naphtali5725

Hello guys,
Disabled Vet here, low income...
I'd like a little more input on the following...(thanks smitty for all your input, offers of help and work so far!)

What considerations should be taken into account for a 1974 455 F-F5 block street engine that would be able to run 3-3500 rpm for an extended period of time, say 10+ hours of freeway driving, and still produce in the 450hp/550tq range?(is that a realistic expectation?) What would be the max upper rpm limit be on something like this?(how long could you run it near max recommended rpm)?

67 GMC stepside pickup, muncie 4 speed, and 3.54 rear. It will never ever see a drag strip, just a daily driver.

Would a stock bottom end be sufficient? I would like to use my stock crank it will be turned .010/.010. Hopefully non "J" cast iron heads. a company donated to me the following new parts - cast 10:1 small dish stock pistons/rings, Melling HV oil pump, oil pump drive shaft, and timing set. Clevite main/rod/cam bearings. Felpro gasket set.

The motor came with a set of J heads, and another company kindly donated to me a set of freshly rebuilt heads, stock type new small valves, springs, locks. But they gave me one C head and one J head dangit.

Will stock rods be ok? Or do I need to get Eagles or other brand? ( i know i'll need new pistons if I go floating pin style rods)
Camshaft suggestions?
Intake suggestions?
Will stock valve train be ok?
Do I need a larger oil pan?
I plan on using a 17058241 QJet
Flywheel/balancer suggestions?
Internal or External balance of the rotating assembly?
Most trouble free distributor?
Will stock water pump be ok?

I know these are a lot of questions, but I just want to make sure I get as much input as possible so I can build once and have it last like a new engine off the Olds assembly line, but not spend the thousands of dollars I see in posts here for the 1/4 mile guys( i just will never have that kind of money), and still make considerably more power than stock.

Kindest regards

bccan

First thing that crossed my mind reading your post is a question. Would you consider an overdrive trans in place of the beloved Muncie or possibly adding an OD unit? Not exactly low budget items but can help in your driving situation.

IMO that might be a good way to not only keep the engine speed down in the 2000-2500 range @ highway speeds (70-85) but would be a lot easier on fuel consumption if it is doing that much driving. Keeping the rpm down would make your build less expensive, sort of trading engine dollars into driveline dolars.

Your power goal is not hard to meet & can retain good manners w/ a big bias toward torque. Check my sig line for specs as an idea - conservative cam, dual plane intake, headers. Stock bottom end, maybe use good rod bolts if rebuilding. A deep pan is never a bad idea but still probably not necessary to do what you want to do. I would use one if budget allows.

For example my car w/ 3.90, short tires & OD trans cruises @ 2000 rpm @ 60, 2300 rpm @ 70, 2500 @ 80 - doesn't even reach the point of effortless, I am just barely off the idle circuit & the slightest flex of a toe hair i gain 10 mph without knowing it. It is very pleasant, quiet & unstressed in all situations (except WOT) but especially constant highway speeds above 55mph.

I know that isn't a lot of detail, just thoughts & an example of something in your power range & how it would suit your driving parameters.

naphtali5725

Thank you for the reply,
I have thought about an automatic overdrive, but the truck came from the factory as manual, and I want to keep it that way if possible, and a good overdrive to handle the torque of the BBO would run about 2000+ dollars.(unless anyone knows something otherwise) I'd prefer to put any money I do have into the engine. With the 1:1 final ratio of the Muncie, I just estimated the rpm to be about in the 3000+ range, cruising up to, and around 80+ on the interstate, perhaps I am off a little bit, but even so...I still wanted to know what it takes to run a BBO in that rpm range for a loooong road trip and meet my power goal.

That is why I asked for the specific recommendations in my OP to get an idea of what kind of cost i'm up for, and I know folks here hate to hear the phrase "limited budget".

Kind regards

cutlassefi

[QUOTE=naphtali5725;422242]Thank you for the reply,
I have thought about an automatic overdrive, but the truck came from the factory as manual, and I want to keep it that way if possible, and a good overdrive to handle the torque of the BBO would run about 2000+ dollars.(unless anyone knows something otherwise) I'd prefer to put that money into the engine. With the 1:1 final ratio of the Muncie, I just estimated the rpm to be about in the 3000+ range, cruising around 80+ on the interstate, perhaps I am off a little bit, but even so...I still wanted to know what it takes to run a BBO in that rpm range for a loooong road trip and meet my power goal.

That is why I asked for the specific recommendations in my OP to get an idea of what kind of cost i'm up for, and I know folks here hate to hear the phrase "limited budget".



But in order to make 450/550 you're still going to have to spend some $$$, period.
400/500 would be cheaper. To get the extra 50/50 you're looking at either some additional head work ($$$) or more cam/carb, which won't drive as well.
Just my opinion but I'd shoot for the 400hp/500+tq and use a taller tire on your truck, that should give you what you're looking for.

naphtali5725

[QUOTE=cutlassefi;422247]I'm trying to get some more input/suggestions from others that have the power range I am looking for, that can give real world examples of cruising long periods in that rpm range (3000+). I really hate to resort to a 700r4 auto or something like that.

I would be completely fine with the 400/500 numbers if it is more realistic for a my conservative budget.

I'll be running 15 inch Cragar SS rims, when you say taller tire, what do you recommend?

Kindest regards

bccan

Just checked up on thread - OD trans can still be a stick, I believe you can even replace the 3-4 gear cluster in the Muncie w/ a 1:1 third & OD (.8?) fourth. Some poking around the inet should provide insight. I haven't had any experience w/ it though.

I agree w/ Mark - dropping those figures a tad will still have you where it will be fun, but allow stock, small valve heads to work without upsetting the engine's manners. Dual plane intake w/ Qjet, recurved HEI. "Factory" type balance, just more precise so flywheels & balancers do not present a problem if ever changed.

naphtali5725

Hey bccan,

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll poke around about the OD 4th in a muncie, maybe it's cheaper that way.

Thats all i'm looking for really. keeping a professionally built stock long block with a good manifold/headers/cam, that will be a daily sleeper type driver and for long hauls.

joepenoso

The stock olds could take 3,500 rpm all day assuming no sludge in the return. Better gas mileage would result in using the torque at a lower rpm at a given speed. So 2 thousand rev's equals better mileage at 120 KPH than 3 thousand
All the best
joepenoso

edzolz

Also you might look at finding a mid to late 80's Chevy pickup four speed with the fourth gear o.d. They are not easy to find but they are very stout, built by New Process (same as Dodge hemi). I bought one for $75. The bolt pattern is the same as Muncie and they are the same length. Mount location is the same. You will have to turn down the front bearing cover to fit the bell housing unless you have the bell for that transmission.

Redog

First off, thank you for serving our country!

OK Would a slightly shorter gear be out of the question? 3.42? 3.23? Not that 3.54 is bad, but I'm thinking of the gas prices. My old Delta 88 had an Olds 350 swap with a TH400 and 3.42's out back and it avg'ed 8 MPG. It wasn't my daliy driver though.

Taller tires could be had buy looking at the tire size calc right here. I use this one all the time. Don't know if your 67 has the speedo gears in the front wheel or the transmission. taller tires will effect your speedo and odometer.

Personally, I like the newer versions of the HEI. Something in the mid to late 70's cars. Maybe as new as 81? Something with the coil in cap, and a vacuum advance on it. Can be gotten at any auto parts store for about $120. No need for an expensvie disturbor, unless your running in the 8's in the 1/4 mile, and even then it's not necessary.

Intake manifold? You have more options with the big block than the small block, but I'm assuming you want it all to fit under the stock hood? If you're using something other than a stock manifold, you may need an adapter plate for the Q-Jett carb. They sell them at Summit, but I forget the cost. You could fab up a dual snokel intake set-up, but on a daily, I personally don't think its a good idea. I don't suggest this company, just because I think they are overpriced, but you'll get the idea. I'm working on a dual set-up on my car, using a stock 442 air cleaner.

Bigger oil pan? If you're going to be running a Meiling HV oil pump, then yes. The HV oil pump pumps 25% more oil and will suck a 4 quart pan dry. They say to use at least a 5 quart pan, but I have a 7 quart on my build. You start having problems with this at 5000 RPM's and althought you're not racing the truck, your still merging on highways and a manual tranny. With all the power, you might want to spank a ricer ever now and then. Why limit all this stuff?

Cam? Hmmmm that's a tough one. I think Comp Cams has a calc on thir site that will help you pick a cam for what you want. You'll need a streetable idle, enough vacuum to run power brakes (if you have them) and able to run accessories like Alternator, PS and AC. Plus the cam is the heart, you pick the flywheel and convertor based on that.

I think you'll be fine with a stock water pump. Pick up one for an AC car. Better cooling. A decent raditior fan will help too? Electric? Manual? I'm not going there. That sparked a pretty nasty debate on RPO a few years ago. It kinda spilled on here too. Pick what you like, and keep in quiet.

I understand about the manual Munice over an auto tranny. If you break down and get an auto, a 200R4 will bolt right up to your 455, but look for that .8 OD gear. Sounds like the best of both worlds right there

And I like this for the gear ratio v speed http://www.f-body.org/gears/

Have fun and keep us posted