jo75olds

Well now I feel stupid, but I was always told there is no such thing as a stupid question, SO with that in mind

What spark plugs do you use, and how do you like them?

oldcutlass

Actually there is such a thing as a stupid question, this one is not! I personally don't like champion, however, I've never had any problems with AC Delco, motorcraft, NGK. In the past my older cars really did not enjoy the new platinums.

Steve O

I use the Bosch platinums in the drivers and leave em in for the life of the car or truck....

Their supposed to be good for 100,000 miles, I rarely keep a vehicle that long though...

I did run some in a 350 Olds for 80,000 miles, I figured I should change em so I put in some new AC's... The car didn't run any better so I took em out and put the platinums back in

ah64pilot

NGK's for performance. Gap them to .045"

jo75olds

This is true, I work as an IT Tech, and trust me I know.

jo75olds

Thanks guys, I really do apprecaite the input, as I know others will too, I usuly use ACDelcos ("Keep your GM Car, GM") but was thinking about going to one of the more "performance" ones for my new 455 build. I may give the NGKs a shot, will prob use ACDelcos for the break in, then swap in a set of NGKs and see how they do.

ah64pilot

NGK's for break in, NGK's for running...Delco's are overpriced. And what a gimmick, "keep your GM car, GM". I've had 2 Delco plugs out of the last 24 have loose porcelain sections (other cars, not mine...I won't run Delco's) Either way, good luck on the break-in. Use http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/brk.aspx for added insurance. (I posted it in another thread 2 min ago so I figured while I had it copied I'd 'control V' it here for you

jo75olds

Thanks, I'll use NGK's!

Also is it ture that you have to change after the break in, or is it just good policy, or just a sales gimick put out by the spark plug companies

nonhog

Interested to know more about this. As do some plugs work better than others at certain power levels?
Steve O glad Bosch work for you. I know its off topic but years back I wrote service at a Toyota dealer and could not count how many sets of Bosch platinums we pulled out of rough running Toyotas and installed N.D.
(NGK came factory) and problem solved. Not sure why? but it made me follow OEM suggeted parts.
Not saying thats best on Olds engines. I'm new to Olds. And willing to learn.

Good question!

ah64pilot

This is all a matter of reading your plugs. When you break in an engine, you are seating the rings to the cylinder wall. On first start up, oil will seep by the rings but will seep less as the rings seat against the wall. Depending on how much oil gets by at first crank, the plugs may be a little wet with oil after break in. If they are oil soaked, it may be a good idea to replace them with new ones for the rest of the 500 mile break in period. If they don't look too bad, there is no reason to change them.

Platinum plugs are designed for longevity, not performance. Many inexperienced do-it-yourself people gap the platinum plugs. This does nothing but remove the platinum coating, making the plug a regular run of the mill plug. It can actually be detrimental to the performance of the plug as the platinum plugs are designed to work with a specific gap. This may be the reason Hog saw so many rough running Toy's with platinum plugs.

Lady72nRob71

Not on this forum 'cause I done asked them all...

Here is a good spark plug thread that puts Bosch to shame...
https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...iode-gone.html

my442conv

1970 442 455/365 the spark plug gap calls for .030, would the gap be different if it has HEI electronic Distributor?

rustyroger

[QUOTE
Steve O glad Bosch work for you. I know its off topic but years back I wrote service at a Toyota dealer and could not count how many sets of Bosch platinums we pulled out of rough running Toyotas and installed N.D.
(NGK came factory) and problem solved. [/QUOTE]

I had problems with Bosch platinum plugs in the late '80s as well.
The problems had two causes;
#1, this was because they coated with lead oxide (unleaded fuel was just coming into the British market then).
#2, most cars on the British market still had points ignition and couldn't generate the voltage to fire across the large plug gap on the platinum plug properly.
Regapping the plug normally wiped the microscopically thin layer of platinum from the plug and the very thin center electrode burnt out very quickly.

A smart question is one to which you don't know the answer, when I ask computer techs or bricklayers or financiers a question it's because I don't know the answer.
Never be afraid to ask if you don't know, the smartasses who roll their eyes at your "dumb" question probably don't know enough to give you an answer in terms you understand.
When I worked at a car dealership a customer complained his interior light didn't work, I showed him how to pull the light switch to turn it on.
He looked embarrased and said "you must think I'm really stupid", I asked him what he did for a living, he told me he was a police officer. So I said "how much do you think I know about law enforcement?".
This made him feel better about himself and we had a happy customer.


Roger.

MX442

Yes, gap .045 with HEI. I run NGK's with no problems. I think .030 is for stock points.

WoofWagon

Roger,

I've run into the same problem with platinum plugs on older engines. The coil systems of those cars just don't have the "wheaties" to properly fire the plugs. A good quality copper plug is best. Remember that electricity is very lazy, it will only use the bare minimum of energy to jump the gap. Increasing spark plug gap will force the ignition coil to a higher energy state.

Of course, this is not always a good thing. Best to look at a plug chart to read the plugs to see if everything is operating correctly.

WoofWagon

What about the NGK VX plugs, anyone run them?

ah64pilot

V power maybe? VX plugs are for motorcycles I believe...

I used to use the V power plugs before I got Edelbrock heads...now I have to use the racing plugs.

WoofWagon

Nope, these are car plugs.

ah64pilot

Those must be a new line...I can't find them anywhere on the NGK website and all I find them for on a google search is for motorcycles. From what I can see they are platinum plugs but there is little information on them.

WoofWagon

I found them on RockAuto for Olds 455.

olds 307 and 403

I have used Bosch platinum, AC Delco regular and rapid fire, Autolite and NGK's in Olds V8's. The rapid fire foul easily. The Bosch were ok as were the Autolite's and AC's. I noticed a good difference in smoother idle and all speeds with the NGK's. Good choice on the NGK's.

442much

I also run NGK's in my 455. For break in oil, don't use synthetic until it's been broken in. Then Amsoil, Mobile One, etc. can be used, IMO.

droptopron

In my 400 I have E3's. They replaced a fairly low mileage set of AC Delcos. I didn't notice any increase in power but the idle seems to be a touch smoother & it seems to start a little easier when hot.

Also for ref, the knock on Champions back in the day was that the ceramic (porcelain?) was too brittle and would crack easier than other brands. No idea if that has been addressed.

Run to Rund

I have run Bosch platinum, but stopped after reading on the 'net that the tip can break off (did not have that happen to me). I have had good service from Autolite 85 in my 1966.

droldsmorland

Autolites... Put em in and forget em. Use with MSD, HEI or Points. Cheap, long lasting and good quality. And USA made...at least the last time I checked.

Texas Jim

Here's an old trick I learned from an old timer years ago. This works especially well w/ the old points ign., but works great w/ the electronic (pointless) ign. also.
Cover the positive electrode w/ a thin piece of sheet metal to protect it from any scrapes. Take a file or dremel/small grinder tool and file the negative electrode back half way over the positive electrode, to where it splits the positive electrode half way-when looking from the top(view). This way you get a thick strip of fire as wide as the positive electrode's diameter instead of a thin line of fire like a regular plug would give. Champion did this w/ their marine plugs in the '50s. I also saw a set of so-called "racing " plugs that were three dollars more a piece than regular plugs and the only difference was the negative electrode was cut half way back over the positive electrode, LOL, and I fell out. I then pulled one of my plugs and showed the guy why I was laughing. You'll beable to feel the difference. This is a great thing well worth doing.

SBORule

I was running Autolite 85's in my SBO 355 and changed to NGK R5 U Groove plugs and went alot quicker & faster.

ELY442

I use to run AC Delco but ever since I try NGK Iridium my Cutlass runs a lot better.

JCMC64

What part number NGK did you all use?

70cutty

I use NGK iridium in all my cars. For Olds part# 7189.
Cheapest ones I found was Ebay $7.40 each.

oldcutlass

I think the spark plug question is like the oil and muffler questions, it boils down to personal preference.

442rocketdave

I use to work for several car magazines and we did alot of tests on plugs and I have been racing and building Oldsmobiles for 4 decades, Champions are junk period, we had notto good experiences with bosch and also the split fires remember electricity will only follow the path of least resistance, we had a lot of cars blowing their intake manifolds with split fires when they were using nitrous. AC works well for street, Autolite worked well also and at the track but the best we found were NGK and we tested Accel, AC, Champion, Champion Gold, Bosch,motorcraft and in high performance applications the NGK's did a great job. There has been alot of people having problems with the e3s also. I would run a little hotter plug for the break in and then read your plugs to determine which heat range is best for your car.

RandyS

Sounds like NGK is the way to go. Found these on eBay. Would these be O.K., or should I shop for the Iridium?

ah64pilot

All of these specialty plugs are made to go many miles...that is it. Guys, if you're not driving your car 15, 000 miles a year or more there is no reason to get the iridium or platinum tipped plugs. You can't gap them for your application because it will either ruin the plating or the spark effect of the plug.

Get the regular NGK's for your car and gap them according to the manual. If you have a hotter engine or are racing you can gap them more or less depending on what you are doing. Of course if youre racing you probably already know this.

You may also experiment with different heat ranges...NGK's website describes the plug number and heat range so you know which part number gives you hotter or colder plugs.

I believe a good starting point are the NGK 3332

cutlassefi

Sorry Steve but that's simply not true. The Iridium and/or platinum goes further into the tip than just the very surface. Not sure who told you otherwise.
But I do agree with the fact that you don't really need them in a car that's not driven much. Most of the things done today are for longevity, and more importantly, emissions. You can't have a misfiring cylinder, messes up the cats and of course further polutes the air.

TripDeuces

The best book I've read on ignitions comes from Dr. Jacobs who made the Jacobs Ignitions back in the day. I think they are still made but the name has changed. Regardless, the book is a great read and will give you all the info you could handle on ignition systems of all types from stock to high performance (he loved the HEI from GM btw).

Spark plugs are the last part in the secondary ignition and nothing more than the last link in the voltage transfer process but also one of the most important. Plugs like E3, Split Fire etc. are just gimmicks and do nothing except provide another ground point for the spark to follow. In actuality they shroud the spark more than anything else. Cutting back the ground electrode as stated earlier is one of the best things you can do to a spark plug. It exposes more spark to the combustion chamber instead of being shrouded under the ground strap.
Voltage likes the path of least resistance and that means very sharp edges on the center and ground electrodes. The sharper the edges they have the easier it is for the spark to happen. A new plug may take only 5k voltage to jump a gap but as it wears away that voltage may double, triple or more. Voltage will sit on that positive electrode until it has sufficient flash over potential. (In nanoseconds of course) At that point the rest of the secondary ignition is getting a workout as the spark may be going elsewhere, like through the spark plug wires insulation instead of the plug itself. This is why you notice a difference with a new set of plugs, everything is working much more easily.
This is the main reason you're seeing "fine wire" center electrodes etc. They provide the least resistance to flash over for the spark. The down side is they wear away faster so you then started seeing the iridium, platinum etc. electrodes coming out so they would last longer between plug changes.
Jacobs stated Autolites and AC lasted the longest and for a reasonably cheap plug those were his choices. Just don't expect them to last 30k miles. Unlike like others here I have never had a problem with Champion plugs and love them but they certainly do not last as long as some others. Since I'll be running aluminum heads now I'd like to try the NGK as I haven't heard a thing bad about them.
Just to keep with my theme on spark plugs..................ACCEL can suck it!

Bernhard

We ran NGK back in the early 80's on are street strip cars and never had a problem.
We also ran AC's but the cars ran better on the NGK's the difference was very little but it still was there. The local speed shop owner recommended them to us.

Never tried Accel but they sure looked good and they had a price to match there looks. The speed shop sold both but the owner said they were a waste of money he only sold them to people that would not buy NGK's the power of magazine adds.

ah64pilot

I wasn't sure what the reasoning was...but I knew that many precious metal tipped plugs say not to gap them and that it is pre set at the factory. Maybe they just put that on the box so shadetree joe won't screw them up...who knows.

cutlassefi

Good info. Jacobs Electronics was purchased by Mallory/Mr. Gasket years ago. They marketed it under the Jacobs name for a number of years but have now folded it into the Mallory line. Look at all the new Mallory coils, they are essentially the old Jacobs design, which by the way was way ahead of it's time.

And I hate to burst your bubble but Accel plugs are now made by NGK, have been for a number of years. They used to be made by Nippondenso but they switched manufacturers years ago. Check out the new ones, much better. They even do a silver tipped plug. Silver tipped plugs are standard equipment in many exotic imports, i.e. Ferrari and others. Silver conducts electricity better than other materials and has a broader heat range as well.

Fun71

To add to the above, one of the big reasons for manufacturers going to fine tipped (platinum, etc) plugs is to meet emissions requirements. When a plug misfires, the unburned fuel goes into the exhaust and increases tailpipe emissions. In order to prevent this, the plug has a very pointed tip that is guaranteed to fire almost every time. The downside to this is the spark will jump the gap at a very low voltage, which is not optimum for performance. Performance cars typically have a high-energy ignition system, but if the plug allows the spark to jump the gap at 5000 Volts, then what is the point of having that 50,000 Volt ignition system?