Rickman48

Knowing we all keep our cars a long time, and are buying tires constantly,
Thought I'd make everyone aware of this -

MDchanic

The industry rep. said that there's no scientific evidence that tires over six years old are no good, and there was no scientific or statistical evidence presented anywhere in that ten minute fright fest (“warehouse of death...”) that older tires are any more dangerous than newer ones, never mind any evidence describing HOW dangerous they could be.

Sorry, but as much as I distrust big business, I distrust big media even more.
If big business screws up bad enough, they have to pay out mega millions in lawsuits.
If big media screws up bad enough, they don't even have to print a retraction on the back page of the newspaper.

As they say in the scientific community, “The plural of ‘anecdote’ isn't ‘data.’”

- Eric

oldcutlass

I've changed my tires every 4-6 years whether they needed it or not for my whole life. Everyone thought I was nuts!!!

gearheads78

Preachin' to the choir my brotha'......

oldcutlass

AND the cigerette mfg co's said they were not hazardous to your health for years too! Someday I'll quit smoking, LOL!!!!

Rickman48

I just wonder who ends up responsible - the seller, who should know the difference, or the manufacturer, who probably won't take them back, if expired!
Maybe the D.O.T. will step up! [righty-o!]
I'll be checking mine, soon, as blowouts on Blazers make for some upside-down driving!
Remember those bad 'stones a few years back?

MDchanic

They said this in spite of overwhelming scientific evidence to the contrary.
Many retrospective studies show statistically convincing evidence of correlation between smoking and heart, lung, and vascular diseases and a number of cancers, including bladder, esophagus, and lung.
Many prospective studies show evidence of causality in both human and animal subjects.

This media hatchet job shows no scientific evidence whatsoever.

See the difference?

All tires have failure rates, even new ones.
If 1 in 10,000,000 new tires fails, and 1 in 1,000,000 tires six years old fails, that makes the older tires "ten times more likely to fail."
I don't know about you, but I feel okay about absolute odds of one in a million.

The problem here is that even vague or misleading data such as these (which I just made up) are missing from this story. It's pure "fear mongering."

- Eric

gearheads78

I was in the tire business for quite a while and every time a customer came it and said this tire just came apart on me I could show them where driving underinflated and heat caused the real failure. Its not to say I am recommending finding 30 year old NOS tires to install on your car but if you inspect tire often and keep them inflated you don't get these types of problems 2 years or 8 years old.

1969w3155

I've always wondered about the rate of deterioration of tires that are not exposed to the elements...like UV radiation, and general wear and tear that we expose them to. Sitting in a closed warehouse is not going to cause them to go bad like a dozen eggs. I would have no problem buying a set.

oldcutlass

My point is that I would rather be safe than sorry! I have blown out older performance tires on the h'way at 70 mph, could it be age, either way, it's not fun or pretty. I've also seen tires dry rot here in Texas within 4 years, I've also seen bead failure within 4-6 years. I see approx 1200 cars and trucks/ year and all different types and manufacturers tires. Just my opinion!

Jaybird

Tire Rack has tech info on their site to determine the age of a tire...
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tirete....jsp?techid=11

gearheads78

Just what we need another government body to save us from ourselves.

gearheads78

I tend to agree with you for the most part there. Its more of them saying because the tire has been on a warehouse shelf unmounted its going to make me flip my car when installed.

allyolds68

They were on Explorers not Blazers and Ford required a lower air pressure than Firestone recommended to give the vehicle a better ride. Firestone did not agree with it but went along as Ford was their largest customer.

Like Gearheads said above. The majority of tire failures are due to under-inflation.

oldcutlass

This is the general rule of thumb here, Europe, and Asia pertaining to tire replacement based on age.

oldspackrat

I have an old set of bias ply snow tires on the back of my beater truck that are H78-15s. Ive had them on there for about 3 years after I found them in a barn. Not sure exactly how old they are, but I'd say at least 20-25 years. Tread is still good & they hold air, so I'm rolling with them till they explode or I inherit a newer truck.

2blu442

Have the tire compounds changed? I think about the 1990's cars with paint flaking off in big sheets. I've been told that was an attempt at more enviornmentally friendly paints. So back to tires... when I was a kid driving my $50 car I'd run tires down to the wires. Then go to the local gas station and get another used tire put on for $3. I don't remember big news stories like the Explorers crashing from tire failures. Is tire manufacturing basically the same materials and processes as back in the 1960's and 70's? Did it happen then but just not get the news coverage that we have in today's world? Or does newer vehicle design add to the possibility of loosing control when a tire blows out? John

oldcutlass

Yup, its a miracle we all lived thru our childhoods, no baby seats, no seat belts, no crumple zones, no airbags, no emmision controls, no electronic ignitions, leaded fuel, no ...? Hey, there is always room for improvement. So ignorance is bliss, but stupidity is .....

lansing

New's is slow, ratings are low. Just gearing up for sweeps week. The only real crime here is that guys moustache!

"It's interesting when people die; we need dirty laundry"

Can't remember the name of the group, but that's from the song!

MDchanic

"Got the bubbleheaded bleachblonde - comes on at five.
She can tell you 'bout the plane crash with a gleam in her eye.
It's interesting when people die.
Give us dirty laundry."
- Joe Jackson

And as for "manufacturer recommendations,"
Some may be wise, or may be based on sound science, but I ALWAYS question any instance of the manufacturer or seller of an item telling me to discard their product and buy a new one (and notice that GM refused to play because of a lack of scientific evidence for the recommendation).
There's no question that they've got a vested interest in getting you to buy another of whatever they make.
Things that "expire" even without abuse or damage:

• Motorcycle Helmets
• Baby car seats
• Tires
• Every single thing you can put in your mouth

I'm sure you-all can come up with a few more.

Why does bottled water have an expiration date? Is it going to rot?

I know for a fact that essentially every medicine, prescription and over-the-counter, is perfectly good well beyond its expiration date. The FDA requires drug manufacturers to conduct testing to prove that a given drug IS STILL GOOD as of a given date, NOT to prove WHEN IT GOES BAD. Naturally, any drug company will pick a shorter "service life" to test for than a longer one (why prove it's good after 5 years, when you can prove it's good after one year?), so that it can sell more of its products.
You have no idea how many people throw away perfectly good medicines as though they were poison when the calendar rolls over to the next month.

- Eric

ps: do you really have to use the whole measuring cup of laundry detergent, or will your clothes get just as clean with half as much?

bil

The British recommendation was for 'tyres'.I think "tires" may last a bit longer.Unless they are on a 'lorrie' ---bil

MHENDERSON

There was alot of 4 wheel drives in that building of death!!

redoldsman

For what it is worth, I will give you guys my very recent experience. I drive about 35 miles to work each way and usually drive my 94 Corvette. Due to the ice here this week, I missed two days and worked Thursday. I drove my 99 Expedition. I am on the George Bush Tollroad about half way to work, in the left lane and all of sudden I get this shaking. At first I thought it was a rough patch of ice but then realized it was a flat on my left front tire, I manage to get over to the left shoulder. It was 16 degrees outside. I won't bore you guys with the story of getting the tire changed but I had just passed a Discount Tire Store at the previous exit. I just made a loop around since Discount was where I had purchased the tires. The guy looked at the tire and told me it had blownout. I was going 30 MPH. These were the best Michelins when I bought them a little over 5 years ago. They still had legal tread on them although they would be due to be replaced this year. Fortunately I was driving and only going about 30. My wife and daughter drive the Expedition most of the time and usually have my two grandsons in the backseat. It is scary what could have happened. It is a lesson to me. The other lesson was to check my spare occasionally since it was flat. Thanks to the two guys that stopped to help and the NTTA Courtesy Patrol, things worked out okay.

citcapp

The side walls will crack after long exposure to UV rays. More damaged is done if the car sets exposed to the sun for long periods of time. My motorhome is a prime example only used 6-7 times a year. Tires 5-years old started cracking. Its in a car port now not exposed to sun light. Check out the trucking sites. Independent studies have proved this issue to be a problem. I replace my every 6-years no matter what, I don't need a tire coming apart on me on a 30,000 lb unit. I do the same on my cars too.
As said make up your own mind

Rickman48

Redoldsman - did you check the dates of the tires??
Nephew just checked the dates on his Chevy pickup, and they're a year older than the truck, and he bought it new!!
WTF?? When is new, new??
Now ya gotta check the tires when buying a new vehicle to see if the tires are new??
Why have a build date if it doesn't matter?

OLD SKL 69

Don Henley


BTW, I just keep my tires inflated to the right pressure and inspect them a couple of times a year for cracking. I've had Michelin tires on my wife's Rainier last only 3 years and started cracking between the treads. Also had a set of Generals on my Riv that lasted 13 years before they started cracking. Point is, as long as you inspect your tires and keep them at the right pressure, you can minimize tire failure and maximize tire life.

starfire

[QUOTE=MDchanic;250393]"Got the bubbleheaded bleachblonde - comes on at five.
She can tell you 'bout the plane crash with a gleam in her eye.
It's interesting when people die.
Give us dirty laundry."
- Joe Jackson

Joe Jackson????? Try Don Henley and Danny Kortchmar!

MDchanic

Doh!

And I thought I KNEW that.

Guess what my parents told me about that stuff causing brain damage was true after all...

- Eric

starfire

Ha Ha, I hear that...

If it makes you feel better Jackson did do a song called "Dirty Martini". That's pretty close...

gearheads78

When was the last time you checked the air pressure and what was the outside temp then? If it was an 80 degree day and you set them a 30psi and not a pound had leaked out since then on that 18 degree morning you tire pressure was about 22 PSI just from temperature drop. If you figure you might have lost a fews pounds anyway since the last time you checked then you could have easily been down arond 20 lbs or less. Add the weight of a heavy Expedition and you get a blown out tire.

I not saying this is for sure what has happened to you but its a scenereo I have witnessed time and time again.

svnt442

When I was working for Super Shops back in the early 90's I got 4 Goodyear radials that were take offs from a customers 1972 corvette. He told me they had been on the car since 1976 and had less than 10,000 miles on them. They were 255/60/15s and I gave them a good once over. No cracking and the tread was very nice. So on the Cutlass they went (1970 S w/455). I beat them soooo bad and they never let me down.

I dunno. I think just using common sense and inspecting your tires on a regular basis and keeping the proper inflation in them is the key to longevity.

On the flip side I had a set of Goodyear Wranglers on my S10 that after I moved out to CA just cracked all to hell after about a year. I mean they were just TOAST. They were the second set on the truck and they had been from a junk yard, but were not that old when installed. I had gone looking for one tire to replace a blowout I had and there was a matched set to what was on the truck. Same model and size. So I picked up the set and went about my business.

They lasted about 35,000 miles so I got my monies worth out of them. But I have to say I was shocked at how fast they deteriorated.

rustyroger

Years ago when you got a tank of gas the pump attendant would lift the hood and check the oil & water levels and check the tires as well.
Most cars would need a top up for all three. Nowadays cars use very little oil or water and tires hold pressure for long periods as well. As a consequence most of us have got lazy about routine checks, I guess most people using this forum take more interest than most in performing these simple checks.
If you don't check oil & water levels and the engine fails as a result that would be inconvenient and expensive, if a tire fails it could have fatal consequences. Keeping a close watch on basic checks might save a lot of trouble.
Often when servicing cars I have advised customers they have worn tires and they have asked for the spare to be put on. "its brand new - never been used", I have had to pry the tire from the trunk floor where it has sat for years leaving rubber stuck to the paint. When I tell them I will not put that tire on the road they think I am trying to rip them off for a tire they don't need.
Nothing lasts forever, how long a tire might last depends on a lot of variables, I have come across some that have started to deteriorate after 3 years, others still giving good service after 15 years.
It's your car and your family that rides in it - look after it!.

redoldsman

Interesting about the Michelins and Generals since I replaced the Michelins with a set of Generals. The tires were manufactured in 2005. The tire blewout the sidewall and not between the treads. I keep my tires inflated to 35 psi. I have a digital tire gauge and a portable compressor I use. Yes it is my family and I value them more than anything in life. I think Pat may be onto something with the UV rays since the vehicle always sits outside. That is certainly something to consider going forward. It is still very alarming Michelin tires could do this in 5 years.

gearheads78

Michelin tires are the worst at cracking the sidewalls in the sun. My truck has 4 yo Michelin tires that the tread looks like new and the the sidewalls look like they have been in the desert for 50 years.

redoldsman

Interesting Richard. I have owned lots of Michelins. I don't own any now and doubt I will own any more.

citcapp

I buy Toyo's for heavy duty use on the motorhome and we use them on the companies truck fleet. Never had problems with them

oldcutlass

I've had really good luck with Michelin LTX's on my Dodge deisel truck with no premature degredation and great tread life. Put 60K miles on em, and then tried some Nitto's. Had severe tread speration on those and went back to the LTX's. At the time I was a volunteer firefighter down around the Bulverde area and that terrain ate them Nttos' up.

The thing about tires is it boils down to personal preference and experience. There is no right or wrong tire.

citcapp

Anyone here old enough to remember re-treads, even had winter tires, re-treads with walnut shells in them. Went through a ton of them on my early hotrods (early 60's). Could spin the re-tread right off the casing if you hammered it. $15.00 bucks apiece. Never thought about safety just cheap.

svnt442

A lot of people come into the parts store looking for the "cheapest" they can get.

It just blows my mind when someone comes in with a $100,000 Porsche and wants to buy the $5 wiper blades or put the $2.89 quart of oil in when the manufacturer requires synthetic that costs $7.99 a quart.

I just don't understand why so many people put price above quality and safety. Brake pads/shoes are a prime example of this. Spend the money and get the good friction material. It may save your live or the life of the idiot the walks out in front of you.

navvet

Bottom line ...it does not hurt to check the age of tires. I had mentioned this to the local tire dealer and he told me a few years back he worked for a company that would scour off the date marking on the tires. He would use a small torch and a putty knife and then apply a wet cloth. When he was done you never knew he had even touched the tire.
This was one of the main reasons he started his own tire shop. He has taught his own employees to look for the dates when he orders tires. He said at least once a month he finds tires over 6 years old and sends them back. Last year he ordered snow tires and found a half dozen older then 10 years old.
He said it is simple to check more so when getting tires from a used tire shop or a junk yard.
I was just thinking, I have not checked my spare in the ole 64