butchashop

my buddy is going to look at this car tomoroew the seller claims its a real numbers matching 442??? how can i tell if its actually a 442

1965 oldsmobile 442 in primer
new seats (creme) front and back
4speed 330 v8 drive it home!!!
Cash only; no scam artists' please!!!
Super rare first year made

Oldsmaniac

The ad is waving caution flags already!!! Should have a 400 not a 330. Should have 442 dash badge. Should have rear anti-sway bar and boxed lower rear control arms. Should have 442 grill and side 442 badging and bulges. Also 442 on rear finish panel. Also it was not the first year!

wmachine

"No scam artists"???? Looks like he wants to be the only one. Warning signs all over.
Post a pic of the data plate on the firewall, it *may* indicate if it is a real 442.

Joe, I wonder if this is a Cutlass Sports Coupe with an F85 front clip on it. Note the side trim and window trim indicate a SC, but the short hood spear and no side trim on the fender indicate an F85. If it is by chance an F85 Club Coupe there won't be a rear finish panel and (if it really is a 442) the emblem would be in the same place, but directly on the body.

Lots of investigation needed!!

Oldsmaniac

Did not pick up on the shorty hood spear. Just figured the front fender chrome was missing. Love that primered bumper too. Should check to make sure trans is a Muncie and not saginaw.

butchashop

so the original motor should have been a 400? So much for numbers matching Welly buddy looked at the car up close and said there's 442 badges on the grill one fender on the dash and one in the rear. But he doesn't really know what to look for which is why I'm asking the professionals I don't want to see my buddy get burned
Ill post some interior pics in a few

butchashop

svnt442

The first year was 1964. Those all came with 330s and 4 speeds. In 65 they introduced the 400.

Oldsmaniac

The dash badge looks correct but they have been reproed, the picture makes it look newer than the dash. the steering wheel is not stock and the shifter as well. As W machine said it looks like a F-85 sheet metal was put on a Cutlass. I would be worried about this one and it needs more research.... Does the seller know the engine is wrong? or maybe its right if its just a Cutlass and not a 442.

butchashop

the seller is defending the story of it being a 442 and he wants $5000 for the car

64Rocket

There should be 442 scoupes just behind each door.
Get the VIN number. Is he asking big money for the car.
If it is a 330cid, more than likely it is not a 442.

Gene

joe_padavano

Well, start by asking the seller to point out the numbers that "match". Unless he has the Protect-O-Plate that matches the engine and trans unit numbers to the VIN, there are no other "matching numbers" in 1965. The VIN derivative stamp on the engine and trans weren't used until the 1968 model year.

As for it being a real 442, the body data plate would have a "4V" (possibly with another letter between the 4 and the V) if it were real. The 4V would appear in the lower left corner of the data plate. Unfortunately, this won't apply if the car was built at the Fremont, CA plant. For some reason, Fremont cars didn't get the 4V. This is well documented.

Of course as others have correctly pointed out, this car appears to be missing everything that makes a 442. Good catch on the front end, Kurt. I didn't look that closely at the photos.

The seller is either an idiot or a scam artist himself. I'd suggest walking away. In my experience, no amount of proof will sway the beliefs of a seller like this. My money says it will still be for sale months from now.

butchashop

Well as always I appriciate all the help. The only upside to the whole story is that my buddy is trying to trade his 93 lt1 camaro for it the camaro is kind of a beater and he bought it for 500 bucks so he's hoping to get the olds and save it from death Im going with him hopefully tomorow or Friday to see it and if I just want to kick the seller off his high horse and add another olds to our fleet. I hate shady sellers if it's a cutlass just say so why try to church it up