What are your thoughts around building the engine around limited traction. Car is a 86 2 dr cutlass stock wheel tub no frame notch.Street slicks,anti rollbar,QA shocks,light front end with spings set up for good weight transfer.At the track car will also have true slicks as well to use. 373 rear gear,2004r stock gear ratio trans.

Why have more TQ than traction?
Why have more hp than tracktion?

From what I read a good cut off point is mid 11's for dollar value and have it still fun to drive on the street?

So how would you go about building the engine around traction and et goals?

The reason I think I should go with a stock stroke and small over bore is the small over bore will give me better ring seal and run cooler and another rebore should things go wrong. Stock stroke becuase I do not need any more tq because it will be hard to use what the stock stroke engine will put out.

Good, bad or poor idea.


So how would you select your cam?


What would you do to a set of ebrock heads?
1. Out of the box?
2. mild port work?
3. health port and polish?

Intake manifold?
1.Perfomer dual plane
2.Holly street dom
3.Offy
4.other
5.Ebrock TQ

Headers 1 7/8" or 2''


Comp ratio?



What would you do to build your engine around your traction and street drivability?
or
Just build a insane hp/tq engine and back pedal till the car hooks?

 

My thoughts...
For a race car build as much power as you can afford and make it hook.
Most street cars simply won't be able to put down as much power, but I wouldn't limit my engine build because of that. A street car you'll be accelerating hard while already moving. So while it may not hook up with 500hp from a light, you should be able to put it all down while already rolling at 30, 50, 70 mph...

My stock suspension 05 GTO M6 couldn't hook up off the line to save it's life, but it pulled great while already rolling.

 

My 455 set up isn't much different than what you're describing. Good size cam, Dave Smith SS polished CC's heads, TRW forged pistons, making everything 10.25 compression, and Edelbrock Performer dual plane intake, 1-5/8 headers. 3.73 posi axle, and 700R4 tranny. Thing burns out the 255 street rubber, like you wouldn't believe. Used to have a breathed on 403, with a Holley Street Dominator single plane intake, and torque wasn't so good. Was conviced to swith out to a dual plane Performer, so did, and torque jumped right up. Maybe, a single plane is what you're looking for on the track, as pull stronger up high.

 

I could not get my mild 355 to hook with street radials. You aren't with a nasty 455. However, IMO good grag radials (I like M/Ts) should be all that you need to run a good number. I ran 12.7 with no burn out and 28 psi hitting the N2O off the line. 60' was 1.75. Even with a big engine in a light car, 11s are no piece of cake, don't assume that you are going to drop it in and go. There are always bugs to work out. My first run was 19.5. Had a nasty vapor lock that did not show up on the street. You have not mentioned a fuel system but you are probably going to need to upgrade the fuel delivery to run mid 11s.

The reality is if you build a pump gas 10 to 1 468 that runs 12.3 and is fun to drive, I bet you will be happy. Better that than wreck the manners and reliability for another half second that really isn't going to matter.

Or, like I suggested, build a nice little 9 to 1 engine that runs mid 13s and spray it and go high 11s on race day.

 

Assuming your still leaning toward the 455 traction will always be a issue on the street. Its really hard to kill the torque that a 455 produces. Put as much tire that will fit (my 87 Cutlass fit 275/60R15 ET Streets easy) spend some time boxing the lower control arms and replace the bushings (aftermarket control arms would be even better) and use a gear ratio a converter that makes the best use of the 455 torque. I love the feeling of a torquey engine! I like to steer the front of the car with the steering wheel, the rear of the car with the gas pedal! Build a stout 455 with pump gas friendly compression, a good set of heads, a modern camshaft that makes good power under 5500, spend the money on the fuel system and exhaust, then work on the suspension to get the car to hook. Assuming all that is done correctly I would be very surprised if the car doesn't run a mid to low 12 easy. There is a lot of e.t. in 60ft times, make the car fun to drive then figure out tire pressure, launch technique, air bag pressure, etc.

 

I just bought this car it ran low 12's and dipped into the 11's this is the tires it had 30 x 10.5 but it ran mid 12's on a 275 60 15 hoosier dot drag radial after he made it faster he went to this tire all it has for suspension is air bags ain the rear and coil spring slapper bars the adjustable type . dunno how big of a tire you can fit behind a g body but this tire is pretty big as is in an a body . Traction on the street is non exsisting with the slicks or the drag radials or eve regular bfg's same size as the hoosiers. Thats only if im on it lol.

 

Thanks for the replys. The car is getting a frame off I will be boxing the frame and bracing the rear suspension mounts. 1/2'' fule line in tank pump with 3/8 return.pollybody frame bushings and boxed lower arms and adjustable uppers.I have spent years collecting rare/hard to find parts and have most of what I need.I'm a few years away from going down the track as I want the car to be looker as well as quick.
I know you don't just throw parts togther and run a 11.50 out of the box.I like to take my time with the build and enjoy the process as i think this will be my last build.I hate doing things twice,I like to sand blast/strip and paint/factory plate every part. I know the car will not be worth 1/3 of what I will have in it unless G body's start to be worth a lot more. I will be going with the 455. I have to thank all the negative post on the 403 open main webs. It was going to cost me the same to build a 403/350 as a 455 so I had a change of heart. I was able to sell my big valve 5 heads for a healthy loss but feel it was the smart move.

 

Good choice to go with the 455. I would agree with the other posts, it's kind of pointless to build a 455 with the primary goal of getting it to hook. It won't. But on the upside, as has been mentioned, things that hurt torque on other motors aren't such a big deal on the 455, and they help up top. I'm thinking about a Torker. On cam, my motor has a "mild cam" I was told, it would easily tolerate more. Don't go nuts, but I'd recommend more than just "mild". On headers, I really like the Hooker 3203s. They go over the frame, which hurts turning radius slightly, but I don't mind this and I don't like mini starters. CR I'd keep under 10:1 for pump gas, you might get away with a bit more running aluminum heads.

 

Here is a link to my car specs:

http://72.22.90.30/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=77901

I think you are looking for similar results. You could easily substitute the fully ported iron heads for a set of Edelbrocks with some minor port work. I would have went this route but I wanted to keep more of a stock sleeper look under the hood. I drive this car a lot on the street and it is what I feel to be a perfect compromise between race car and street car. There are some simple things I could change to go a lot faster (higher stall, deeper gears, more cam) but all of those would make it less enjoyable on the street. Also I would then need a rollbar which I am not interested in for this particular car.

 

Thanks for the link nice build! What are you running for bearing clearance?

 

It is .0023-.0025 on the rods and .0025-.0027 on the mains. You don't need giant clearances like some claim you do.