EightballZ

hey guys..need some advice..

thats the situation:

• got the car after it was sitting in a barn for 4 years...the former owner didnt started the car during that time
• new spark plugs, new spark plug wires, new ignition coil, new oil and filter, new battery, new exhaust manifold gaskets....i've put some oil in every cylinder...engine started after sitting for another 3 weeks...got some fuel leaks at the carb and some dirty reving...bought a rebuilt OEM carb after that (old qjet was from a 1974 pontiac) and new ignition points (set the gap according to shop manual)

now i can't get the engine running...after putting the new qjet on the block i was struggling with all the vacuum hoses...the car has the TCS system..but the old carb didnt had the fittings for it so the vacuum hose from the distributor goes directly to the manifold.

so..to get a clean slow idle...i plugged every vacuum hose and fittings...engine ran with high idle rpm (dont have rpm tach so..i guess about 1.000 rpm) for about 3mins...then stalling...and silence....so..what was that?? i looked over it..first..the slow idle adjustment screw was not hitting the throttle arm..i've changed that. at second...i adjusted the mixing screws..shop manual said..6 full turns out....and after that could see that the air horn gasket on my qjet was a little wet....was not able to start the engine again..only cranking, short rough idle and dying after some seconds....then no starting anymore...ecxept with a little starting fluid into the carb....but its dying instantly

couldnt get any further coz my battery died after cranking the engine that much...

what i'm going to do now?

• pullin the carb for some adjustments (float bowl level etc., acc pump didnt shoot gas)
• plug every vac hose and fittings again ...AND fittings for TCS
• inspect the spark plugs..maybe they r fouled...after all that cranking etc.
• any suggestions??

MDchanic

I think we really need some pictures at this point to be sure what you have -
A car from a barn in Germany could have all sorts of modifications that might not be obvious, but that would affect it now that you've changed the carburetor.

Obviously, they systematic approach is best in these cases (but you guys never had any trouble being systematic... ):

• Check for a good bright spark
• Check for fuel in the carburetor (the fact that it runs on starting fluid implies that you might not have enough)
• Check dwell angle and timing
• If those are good, check compression

If nothing else seems to be working, you could disassemble and clean the old carb and reinstall it, since it worked before, and start over from that point.

- Eric

EightballZ

thx...will try that.

car is all original, no mods except the bypass of TCS system...qjet is #7040252. since its detonatin sometimes during cranking with the pedal to the metal, i don't think it is a "less-fuel" issue...i think it implies a "too-much-fuel" issue.

Oldsmaniac

Bad Gas?

EightballZ

...dont really know what bad gas means...but its from shell and maybe 6 months old (..and increased in value ^^ )

Rickman48

I'd also say bad/dirty gas - put at least 5 gal of premium in the tank, and check the filter.
Maybe install an inline filter to the carb, with drainback protection!

EightballZ

let's say it is really bad gas...why did the engine ran for a couple of minutes??

oldcutlass

Did you drain and clean the fuel tank, purge fuel lines, and replace fuel filter?

The reason your curb idle screw was not touching the stop is probably the choke had not pulled off.

When a car sits for a long period of time there was probably alot of crud/ varnish built up.

EightballZ

i've changed the fuel filter....fuels lines are completely new (carb to gas tank)...and the gas tank had a full resto (in- and outside)

it was the first time fuel rushed through the carb after the rebuilt...and since the carb was kinda wet on the airhorngasket i think its flooded..

the choke plate was fully closed since the engine was cold...as far as i remember it pulled off, but dont really know...i also tried to keep the choke plate open all the time...but it didnt help firing the engine

idle screw was not touching the stop ..has nothin to do with choke pull off cause engine isn't runin, right?

oldcutlass

The choke is mechanical and has a high idle screw on the linkage for the choke operation. Usually it's set for 1000+ RPM.

The 6mo old fuel could be a problem, I would add some fuel modifier with alchohol to deal with any moisture it attracted while sitting. You need a tach/dwell meter, a timing light, and preferrably vacuum gage to get everything set properly.


Your going to have to keep adjusting until you it get to smooth out

Oldsmaniac

What, you never had Chilli, onions and sausage with a little stuffed cabbage mixed in? 6 month old gas is not as bad as 4 year old gas. You coud try to fill the carb thru the vent with a squirt bottle and see if it is low on gas/ poor fuel delivery problem.

EightballZ

hehe

the carb was kinda wet on the airhorngasket ..isnt that an indicator for TOO MUCH fuel?

Oldsmaniac

Could be, wet plugs are surely a sign of too much gas or lack of proper spark. Too high float level will cause spillage out of carb vent and flooding over into carb throat.

oldcutlass

When my airhorn gets wet it generally leads to embarressment.

The excess fuel could be from cranking on it incessantly without it starting.

Go back to basics, all an engine needs is fuel, air and spark, all at the right time to run.

EightballZ

ok..i keep u posted.

MDchanic

If this is a newly rebuilt carb, I would check the float / fuel level.

Remove the air horn with the carb still attached to the car and look to see what the fuel level is - the carb could have been assembled slightly wrong and the float could be sticking (up or down).

You can crank the car with the air horn off and watch to see whether the float, needle, and seat keep the fuel at the right level.

- Eric

Octania

On a QJet, really? What holds the float fulcrum pin down if the air horn is not in place?

I disagree on that point.

Sounds to me like some dirt got washed into the newly rebuilt carb, and is preventing the float from working right. Can you remove the carb and clean it out well? It's not a hard job, with a couple of pointers and special tools.

MDchanic

Your finger.

- Eric

EightballZ

Took the carb off today....intake manifold was filled with gas!!! spark plugs r black....Not oily or wet..only black. Needed to raise float bowl level as well cause it was too low. Fuel filter is clean. Goin to check for any leaks tomorrow ....float bowl didnt lost fuel as it was full as i removed the top plate

EDIT: found no leaks so i put it back on the engine...but now the gas is shootin out of the carb. gonna disassemble the carb again and see if the needle valve is stuck

EightballZ

i think this looks good....right?

just calibrated the float bowl level..gonna try it next weekend

EightballZ

more

EightballZ

even more

MDchanic

It looks like a very clean late-'60s QuadraJet anyway...

Is the air deflector on the bottom of the right hand secondary air valve bent?

- Eric

brown7373

What do you mean the intake was filled with gas? Do you mean wet, or you could suck it out with a straw?

EightballZ

not wet....i found small seas of fuel...(maybe too many outside turns of the mixture screws? shop manual says 6 turns)

about the air deflector...indeed it looks like its bent...gonna take a closer look tonight

brown7373

You said it ran initially. Have you taken the distributor cap off to confirm that the distributor still turns (and also the camshaft) when you crank it? I don't think a misadjusted carb could put rivers of fuel in the intake, unless the valves aren't opening or unless the carb inlet needle / float is not sealing the incoming fuel.

EightballZ

i know the distributor runs well since i tried to get a spark by grounding a spark plug to the block while cranking

found out that the inlet needle was stuck cause it was hanging on the wrong side...somebody put that little hook through one of these two little holes on the float (see pic)

Oldsmaniac

In a similar thread the OP forgot to say that a unregulated high pressure electric fuel pump was used, we are assuming the stock pump is being used here?

EightballZ

exactly....gonne change it though cause its a little leaky at the fitting on the pressure side...nothing serious...just sweating a bit

EightballZ

one more question concerning the mixture screws....that shop manual says 6 turns out...isnt that too much?

is it ok when you cant' see the tip of that screw from the inside of the carb? like this..

oldcutlass

I usually start at three turns out with a vacuum gauge or tach. Then I turn each one out until the vacuum or rpm drops. Then I turn them in to get the highest vacuum and then back out 1/4 turn.

Rickman48

Highest vacuum reading while turning clockwise - do not back off!!
For what, anyway??

MDchanic

To eliminate an off-idle stumble, presumably.

I recall always hearing "turn in until it just begins to drop, then back out ¼ turn."

I just set it for maximum vacuum / idle speed myself, too.

- Eric

oldcutlass

The reason I do this is to start with a rich condition and work my way back. The reason I do it my way is to eliminate starting to adjust in a lean condition!

EightballZ

this requires a running engine...which i dont have..at the moment...

EightballZ

So...the carb is back in the engine....can you tell whats the problem?

http://youtu.be/A-vPvnS15wA

http://youtu.be/W11B9BD_eY0

Rickman48

Fuel filter or clogged sock in tank!!
Put 5-10 gallons of premium in it - should help!

oldcutlass

What do you have for a distributor, points or electronic? Double check your spark plug wires and make sure they go where they are supposed to. If you have points, get a new set and a condensor. Gap the points to .019 on the highpoint of the lobe.


Make sure the choke is pulled off manually and turn your idle speed screw in 1/2 to 1 full turn. Disconnect and cap all the vacuum ports from the carb until you get it to run right and then put them back on 1 at a time.

EightballZ

Points Gap is already set. All vacuum ports are plugged

oldcutlass

Is your timing jumping all over the place?