had the first hard freeze since getting the cutlass (455). the carb isnt getting fuel to it. pulled fuel line going into fuel pump and its dry. just put fuel in it the day before the freeze so im not sure what to do next. the only thing i can think of is the fuel line freezing up somehow. has anyone else had this problem, or maybe the fuel pump died in the freeze.

thanks for the help

 

Is it still below freezing? If so, there could be water in the tank. Water is heavier than gasoline so it would sit on the bottom of the tank or maybe in the line and freeze.

 

Is the car sitting in an area where the temp is above or below freezing at the moment?
How much fuel did you put in it the day before? Can you hook some compressed air and blow the line from the fuel pump back into the tank? The pump will not pump fuel that is not there, so it's probably not the pump. Also check the rubber line for cracks that is between the tank and the main line to the pump.

 

it must be water in the tank and not being able to pull fuel. its right at freezing right now. thanks for the input. i drive my self crazy sometimes trying to fix something and there is no way to fix this just put it some where warm and wait

 

They sell fuel system antifreeze, it's alcohol based. Sold at most parts stores. When the temps are very low it helps to keep the fuel tank full.

 

I agree, it's probably water in the tank; today's ethanol-laced fuel tends to pull water out of the air, and it will go to the bottom of the tank, where the fuel pickup tube is. And it's not unusual to get water in fuel from the service station, as they have the same problem with condensation!

Only warm weather will thaw the ice, but it would not hurt to use some isopropyl alcohol to soak up the water, so it will burn.

There are additives such as Sta-Bil Marine fuel treatment to help stabilize the fuel, and emulsify the water.....but it is not cheap! I use it on all my outdoor equipment, because today's gas has a shelf life of about 3 weeks!

 

+2 on the Stabil, I use it on all my lawn equipment, my bike, and cars during storage. I have got into this habit many years ago with a gummed up carb from bad gas. In our part of the world gas line anti-freeze helps where stored in the cold. Also a full tank will keep condensation from forming.

Mark

 

all good replies but if you have more than a capful of water in your tank you need to drop the tank and drain the water, gasline antifreeze stabil etc will bind w the water molecules and allow them to be drawn out but w a lot of water you just cant get enough AF in there to get it out.

I bought a f250 15years old 15k miles owner said sometimes it spits at ya I throw a little AF in the tank.... one week of stalling and no starts and me throwing AF in the tank and i dropped the tank and found about a 1/2 gallon of water in there no problems after that !!!!

 

It might be that bad but I'll try a few products first. The pains of moving from florida to colorado.

 

You don't live in MI do you?
Dropping the tank can be a $500 project in Michigan.
Maybe not on a Cutlass, but any fuel injected vehicle.

 

mass

it was a 79 f250 in the early 90s. Funny side story one time I had my buddy tow the f250 after it died to my house about a mile away w his VW rabbit. that was about the last straw before I dropped the tank (for free)

 

I suggest you get the car indoors to de-thaw and then make sure you run gas line antifreeze (methanol) in your tank. Chances are you have a lot of condensation in your system and even a little swimming pool in your carb especially if you just ran the tank low.

Sometimes you just need to thaw everything out. Hope this helps and good luck.

 

cant keep the project in the garage because the dam rabbits love new car wires....(what idiot decided to make wires out of soy bean) and of course i live on a base so everything is protected.....

 

Very common years ago up here. We kept some of the gas line anti-freeze around for carbureted vehicles in winter. EFI is a ton better in freezing temps.

 

First really cold winter???

As others have noted, this is a very common problem for carbureted cars in cold climates. Water in the tank (either from the gas station's underground storage tanks or from condensation) gets into the lines and freezes. Since the fuel pump is sucking at only a few PSI, it can't overcome the obstruction, so no fuel. The only fix now is to get the car into a heated garage to melt the ice, since there's no way to know where it is. Once melted, get fuel additive to eliminate the water. As noted, these are all alcohol based. The alcohol is hygroscopic and absorbs the water, allowing it to be burned (OK, vaporized) in the combustion chamber.

 

I hope the irony of adding an alcohol product to the gas tank to help resolve a problem made worse by the petrol companies having added alcohol to the fuel is not lost on everyone.

Put away your tinfoil hat, there is no conspiracy here. We had frozen gas lines far more frequently in the 1960s, looooong before ethanol was ever added to gasoline.

 

Yes, frozen gas lines were constantly a problem in the cold; part of that problem was probably due to the fact that gasoline storage tanks underground always leaked, and water got into the tank even before you filled your car's gas tank! I don't know how many times I had just filled up with fresh gas, only to have the car quit 5 miles down the road, and had to be towed.

What "frosts" me the most is that we are required to have ethanol in our gas, when it decreases the fuel mileage (at almost $4.00/gal., it's not to be sneezed at!), and is highly detrimental to anyone driving an older car not designed for the corrosive properties of alcohol!

 

I don't disagree, but that is the fault of congress and the big agriculture lobby and is unrelated to the frozen gas line problem.

 

Water in gas station fuel storage tanks has been an issue since the dawn of time. It used to be gas stations were required to check for water content periodically and if there was more than a specified level at the bottom of the tank then it needed to be pumped out.


When I was a kid we used a long wooden measuring stick and litmus paste.

 

Hmmm... I don't remember posting that second part at all.

 

Ended up putting a small bottle full of gas on the hose leading into the pump. It sucked two of them dry and then ran like a dream again. Dripping water out the tail pipe like crazy at the moment hopefully it doesn't turn into the an ice cap in colorado tonight. Thanks for the help would have pulled my hair out without it

 

The water out the tailpipe is normal. I hope you added some gas line antifreeze to your tank. Now, if there is a lot of water in there, it will freeze again.

 

Water in the fuel could be directly related to your other thread regarding a strange smell too!

 

Just a note about the effect of alcohol in gasoline with regard to water and ice:

Water is a "polar" solvent, which means that its molecules have electrically positive and negative ends, which tend to line up in accordance to their polarity, sort of like iron filings with a magnet.

Gasoline (and all other "oil-based" solvents) is a "non-polar" solvent and its molecules do not have positive and negative ends.

These facts result in different behaviors of the two substances, and in the well known fact that water and oil, or water and gasoline, don't mix (actually, they can mix, but only very slightly).

Alcohols have a polar end (an oxygen connected to a hydrogen, which is the better part of a water molecule) and a non-polar end (methanol has methane, ethanol has ethane, isopropanol has isopropane, etc.), which allows them to mix with both polar and non-polar solvents.

If you buy alcohol in the store, you can get rubbing alcohol (isopropanol) in various concentrations, such as 70% and 91%. The other part is water.
You can also get ethanol in various concentrations, such as 80 proof (40%) and 151 proof (75%), and the other part is mostly water (along with sugars and other stuff).
Everyone knows that if you put ice cubes in a glass of scotch, the water will mix with the scotch, and will not sit in the bottom of the glass with the scotch on top, because water and alcohol mix readily. You can do the experiment at home right now and prove it (even though it's not noon yet ).
The other experiment is to take some fairly concentrated alcohol (such as 91% isopropanol) and mix it with an equal amount of water - if you mix 1 cup of alcohol and 1 cup of water, you will end up with LESS than 2 cups of the mixture, because the molecules fit between each other when they dissolve.

You can also mix alcohol with oil or gasoline, and you will discover that they mix together as well. Alcohols with non-polar ends that are more like the oil or gasoline will mix better than ones that are less similar (so methanol and ethanol will mix better than isopropanol).

The point here is that the more alcohol is mixed with gasoline, the more water will be held dissolved in the solution, rather than being allowed to separate and sink to the bottom, where it can be sucked into the lines and freeze.

In practice, the mandatory addition of ethanol to gasoline, though it reduces the energy contained in a gallon of gas (an alcohol molecule has less energy than a gasoline molecule), and therefore reduces gas mileage, also serves to prevent fuel line icing.
As has been stated above, frozen fuel lines were a very common occurrence back in the "good old days," when there was no alcohol in the gasoline to prevent it, and we used to intentionally ADD alcohol to our gas in order to prevent it. They happen less now, because of the mandatory alcohol in the gasoline, though this same alcohol does decrease our fuel economy, and also causes accelerated corrosion by allowing more water to be suspended in the gasoline and holding it against all of our fuel system parts.

- Eric

 

Thanks, Eric!

That's a very good simple explanation of just why nobody can get the fuel mileage out of their older cars that they used to get! And alcohol is very corrosive to fuel system parts, especially carburetors and fuel pumps and rubber fuel system components. Newer cars do no have that problem, as they are "hopefully" designed for it!

That said, I think I will try your suggestion of ice cubes in a glass of alcohol.....although I prefer bourbon, rye, or gin to scotch!

 

All good post here. You very well may need to drop the tank and start from scratch with a known water-less fuel tank. Good time to inspect the tank, sender, hard & soft line & sock etc...
Bottom line is after you verify your water-less is... 1. store your car with a full tank. 2. add the marine (blue) stabil to said full tank. 3. Use the isopropyl (not the methanol based) fuel line antifreeze. 4. If you can find it in your area only gas up with non-ethanol gas. The Fastracks have it around me. Its all I run in my old school machines cars, mowers, saws, gen-set etc...ethanol isnt designed to go into old school machines...especially ones that spend a lot of time sitting. Dam big brother federal regulations...now they want it to go to 15% ethanol! Pretty soon well be back to steam engines

 

yes sir, put a whole bottle of heet and filled her up. i wont be dealing with that again

 

nope cant do steam its just to much smoke............ flintstone cars are the future. i can get you started today for a very low price even "recycle" that old republican engine for u..............( i wouldnt mind working on mine and running yours for awhile)