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I am planning to overhaul my distributor. Install a PerTronix Ignitor module, matching Flame-Thrower coil, PerTronix plug wires, NKG plugs. My engine is a stock 1968 442 - 400 CI. I don't race - just try to get where I am going and back safely.
Anyone have an opinion on the 3 different PerTronix Ignitor models? I assume that the newer Ignitor III is better if you don't mind the extra cost. Has anyone used the new model?
I assume that the PerTronix recommended Flame-Thrower coil is the way to go - versus a stock coil, or some other brand?
The stock coil will work fine with a stock engine. The main difference between the II and the III is a rev limiter. SO if your not racing then the II ahs worked fine for many on here.
Make sure you have 12v to it. Do not use the resistor wire.
I had the first Pertronix Ignitor over 20 years ago. After a couple years, some corrosion got under one of the magnets on the hard plastic ring and fell out. The company sent me a new ring and it did fine after that.
I replaced it with the Crane Xr-i maybe seven years ago. It also has a rev limiter and is far cheaper than the Pertronix III.
So the Ignitor II is all I need. And Crane makes a similar device for less money. Nice advice.
I think my plug wires were installed in 1993. Delco. Only a few thousand miles since then. They don't spark in the dark and seem to work OK. One of the plug connectors was rusty, so I cleaned it up.
The coil may be original. I recently removed it, cleaned it, checked resistance.
I was only going to replace these for reliability (hoped for reliability improvement). They seem OK. But as long as I have everything
apart ...
I don't think the points you buy today are manufactured to the same quality standards as they were back in the 60s and early 70s. There are probably still some quality point sets available, but there is also a lot of cheap foreign crap. Over the last 20 years, I have had more points fail than Pertronix systems fail.
It is important to follow the installation instructions and don't take short cuts or skip steps. Engines that run fine at low to mid rpm might miss at upper rpms if there is too much play (clearance) in the lower distributor gear. Easy to adjust by using the provided shims, but you need to remove the distributor to do it. That is on Ignitor I & II, not sure on the III as I haven't used one of those.
What I like about the Pertronix is if you install it correctly, your car runs like it has brand new points in it at all times. I have one with over 40,000 and nearly 20 years. That is reliability in my book.
I do plan to remove the distributor, clean and lube, make sure everything moves freely.
I know some folks say I should take it to a shop that has a machine to test the advance curve. Not sure if I will be able to do that easily - have not looked for shop near Jackson, MS - or if that is really needed. Maybe it depends on what the distributor looks like once I get it on the bench.
I just installed the Pertronix II and FlameThrower II today. I haven't started the car yet because I'm doing some other work to it (new fuel pump and new valve seals, new fuel filter, and new plugs).
I'll let you know how it worked once I get the car started again.
I had problems with the points in my 67 and after about two years of trying to fine tune the points and still having problems.I got tired of it and bought the petronics kit and it works fine for me.The only thing you notice if you are looking for it is a red wire.Other than that it looks stock with the cap on.But then I found part of my aggervation was the egr that goes in the valve cover was not seating properly.So it was sucking air and making noise.I replaced that and the car starts better and just about purrs.I am happy with the petronics and if for some reason I should want to go back to points I have everything in a box.Not likly to do that though.
I had problems with the points in my 67 and after about two years of trying to fine tune the points and still having problems.I got tired of it and bought the petronics kit and it works fine for me.The only thing you notice if you are looking for it is a red wire.Other than that it looks stock with the cap on.But then I found part of my aggervation was the egr that goes in the valve cover was not seating properly.So it was sucking air and making noise.I replaced that and the car starts better and just about purrs.I am happy with the petronics and if for some reason I should want to go back to points I have everything in a box.Not likly to do that though.
The way you drive your car, I think the Pertronix I and coil are all you need. I have been using Pertronix for years with no problems. I have had one in my boat for years and I have had one in my 54 for about 2 years. You may want to widen your plug gap a little to about 40 or 45 thousandths. As Eric mentioned, you will not see any increase in power but you will have quicker starts and less maintenance.
Personally, I'd say Pertronix II, as it doesn't involve the clunky magnetic ring, but, of course, the first thing I'd say is "What's wrong with points?"
Unless you find GM NOS points from 40 years ago, Mallory or Accel, revving past 4000 can be difficult or impossible with most parts store points. I've used Pertronix in three cars and I liked how the car always felt like it was just tuned up however two of them went bad on me. The car started running poorly, put the points back in temporarily, problem solved. They did replace them. Hard to beat a GM HEI recurved with GM internals.
You don't do that with Oldsmobile engines, because the action of the cam gear turning the distributor pulls the distributor shaft downward toward the distributor body, rather than pushing it away.
Originally Posted by enthusiast
2. There is no ballast resistor on Old's right?
Wrong.
The ballast resistor is the coil wire, from firewall plug to coil, just like a Chebby.
One last question I have a 1969 442 and I don't have a orange or pink wire that I can see in the engine bay that I see referenced in other threads which coincidentally you posted.
And, No, you do not unhook the pink wire, because if you do, you will lose gauges, back up lights, signal lights, power windows, power seat, and cruise control. You tap into the pink wire, like BlueVista said, carefully removing insulation, wrap and solder a wire for your coil, and carefully tape up again, so that there is no chance of the tape unravelling and allowing the connection to contact ground or other wires, which would cause your car to immediately stop running, wherever you were, and possibly cause a dash fire as well.
When I look under the steering column at the fuse panel I see IGN and what looks like a pink wire behind it. Do I remove the two screws holding the fuse panel and splice into the pink wire there?
I am so confused and over complicating this I am sure.
Honestly (and I'm not saying this is easy), what I have done is to find the heavy pink wire where it comes out of the ignition switch, on the top surface of the steering column, just where the pedal pivots are.
You can't get to the switch, but you should be able to get to the wire.
It is reasonable to drop the column (remove trim panel, remove 2 nuts, if column shift A/T, may need to unhook pointer) to gain access to the switch, and to be able to locate the wire with certainty (and have a bit more room to maneuver if you unplug it from the switch).
This is a PIA, but not actually that difficult, so long as you're okay with lying upside down under the dashboard.
You can also remove the firewall plug on the engine side, open up the harness, find the resistor wire, release its terminal, remove the wire from the terminal, solder a new copper wire to the terminal, replace the terminal, replace the firewall plug, and run the new wire, either inside or outside of the harness.
Also, note that the fuse block is also held in place from the engine side by the firewall plug, which is held to the back of the fuse block by a ⅜"-head screw, in addition to the two screws you see on the inside of the car.
I hope that answer was helpful, and didn't make things worse.
I removed the lower cover so I could see a little better under the steering wheel. I see a pink wire that is connected to the top. I can feel the wires at the top of the steering column. Can I just splice into the pink wire at the bottom?
Ignore the ugly wiring. I am still cleaning up the wiring from the previous owner even though I have had the car for decades.
OK. I dropped the steering column and see the pink wire. I am going to splice into this and run to the coil. Do I leave the two black and white wires on the "+" side of the coil stay attached?
Sorry for the delay. Had to eat some good Thai food, drink 2 Zombies (with extra Zomb), walk home, walk the dog, and clean the dog dishes.
Now I've got to get to sleep, because 05:00 comes a lot sooner than I'd like, and the powers that be at work are already mad at me.
Yes, that's the right wire (and those are the right nuts...). You can confirm it by sticking a push pin through the wire and hooking a test light or a meter to it, and confirming expected operation.
I am not certain which wire you mean on the coil (+) terminal.
There should be one pair of wires in a single terminal end, which are the resistor wire and the yellow resistor bypass wire, and one RF suppression condenser screwed to the coil bracket and connected to the (+) terminal with a wire that is probably black.
If you have a tachometer, it should be connected to the coil (-) terminal.
You never know what someone else many have connected there, thought, just to get the +12V feed.
It looks like you have this well in hand. Again, it is always a good idea to confirm the operation of any wire before making permanent changes.
I see the (+) terminal with a single terminal end containing a yellow wire and a black wire, and another terminal with a black wire going to the RF suppression condenser, and the (-) terminal with a black wire to the distributor and another wire to the tachometer.
Lose the crimp connectors and solder everything.
Take a closer look at those (+) wires - the resistor wire is a stiff silver colored nichrome wire with a woven cloth cover.
If the resistor wire is, in fact, absent, then maybe someone eliminated it before you got there.
I disconnected the wires and took off all of the tape back to where they Y off to the starter. I did find where the black wire was doubled in some parts then found a plastic piece with some cloth and nothing else.
I looked closely at the black wire and saw this: "Resistence Do not cut".
Correct me if I am wrong. My assumptions are:
1. The black wire I can coil up and tuck away.
2. Install Pertronix Coil
3. Run a new wire that is spliced from the pink wire on top of the steering column to the + on the coil.
4. Re-connect "yellow" wire to + on coil (it looked yellow once I took some tape off).
5. Install Ignitor II.
Done, drink beer and do a jig.
Last edited by enthusiast; September 2nd, 2016 at 10:56 PM.
(Interesting - I don't think I've encountered a resistor wire with rubber insulation, but there's no reason why it shouldn't be - likely GM used different suppliers at different times).
IMHO, its easier to follow the resistance wire back to the bulkhead connector, remove the pin terminal from the connector. You can buy a replacement pin and crimp a new wire into it or use the old pin and solder a new wire to it. This way you don't have to feed a new wire back through the firewall.
IMHO, its easier to follow the resistance wire back to the bulkhead connector, remove the pin terminal from the connector. You can buy a replacement pin and crimp a new wire into it or use the old pin and solder a new wire to it. This way you don't have to feed a new wire back through the firewall.
Yeah, I'd say that's a preference thing - I hate to mess with an original factory wiring harness that's in good shape, and I don't mind finding a firewall pass-through that has room for one more wire, because that's completely reversible, but there's no question that changing the actual wire inside the harness is also a good technique.
Does it actually start, or does it seem to be starting as long as the ignition switch is held in the START position, and then stop running as soon as the key is released?
So, remember what I was saying earlier about there being two types of ignition switches, and some cars needing to have that bypass wire installed between the starter solenoid and the coil?
June 24th, 2012 | 11:15 AM
