Starting a new 350 build this weekend.

J-(Chicago) · 01-09-2008, 06:59 PM

I'll keep you guys posted on the progress. Dug out the freebie 350 from the garage and pulled the intake off today. Water ports look pretty corroded. The water neck isn't even re-usable it rotted so much. The bigger problem is that I don't remember who has my motor chains on permanant loan.

At least the hoist is together.

captjim · 01-10-2008, 11:31 AM

What is the plan, driver or hot-rod? I have a 355 at the shop I work at, bored, honed, align hone checked out OK. Speed pro flat tops and a Voodoo 227/233 cam. Need to get going on the heads.

Redog · 01-10-2008, 12:42 PM

Is there going to be another 350 Delta on the board?

J-(Chicago) · 01-10-2008, 01:05 PM

Yeah, I didn't know what to build, I have so many cores laying around. 3 350s on the floor of the garage right now and a 455 on my stand At the moment. I don't feel like throwing 5 grand at the 455 right now, and it already runs fine with 60,000 Orig. on it. I didn't want to "waste it" on an 80's Delta. Plus I have a spotless th350 w a kit just begging for a new friend.
I'm using the K. I. S. S. method on this one. (keep it simple, stupid)
350ci/th350/350hP/3:08
More specs to come when I'm done playing around on paper.
Let the overtime begin!

J-(Chicago) · 01-10-2008, 01:08 PM

I'm using 7A's if anyone cares.

72CUTTY · 01-10-2008, 02:25 PM

hey j chicago^^ i have a 72 cutlass with a 350.. i want to rebuild it too.. now my question is.. do you think those rebuild kits they sell on ebay are worth it.. i really need help.. sorry for stealing your thread

The_Jeremiah · 01-10-2008, 02:52 PM

i recommend ordering your rebuild kits from northern auto parts (http://www.northernautoparts.com). Or you can call them. They are in Soiux City, they ship fast, have great parts, and great deals. The master rebuild kit for an olds 350 is like 380 i think. Mine ended up being 655 because of all the extra parts i ordered. but the master kit comes with the piston heads, over sized ones are the same price, along with your bearings, plugs, lifters, cam, timing chain, gaskets, oil pump. And you can add almost anything to your order. On top of that it was only like 20 bucks for shipping for me, and i live in washington. Dont do the ones on ebay, its too much of a hassle, and your not getting a good deal

Olds64 · 01-10-2008, 03:42 PM

I would suggest Summit, or Jegs.

captjim · 01-10-2008, 03:57 PM

Guys, be REALLY careful with your piston choices!!! Most "kits" have stock replacement 22cc dish pistons sitting .040-.050 in the hole, brutalizing any chance at decent compression. Even with older 350 heads, cr ends up at 7.5 to 1, and then over-camming. Ask me how I know!!

I have a 355, and after decking .050 off the block, milling the heads down to 60 cc, and using a .039 gasket, I have 9.05 to 1. Intake issues, etc. Get the Speed Pros, and if you need to mill a dish in them to get the CR down to a streetable level. Also, beware the el-cheapo timing chains. If you use them, degree the cam!! Something you should do, anyway. IMO, get the Cloyes, worth the extra $.

72CUTTY · 01-10-2008, 04:14 PM

^^^ damn i gotta look more into it.... i only understand about 25% of what captjim said.. i guess i have to look for a mechanic so he can tell me what do i buy... i did not want to do that.. i wanted to buy the things and just take them to someone to puttem on for me.. i tought it was just putting new flat top pistons, better camshaft. new rings... but its more than that.. i also read that all that wont make a difference if u have the stock gears ? is this true?? sorry for all the questions..

J-(Chicago) · 01-10-2008, 06:24 PM

OH NO!!!!
Don't pawn it!!

Sweet sig picture.

No sweat about the thread-jack, It's going to be a few days till I post any progress anyway. Talk away, and hopefully, someone learns something.

88 coupe · 01-10-2008, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ i only understand about 25% of what captjim said ........

Don't feel bad. I know what he's talking about, and I still don't understand most of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ i have to look for a mechanic ........

You will need one, if you cannot remove and reinstall the engine yourself. You will also need an automotive machine shop. If your mechanic can recommend one, all the better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ so he can tell me what do i buy ........

It is most practical to have the machine shop get all your parts for you. Notice, I did not say cheapest.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ it was just putting new flat top pistons, better camshaft. new rings... but its more than that ........

Your engine block, and heads, will have to be machined to make the new parts fit properly. In order for that to happen, the engine must be removed from the car, and completely dismantled. Upside is: when you get it back from the shop, it will be "squeeky clean".

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ all that wont make a difference if u have the stock gears ........

Rear gears are only a part of your combination. The parts you choose, will depend how you will use the car, and the depth of your pockets.

As for captjim's post? Your machine shop will already know what to look out for, and how to do the job properly.

Norm

captjim · 01-11-2008, 03:58 PM

"
Quote:
Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ i only understand about 25% of what captjim said ........

Don't feel bad. I know what he's talking about, and I still don't understand most of it."

Let me know what you think is inaccurate or what you don't understand, and I'll try and clarify it for you.

Also, NOBODY mentioned working with a builder or a machine shop. The recommendations were Jegs, Summit, and Northern. The pistons that come in those kits are the generic big dish, low comp ones. Norm, you obviously know your sh*t, but why do you feel the need to constantly insult and talk down to people? I don't get it. There are plenty of guys on here who post good practical info without being condescending, patronizing, and rude. You are just not one of them. You go out of your way to be rude and obnoxious, when it is just as easy to be polite.

88 coupe · 01-11-2008, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ i only understand about 25% of what captjim said ........

Don't feel bad. I know what he's talking about, and I still don't understand most of it. ........

Let me know what you think is inaccurate or what you don't understand, and I'll try and clarify it for you ........

You are a bit late. I already explained it to him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ nobody mentioned working with a builder or a machine shop ........

Are these engines going to rebuild themselves?

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ The recommendations were Jegs, Summit, and Northern .........

Only those three? Read the following, again:

Quote:

Originally Posted by 72CUTTY

........ my question is.. do you think those rebuild kits they sell on ebay are worth it ........

Wasn't ebay being discussed?

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ you obviously know your sh*t .......

As I have already explained, several times, it is only an illusion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ why do you feel the need to constantly insult and talk down to people? ........

Why do you feel the need to make vague accusations?

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ I don't get it .........

That is obvious. Maybe you should read my post again. This time, read what is actually in it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ There are plenty of guys on here who post good practical info without being condescending, patronizing, and rude ........

And there are plenty of guys, on here, who discuss that practical information, without resorting to insults/name calling/flaming.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ You are just not one of them ........

Thank you, for confirming that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

........ You go out of your way to be rude and obnoxious, when it is just as easy to be polite.

If you can find an example. Code the quote properly. Then post it, in a PM, along with your objection.

Norm

Olds64 · 01-12-2008, 05:47 AM

Quote:

recommendations were Jegs, Summit, and Northern. The pistons that come in those kits are the generic big dish, low comp ones.

I thought the kits at Summit seemed like a pretty good deal. Do you have bad experience with them? I notice now that all of the kits contain "dish" pistonss; however, they are forged. It also says that they give you about 9.6:1 compression with an 80 cc head.

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...1&autoview=sku

Does anyone have any other suggestions for rebuild kit suppliers?

88 coupe · 01-12-2008, 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

I thought the kits at Summit seemed like a pretty good deal ........

It is a “generic” kit, that will work fine for a “generic” rebuild, and that is good enough for most people. Whether it is worth the price, might be debatable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

........ all of the kits contain "dish" pistons ........

Why not? It's what Olds used. And what I used.

But, since mine are 3900 lb, 11.9 @ 114/116, 91 octane, drive anywhere, cruisers, what I used would be a different topic.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

........ It also says that they give you about 9.6:1 compression with an 80 cc head ........

Using the numbers from TRW-L2323F30, .025" piston top to deck, .040” (compressed) for Fel-Pro Permatorque head gaskets, 0.0" above the top ring, and an 80cc chamber, I came up with 9.33:1

But, I am not a mathematician.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Olds64

........ Does anyone have any other suggestions for rebuild kit suppliers?

Any machine shop should be able to put together a custom kit that will meet ones individual needs, using parts of equal quality, for the same, if not less, money.

Norm

88 coupe · 01-13-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by captjim

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 Coupe

........ But, I am not a mathematician ........

That is obvious. Better go back to math class, Mr Know-it-all. Cr with an 80 cc head, 6cc dish, 4.125 x .040 gasket, and pistons down .025 is 8.3 to 1, not 9.3 to 1. Oh well, it is only one number, no biggie.

You would be more credible, if you used the same numbers as everyone else. They are:

18 cc dish, not 6.

4.25" gasket hole, not 4.125"

Using your numbers, I came up with:

10.12 to 1, not 8.3 to 1

But, since I am not a mathematician, you are probably right.

Norm

captjim · 01-13-2008, 03:46 PM

I deleted that when I realized that the thread had somehow gone from discussing 350s to discussing 455s. The 350 Speed pro dish is 6cc. My bad.

J-(Chicago) · 01-13-2008, 05:53 PM

Motor got a teardown today. This motor was a freebie so I was worried about how rotten it really was. There was almost as much water in the pan as there was oil, and the valley pan had a 1/2'' of carbon in it. Thankfully though it turned out to be a decent core. Hardly a ridge in the cylinder walls, and no bearing scores at all. The only unorigional gaskets on it were the water pump and valve covers.

Does anyone want a freebie cast iron intake?

Makes a great boat anchor for your next fishing trip.

J-(Chicago) · 02-25-2008, 06:46 PM

the 7a Heads are almost done.
4 angle jobber
no porting
207 intake valves
162 exhaust
radiused exhaust seats
30degree intakes instead of stock 45

J-(Chicago) · 02-25-2008, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

Are these engines going to rebuild themselves?
Norm

Lmao.

The_Jeremiah · 02-25-2008, 09:02 PM

LOL you guys are great. and best of luck to you J. I just got my engine done using the northern kit, i might have the "big dish" pistons you guys speak of, but it runs like a top. and i think i got my moneys worth out of it lol.

01-10-2008, 12:42 PM	#3 (permalink)
Redog Alero Chapter Secretary Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Newtown, PA Posts: 776	Is there going to be another 350 Delta on the board? __________________ Me 2000 Alero running 14's 1985 Delta 88 w/1968 350 rocket 2005 Nissan Altima (her's)

01-10-2008, 01:05 PM	#4 (permalink)
J-(Chicago) Seasoned beater pilot. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,588	Yeah, I didn't know what to build, I have so many cores laying around. 3 350s on the floor of the garage right now and a 455 on my stand At the moment. I don't feel like throwing 5 grand at the 455 right now, and it already runs fine with 60,000 Orig. on it. I didn't want to "waste it" on an 80's Delta. Plus I have a spotless th350 w a kit just begging for a new friend. I'm using the K. I. S. S. method on this one. (keep it simple, stupid) 350ci/th350/350hP/3:08 More specs to come when I'm done playing around on paper. Let the overtime begin! __________________ I'd rather have a numbers matching poker hand.

01-10-2008, 01:08 PM	#5 (permalink)
J-(Chicago) Seasoned beater pilot. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,588	I'm using 7A's if anyone cares. __________________ I'd rather have a numbers matching poker hand.

01-10-2008, 02:25 PM	#6 (permalink)
72CUTTY Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bell Gardens, Ca Posts: 28	hey j chicago^^ i have a 72 cutlass with a 350.. i want to rebuild it too.. now my question is.. do you think those rebuild kits they sell on ebay are worth it.. i really need help.. sorry for stealing your thread __________________ 72 Cutlass under construction..

01-10-2008, 02:52 PM	#7 (permalink)
The_Jeremiah Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 248	i recommend ordering your rebuild kits from northern auto parts (http://www.northernautoparts.com). Or you can call them. They are in Soiux City, they ship fast, have great parts, and great deals. The master rebuild kit for an olds 350 is like 380 i think. Mine ended up being 655 because of all the extra parts i ordered. but the master kit comes with the piston heads, over sized ones are the same price, along with your bearings, plugs, lifters, cam, timing chain, gaskets, oil pump. And you can add almost anything to your order. On top of that it was only like 20 bucks for shipping for me, and i live in washington. Dont do the ones on ebay, its too much of a hassle, and your not getting a good deal __________________ 69 Cutlass 4 door. Built 350 inside, grandma's grocery getter outside. Best sleeper in disguise.

01-10-2008, 11:31 AM	#2 (permalink)
captjim Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 149	What is the plan, driver or hot-rod? I have a 355 at the shop I work at, bored, honed, align hone checked out OK. Speed pro flat tops and a Voodoo 227/233 cam. Need to get going on the heads.

01-10-2008, 03:42 PM	#8 (permalink)
Olds64 Landyacht Club President Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Lawton, OK Posts: 1,633	I would suggest Summit, or Jegs. __________________ "Some men are Baptists, others Catholics. My father was an OLDSMOBILE man." Ralphie Billingsley A Christmas Story 1983 "We rei-eign, supreme, ooooh god! Burrito supreme, and a chicken supreme, and a CUTLASS SUPREME!" Tenacious D 2007

01-10-2008, 03:57 PM	#9 (permalink)
captjim Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 149	Guys, be REALLY careful with your piston choices!!! Most "kits" have stock replacement 22cc dish pistons sitting .040-.050 in the hole, brutalizing any chance at decent compression. Even with older 350 heads, cr ends up at 7.5 to 1, and then over-camming. Ask me how I know!! I have a 355, and after decking .050 off the block, milling the heads down to 60 cc, and using a .039 gasket, I have 9.05 to 1. Intake issues, etc. Get the Speed Pros, and if you need to mill a dish in them to get the CR down to a streetable level. Also, beware the el-cheapo timing chains. If you use them, degree the cam!! Something you should do, anyway. IMO, get the Cloyes, worth the extra $.

01-10-2008, 04:14 PM	#10 (permalink)
72CUTTY Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bell Gardens, Ca Posts: 28	^^^ damn i gotta look more into it.... i only understand about 25% of what captjim said.. i guess i have to look for a mechanic so he can tell me what do i buy... i did not want to do that.. i wanted to buy the things and just take them to someone to puttem on for me.. i tought it was just putting new flat top pistons, better camshaft. new rings... but its more than that.. i also read that all that wont make a difference if u have the stock gears ? is this true?? sorry for all the questions.. __________________ 72 Cutlass under construction.. Last edited by 72CUTTY : 01-10-2008 at 04:21 PM.

01-10-2008, 06:24 PM	#11 (permalink)
J-(Chicago) Seasoned beater pilot. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,588	OH NO!!!! Don't pawn it!! Sweet sig picture. No sweat about the thread-jack, It's going to be a few days till I post any progress anyway. Talk away, and hopefully, someone learns something. __________________ I'd rather have a numbers matching poker hand.

01-11-2008, 03:58 PM	#13 (permalink)
captjim Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 149	" Quote: Originally Posted by 72CUTTY ........ i only understand about 25% of what captjim said ........ Don't feel bad. I know what he's talking about, and I still don't understand most of it." Let me know what you think is inaccurate or what you don't understand, and I'll try and clarify it for you. Also, NOBODY mentioned working with a builder or a machine shop. The recommendations were Jegs, Summit, and Northern. The pistons that come in those kits are the generic big dish, low comp ones. Norm, you obviously know your sh*t, but why do you feel the need to constantly insult and talk down to people? I don't get it. There are plenty of guys on here who post good practical info without being condescending, patronizing, and rude. You are just not one of them. You go out of your way to be rude and obnoxious, when it is just as easy to be polite.

01-13-2008, 03:46 PM	#18 (permalink)
captjim Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 149	I deleted that when I realized that the thread had somehow gone from discussing 350s to discussing 455s. The 350 Speed pro dish is 6cc. My bad.

01-13-2008, 05:53 PM	#19 (permalink)
J-(Chicago) Seasoned beater pilot. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,588	Motor got a teardown today. This motor was a freebie so I was worried about how rotten it really was. There was almost as much water in the pan as there was oil, and the valley pan had a 1/2'' of carbon in it. Thankfully though it turned out to be a decent core. Hardly a ridge in the cylinder walls, and no bearing scores at all. The only unorigional gaskets on it were the water pump and valve covers. Does anyone want a freebie cast iron intake? Makes a great boat anchor for your next fishing trip. __________________ I'd rather have a numbers matching poker hand.

02-25-2008, 06:46 PM	#20 (permalink)
J-(Chicago) Seasoned beater pilot. Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,588	the 7a Heads are almost done. 4 angle jobber no porting 207 intake valves 162 exhaust radiused exhaust seats 30degree intakes instead of stock 45 __________________ I'd rather have a numbers matching poker hand.

02-25-2008, 09:02 PM	#22 (permalink)
The_Jeremiah Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 248	LOL you guys are great. and best of luck to you J. I just got my engine done using the northern kit, i might have the "big dish" pistons you guys speak of, but it runs like a top. and i think i got my moneys worth out of it lol. __________________ 69 Cutlass 4 door. Built 350 inside, grandma's grocery getter outside. Best sleeper in disguise.

02-26-2008, 05:16 AM	#23 (permalink)
Oldsguy Administrator Join Date: May 2004 Location: Lees Summit MO Post