coupe. His car is like the light green one shown in the brochure. The Club Coupe, shown at the bottom, has a body-colored B-pillar.

 

And from the 1965 SPECS booklet, RPO B90 Moldings, Chrome Side Window Frame were a $21.52 option on the Club Coupe. In fact, all the trim from the Sport Coupe could be optionally ordered piecemeal on the Club Coupe. See RPO Y68, for example. Do I think someone did this? Not likely, but one more time: The VIN will tell you EXACTLY what model this is without any speculation or guessing.

 

Think long & hard about installing power steering.

I realize this car's a lot different from a 69 Camaro we currently have, but I had a notion to place in power steering in the Camaro and I bought all the components. Then, prior to getting the P/S installed I had the rear mono-leaf springs (the car is a 250 in line 6 cylinder manual 3 speed Saginaw on the floor, no console) replaced. It seemed to benefit the front end of the car just as much as the back end. Meaning, it was incredibly easier to steer. It went from virtually unbearable especially when parking to completely tolerable and I kept the road feel you get with a non P/S car of that era as opposed to that floating feeling at highway speeds. And nothing beats that steering wheel "snapping back" after you've made a turn at an intersection, really takes me back. You lose most of that with P/S.

I do realize I am comparing apples to oranges here as the suspension systems are different between these two cars but I can't help but feel the concepts are similar. I sold all my power steering stuff and never looked back. Plus you get to keep some of the originality of the car as well.

Just one man's opinion I thought I'd mention.

 

I'll try a slightly different take on the PS conversion issue. The biggest flaw in the stock manual steering box in the 64-72 cars is the fact that it takes about 800 turns lock-to-lock. In normal driving that isn't really an issue, but on twisty roads or when trying to get into a parking space, it can be annoying. As far as steering effort is concerned, there are a whole bunch of factors to consider.

First, be sure the front suspension and steering linkage is in good shape and well lubricated. Just before Power Tour I completely rebuilt the suspension and steering on my 62 F-85 with manual steering. Admittedly this car only weighs 2600 lbs empty, not 3400 lbs like the 62 cars. The difference in road feel and steering effort was quite noticeable, which was fortunate on the second day when we drove all those 15 MPH switchbacks on US58.

Second is front end alignment. The stock caster alignment spec on these cars is near zero. This reduces steering effort, but at the expense of steering precision. Caster settings in the +4 to +7 degree range is one of the main reasons why newer cars feel more precise. Unfortunately, those higher caster settings greatly increase steering effort. That's not an issue with power steering but it makes a big difference with manual steering.

Third is scrub radius. This is the difference between the center of the front tire contact patch on the road and where a line drawn through the two ball joints intersects the road. Ideally those two points want to coincide for minimum steering effort. Non-original wheels with a different offset from stock will change this and thus increase steering effort. Wider tires on different offset wheels compound the problem.

Have you really driven the car and determined that you NEED power steering?

 

I’m thinking of my wife driving it though. Maybe I’ll have her try it before deciding for sure. She remembers driving my 65 F100 years ago and hated the std steering.

 

Now THAT"S a 100% totally understandably valid consideration. I myself did not have that to consider, my wife can't drive a manual trans so I was in the clear on that. If she was able to, the P/S probably would have been installed.

 

Off topic of this post but...if running the V6 for awhile and planning a tune, the distributor cap and rotor are unique to those V6's you may want to source them early on. Saw a couple of marine engines on the edge of being replaced because they ran horribly due to the wrong rotor. The V8 rotor attaches perfectly but the contact tab to the cap differs. The cap being different is obvious....two less wires than a V8.

Sorry for the tangent but...

Good luck!!!

 

Ford trucks and vans manual steering is a different beast. My 73 Econoline makes you humble.

 

[QUOTE=joe_padavano;1186613]I'll try a slightly different take on the PS conversion issue. The biggest flaw in the stock manual steering box in the 64-72 cars is the fact that it takes about 800 turns lock-to-lock. In normal driving that isn't really an issue, but on twisty roads or when trying to get into a parking space, it can be annoying. As far as steering effort is concerned, there are a whole bunch of factors to consider.

First, be sure the front suspension and steering linkage is in good shape and well lubricated. Just before Power Tour I completely rebuilt the suspension and steering on my 62 F-85 with manual steering. Admittedly this car only weighs 2600 lbs empty, not 3400 lbs like the 62 cars. The difference in road feel and steering effort was quite noticeable, which was fortunate on the second day when we drove all those 15 MPH switchbacks on US58.

Second is front end alignment. The stock caster alignment spec on these cars is near zero. This reduces steering effort, but at the expense of steering precision. Caster settings in the +4 to +7 degree range is one of the main reasons why newer cars feel more precise. Unfortunately, those higher caster settings greatly increase steering effort. That's not an issue with power steering but it makes a big difference with manual steering.

Third is scrub radius. This is the difference between the center of the front tire contact patch on the road and where a line drawn through the two ball joints intersects the road. Ideally those two points want to coincide for minimum steering effort. Non-original wheels with a different offset from stock will change this and thus increase steering effort. Wider tires on different offset wheels compound the problem.

Have you really driven the car and determined that you NEED power steering?[/QUOTE]

Only around the guys farmyard. Monday I am going to pick it up and drive home 40 miles. Before I get it it is getting a safety inspection as part of the deal ("Safeties" are required here before registering the car.) It was safetied when he got it and driven very little so will require little if nothing to pass but they look at anything safety related like brake system, steering, suspension, wipers, all lights, tires.

 

Got a source Sugar Bear? I'm all about stock piling spare parts. I've got a few extra parts in my garage for vehicles I haven't owned for years, lol.

 

I don't have a source but if they are difficult to find try an OMC Evinrude, Johnson boat store. The 225's were used in inboard/outboard drives rated as 155 HP. PM me if you cannot find one, there is a boat dealer near me with some old stock, I'll ask him.

Good luck!!!

 

I'll check the condition of the current one first. When we started it it ran real smooth. Previous owner is a John Deere mechanic and he maintained it well for the 3-4 years he had it. Interesting aside, he dug through the glove box and discovered his wife's uncle used to own it for about twenty years. Also I got to see the 70ish 442 he and his dad frame off restored. It was shown at The World of Wheels annual show in Winnipeg and they only take in the best. Should have taken a pic.

 

I’m putting together a Rockauto order of ps parts. I got a needed original pump bracket set and pump from a great forum friend. I noticed I will need a power steering Pitman arm and there are two available:

Proforge 10310041 has a smaller stud diameter of .485” and is for 13/16” diameter center link

Proforge 10310040 has a stud diameter of .585 and is for a 7/8” diameter center link.

Of of course the car is not here to measure. Can I assume the v6 car has the smaller diameter center link?

 

Unfortunately, that is not a guarantee.

 

Well I guess I can wait till Monday when I can measure it.

 

Not exactly true Joe.The RPO Y68 did not include the center body pot metal chrome. It was full wheel opening mouldings that went down to the rocker chrome. the rear was two mouldings that went above and below the spears and rocket emblem. No club coupes had the pot metal side chrome

 

OK, thanks for the clarification. My whole point was that all the speculation about what model the car was based on the photo was kind of a waste of time.

 

Well the seller has the car in for a mandatory safety inspection. It did well but he failed the wipers. The motor was working intermittently. Long story short it’ll be Thursday before he gets a new wiper motor in and installed.

 

The car is just home. Quick check of the plate says 33527. That would be F85 Deluxe, Sports Coupe.

I also noticed the main pulley only has one groove and assume I would need one with another groove for a power steering pump? Or is it driven off the water pump pulley which is single on this motor as well.

 

Power steering is installed! Pretty straight forward job. I got used pump, pulleys and brackets and bought a new box, hoses, belts and pitman arm. I was worried about getting the steering wheel properly clocked but the rag joint came already installed on the steering box and the pitman arm only fits on in 4 positions so as long as it's pointing similar to the old one you can't get it wrong. I did end up with the wheel being only slightly off but that can be corrected with tie rod ends adjustment. Thankfully the steering is not super easy like some older gm p.s.vehicles so it still has some nice road feel. I also scored a nice Optikleen bottle on Ebay that's on it's way.