Death

Ok, so my Omega was parked legally on the street during an ice storm. Someone smashed all in the back end of it. I know i need a new bumper, tail lights, and the sheet metal body is all crumpled up. bumper ripped most of the way off.

at least the dude had insurance.

what happens next? is a body shop gonna be able to find me genuine olds tail light covers? am I gonna have to search for them myself?

since the body was surface rusted, are they gonna tell me the damage was pre existing and that they won't fix it?

I'm so worried and i gotta wait til monday for stupid insurance people i guess.

I've never made an insurance claim on anything befofe, let alone a classic whose parts are probably close to unattainable. (at least I'm sure a shop won't want to mess with it.)

Death

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DeltaPace77

Hard to say, as a lot depends on the type of insurance you have, and the determined value of the car. Surely the shop wouldn't mind if you can help them with locating some parts. If the cars on an agreed value collectors car plan for say $15K from Grundy or Haggerty insurance, they may just give you the $15K and call it a day. As for the rust, knew a guy years ago with a 77' T-Bird with rusted rocker panels that got badly wrecked. Insurance agreed on the repairs, and car came out looking better than before the wreck.

jensenracing77

with it being there fault, they have to fix or replace it. only problem is if you have a basic policy, they will go by book value and that may be low enough that they could total it out and give you the money.

Death

i got allstate liability. no fancy collector insurance here. I'm hoping they just fix it with new panels. but nothing's gonna match now. It needs complete body restoration to match now. (which was gonna be the plan in the first place). maybe it'll be pro-rated when I get the rest of the car's body fixed up, since they'll only have to do like 3/4 of the car.

I'm afraid this may happen.

jaunty75

I agree. You have a standard insurance policy, and the other guy has one, too. I think finding the parts is the least of your problems. If you want his insurance to compensate you, you'll likely have to give up the car.

His insurance company will inspect the damage, and if the cost to repair is above a certain fraction of the car's assessed value, which I'm guessing will happen because the intrinsic value of this car is not likely to be high, they'll just call the car totaled and give you a check. Your insurance company will not likely get involved as it's the other guy's fault, and he's insured. If you're unhappy with what the insurance company offers you, you can negotiate or perhaps bring in your insurance company at that point. I'm not sure, but if you do believe it's worth more that what they offer, you'll need to be able to back that up with recent sale prices of similar cars or values given in collector car guides.

Restorable 1975 Omegas are worth maybe $1000 to $1500. The cost to fix the damage could easily run to that or more. I think you would have a hard time justifying a value much higher than that. I think the chances that your car will be considered totaled are very high.

If you do reach agreement with the insurance company, they'll ALSO likely require that you give them the car, since they're actually buying it from you, and recover what they can by selling it as scrap. You can probably buy it back from them at that point, but then you would have a salvage vehicle that needs likely a couple of thousand dollars worth of repairs and a check in your hand for maybe $1000 or $1500 less what you had to pay the insurance company to buy it back. At that point you might decide it's better to just let the car go and find another, intact Omega that would likely cost you no more than the settlement amount to buy. You'd be ahead.

You are between a bit of a rock and hard place. To you, the car is valuable as a collector car that you had plans for. To the rest of the world, though, it's just an old car.

The moral of the story, not that it will do you much good now, is don't park your collector car in the street!

DeltaPace77

Actually there's nothing fancy about collector car insurance, as have my Olds insured for an agreed value of $19K through Grundy, at $150 bucks a year. Can't be a daily driver though, and you need to supply proof of another car, insured through a major carrier. If it makes you feel any better, I carry Allstate on my daily cars, and had a wreck couple years back. Gotta say, they really came through. And like the big guy in the commercial says, no rate increase. Even got the $100 safe driver deductible discount for that year. Since your car was parked, maybe a whole nother type of claim. Problem I see you having, is book value may only be about $1K, and that's all you might be getting. Be a shame too, as any reliable running source of transportation, is certainly worth far more than that to you.

jaunty75

More than this, it also likely has to be parked in a locked garage, not outside in your driveway, and certainly not on the street.

bigD

i wouldn't get too worked up just yet. the damage could certainly have been worse! you should be thankfull for that. if they don't want to fix it just take their money and keep the car.

theres no two ways about the fact that it sucks and is gonna be a hassle for ya but in reality it could have been a hell of a lot worse. as long as you keep the title in your hands you are in control of your car, you may end up giving up some $$ in the process but it is your car.

jaunty75

I don't know about this!

If the car had been smashed to bits, there'd be no question that he would just take the money from the settlement and go buy another Omega. As it is now, he's going to hem and haw about whether it's better to try to keep the car and fix it up or buy something else. It would have been easier if the decision was made for him.

Remember, it's not necessarily better to keep the car. Like I said, the insurance company will want the car if they total it. They're essentially buying it from him. If he wants it back, he'll have to pay them what they determine is its scrap value. So he won't have the full $1000 or $1500 they'd offer him, he'll have that minus whatever they think the car is worth.

So he might end up with, say, $800 to $1300 (assuming the car fetches $200 when sold for scrap metal) plus a damaged Omega that's likely to cost him well more than the settlement amount to bring back to the condition it was in before the crash.

As I said, it might be better to just take the money, let the insurance company keep the car, and go out and buy another Omega in similar condition that's not damaged, which he ought to be able to do for the settlement amount.

You can't let emotion guide you here. You have to be practical about this from a financial standpoint. There are other '75 Omegas out there.

11971four4two

Like bigD says:

i wouldn't get too worked up just yet. the damage could certainly have been worse! you should be thankfull for that. if they don't want to fix it just take their money and keep the car.

theres no two ways about the fact that it sucks and is gonna be a hassle for ya but in reality it could have been a hell of a lot worse. as long as you keep the title in your hands you are in control of your car, you may end up giving up some $$ in the process but it is your car.

A friend of mine was rearended in his 57 dodge 4door. The insurance co. wanted to total it and he said no way. He was able to get a little money from the insurance co. , he ended up spending that plus money of his own to purchase parts and pay for the labor to get his baby back on the road.

cutlassjim

"Legally parked in the street during a ice storm", lets just say an ounce of prevention may have saved your ride. Not trying to give anyone sh**, but come on now.

jaunty75

I would argue that this is a much different situation. There are far more '75 Omegas around than there are '57 Dodges, and they can likely be had for far less money. While it might be worth spending the money to fix the damaged '57 Dodge, that might not be true for the '75 Omega.

oldcutlass

This is very good advice, however lets not put the cart before the horse! Wait and see what the insurance co. is going to offer, and go from there. Getting worked over speculation is not the way to go, work with real numbers and make an educated decision.

In the meantime, I would research on the internet for a suitable replacement, and I would aslo contact a body shop to see what the actual repair cost would be. This way you can compare those prices to what the insurance co. is offering.

jaunty75

I kind of chuckled at this comment, too, and wondered what it's relevance was. Even if he was illegally parked, say, in front of a fire hydrant, and hit by another driver, that other driver would still be responsible. No matter where it is, the car that does the hitting is at fault, especially if what's being hit is sitting still. A car parked illegally doesn't make it fair game to be hit by anyone who wants to take aim at it.

And whether or not there was an ice storm, wind storm, snow storm, thunderstorm, or Hannah Storm doesn't matter, either. The other guy is at fault because he hit your car. Driving in bad weather doesn't absolve him of the responsibility to drive safely and not hit things.

jaunty75

Yes, we can be optimistic, but we also need to be realistic. My prediction: the car will be valued by the insurance company at $1000, and the estimates to repair the damage will come in at at least $2000. Even if I'm off by a factor of two on my damage repair estimate, that's still a repair cost equal to the value of the car. In short, it's gone.

Your advice to start researching what replacement Omegas are out there, assuming he wants to go that way, is sound. He could also take the money and use this opportunity to get into something altogether different. Remember, when one door closes, another one opens, or something like that.

MDchanic

Bottom line, insurance is required to repair or replace.

If you can get another car for less than the repair, they will pay for another car.

And the value of that car, as said above a number of times, ain't much.

- Eric

oldcutlass

Very true!

Death

I mean I guess that's fair, considering I bought the thing for 1500 and it had been sitting for several years. I figured it was a perfect first time restoration project for me.

I probably won't go searching for an Omega specifically, but I'll definately be getting another classic car of some sort.

let's say i get 1000 cash after I buy it back from the insurance company. I get to keep the omega and ghetto fix it however I want. I mean i could make it pass inspection for new clean title real easy. I then have 1000 cash and a daily driver car that i could sell for 1000 or just keep it if i want.

Sorry, I feel like I must clarify.

The ONLY reason the Omega was parked in the street is because I had to make room for my busted *** Mazda 626. can't park it on the street if the back wheel is bent sideways. I did that like a week ago too. (see CL listing below)

http://dayton.craigslist.org/cto/2805623591.html

DeltaPace77

Let us know how this turns out, as some insurance companies wont allow you to keep the damaged car. Had a daily Mercury Sable that got hit, but not bad and still drivable. Was gonna get it fixed, but a work buddy was really jammed up for a car. Insurance agreed to pay the claim, if I sold the car to him, and wanted his information to make sure. Worked out pretty good, as my buddy got back on the road for $500 bucks, and I got a new Pontiac GXP for GM employee pricing.

jaunty75

Nor necessarily what's IN the car!

A friend at work had a recent interesting experience with this. About two months ago, his daughter was rear-ended in her 2006 Toyota Corolla. She was fine, but the insurance company totaled the car. Not one week earlier, he had put in a nice aftermarket radio for her, and he asked the insurance company if he could go and get it out of the car before they took it away because it was so new and undamaged, and he would put back in the original factory radio as he still had it.

They said no. They said that the car that they gave him money for was a car with that new radio in it. If he wanted the radio back, he'd have to buy it from them. He said no as he could spend just a bit more and get another new radio for her for the car she got to replace the Corolla.

I think the point here is that insurance companies can be hard-nosed, and probably with some justification. If their decision is that the car is not worth fixing, that'll be it. They'll want the car for the money they give you. If you want it back, you can probably buy it, but remember that you're now buying a wrecked vehicle that will probably come with a salvage title, whatever that means for getting it back on the road (probably nothing).

Death

So you're saying I should take out my cd player and speakers before they look at it? It also has the am only radio in it. My cd player is hooked up via the screws at the very bottom of dash panel, as to keep the car unmolested. (the head unit is prolly only worth 20 bucks on the street if that, and speakers are some old thrift store house speakers laying in the trunk.)

jaunty75

You might do just that.

Once the car is at a body shop, whether it's towed there or you can drive it there, you might not get access to it ever again if they decide to total it. You'd likely be allowed to collect personal belongings that are not attached to the car, like stuff in the glovebox or whatever you might have had in the trunk or back seat. But things attached to the car might be considered part of the car, even if they're just hanging below the dash, and they might not let you remove those. I don't know for sure.

It might depend on the insurance company. But it's probably better to play it safe and remove whatever you want to keep if you think there's any chance it will be considered totaled. The insurance company will value the car based on what's installed on it when they look at it.


Another story along this line happened to me back in '05. My own daughter was rear-ended in the 1991 Acura Legend we had gotten from my parents as a vehicle for my kids to drive while in high school (they were the envy of the school). It was a nice car, even though it was 14 years old at the time. It had maybe 90,000 miles on it. The car had to be towed, and it was taken to a local body shop. The insurance company totaled it. I just needed to go back to it to remove the license plates and get the two-dollar snow-scraper which was on the floor of the back seat.

Well, the car was behind a locked fence, and I was accompanied by one of the shop staff to make sure, I presume, that I took only things like the license plates and the snow scraper and other personal items and not something else that was part of the car.

70olds455

If you buy the car back from the insurance company most likely they are going to give you a salvage title for the car. Most insurance companies value cars by how much miles they have on them also.

jaunty75

True, but, like the '57 Dodge situation earlier, probably not terribly relevant here. This is a '75 Omega. It's now 37 years old. It's value is more in its condition. Whether it has 75,000 miles on it or 150,000 miles on it isn't likely to change the value much. Or if it does, it might be an $1100 car instead of a $1000 car. But low mileage won't make a $1000 Omega into a $2000 Omega unless it was VERY low (under 20,000?) mileage.

The opposite would be true if it were a late-model car. A 2009 Honda Accord with, say, 25,000 miles on it would be worth a fair amount more than, say, one with 75,000 miles on it. But for a car as old as the Omega, mileage is probably not so much an issue, unless it's extreme in one direction or the other.

cutlassjim

Sorry, I feel like I must clarify.

The ONLY reason the Omega was parked in the street is because I had to make room for my busted *** Mazda 626. can't park it on the street if the back wheel is bent sideways. I did that like a week ago too. (see CL listing below)

http://dayton.craigslist.org/cto/2805623591.html[/QUOTE]
No reason to clarify my friend, I can see the pattern developing, HA HA, once again, "an ounce of prevention" (sorry bout that, couldn't help myself),

RetroRanger

heres what happened to me this is in Mass so YMMV in other states.

my VdoubleU was damaged when a girl left turned across two lanes. It was ruled 100% her fault (much like your claim will be 100% the other persons fault)

her insco offered me 3k and the car was totaled, I refused and stated I cant replace that car for less than 6k to back it up I found the value on KBB I found a local wantads w similar vehicles for sale ( I only selected ads with high asking prices) and I added some high priced CL ads in the mix.

In the end they agreed to $4500 and I kept the car to repair for another ~$125

I also had the car towed to my house after the accident and it never left my possesion. When arguing for more $ I stated I saved their insco ~2-3weeks storage fees at ~$35 a day = ~700.

I bought another similiar dub w a bad trans (~$1000) rebuilt mine and in Mass you can get an owner retained title instead of salvage title and that saved me from a salvage reinspection and fees and other BS.

I keptthe car 2 more years and then sold it for another ~2k

what you should do is

find similar cars for sale for good money
keep your car in your possesion
dont agree to their first offer and offer points why its unacceptable
once settled fix, part or junk your car

jaunty75

What year was your VW? How long ago did this happen?

coppercutlass

collector insurance isn't much. It's actually alot less than regualr insurance. i have an agreed value with state farm for 12k on my 72 full coverage in the summer is 60 for 6 months and for the winter during storage its 10 dollars for 6 months and i have crashed my car hope this makes you feel better my isurance treated me good and paid me 4500 to fix my own car parts and labor. Im also not limited to miles or mile checks as my odometer does not work and it was never stated in any paper work. You can deny anything they want to do . if you want to keep you car and take the check you can i have seen this alot in our shop where i work. people will not total the car but take a check for an amount less than what it would cost total usually no labor hours etc. If you get creative you can keep your car and get money depends on the shop and insurance adjuster., etc.

Railguy

I know a junk yard that had a 76-78 not sure of the year or if its still there.I'll pass the # along as soon as I find it.
railguy

Rickman48

And, it really doesn't look that bad, from the pictures!
Qtr. can be straightened, but finding those rubber fillers and a good used bumper could be a problem, if they're not the same as Nova.
Tailight should still be around, if you could get a yard to run it on their locator!
Matching paint would be almost impossible.
Monday, before you go to his insurance co., try to locate and list the parts for the adjuster, with prices - they'll have a tendancy to be more 'friendly', if you've done some of their job for them!!

Death

OK, so after taking their sweet time, they finally got ahold of me this morning. The options they gave me were as follows:

A: Take it to get it fixed, they pay for it. Guaranteed for life with their network shop.
B: they come estimate it, cut me a check, and be done with it. no guarantees or nothing.

I opted for A. I'm waiting on the tow truck now.. It'll be nice just to have my car the way it was.. maybe.. We'll see what their version of "fixed" is. the quarter is wrinkled like foil.

jaunty75

Have they already looked at it? Or did they give you these options without having seen it? If they've already looked at it, have they given you an estimate of the cost to repair?

Death

this was all via phone. Its getting towed to a shop where the insurance people will estimate it there, then the repairs happen. i think they'll call me in between each step. plus, if the shop needs to do more work than originally estimated, the insurance people gotta go back out there and verify it.

I'm glad i'm wearing my patience hat today.

jaunty75

This very interesting. I'm assuming they're basing their decision to do this on a description of the damage. I can still see the possibility that, once the body shop actually sees the damage and reports to the company on it will cost to fix it, the amount could be more than the threshold necessary to declare the car totaled. I think that, at this point, fixing the car is not guaranteed to happen, at least through the insurance company. Keep your fingers crossed, but be prepared to be handed a check for the value of the car.

Death

thanks for the heads up.. The nice lady never even hinted of this possiblilty.. But, I know this is entirely possible.

jaunty75

I could be totally wrong. All I know is that, when my daughter was rear-ended in our then 14-year-old Acura, the thought that the car might be considered totaled never entered my mind. I was as surprised as anything when the insurance company called and said they were just going to give us a check for it.

The car was worth about $5000 (that's what the check was for), and I thought the damage would be in the $2000 range. Nope. Over $4000. Remember, the amount of the damage does not have to equal or exceed the value of the car in order for the insurance company to total it. All it has to do is reach some percentage of the value that the insurance company uses. Maybe 80% or 90% or something like that.

The cost to repair collision damage is always way more than you think it will be. You can never tell by just an external inspection. You'll only know for sure when the shop has inspected it thoroughly and found any additional, hidden damage, if there is any.

In your case, I have to believe that your car, before the damage, was not worth more than $1000 to $1500, and that the cost to fix even a minor fender-bender would be in the $500 to $1000 range. Nothing in the way of collision damage ever costs a couple of hundred dollars any more.

MDchanic

+1.

- Eric

jaunty75

In looking again at your photos just now, I see a rear bumper that has been knocked off the car, and it is dented and twisted. There is possibly some damage to the trim behind the bumper. The taillight is, of course, smashed. The left rear fender just ahead of the bumper looks to be crumpled a bit. We can't see what damage might have been done to the bumper mounts on the car and/or the bumper itself, but there certainly has to be some as it takes a pretty good hit to knock a bumper off a car.

Even if you can find another taillight and unbend the bumper and fender (and I have my doubts about the bumper), the repair to the bumper mount plus the repainting of the fender certainly takes some labor. My very uneducated guess: $1000 minimum to fix, and don't be surprised if it's $2K!

jaunty75

On further thought, I say $3000!

One of the reasons the bumper might have fallen off so seemingly easily is that the mounts were rusted. That means they might have been fairly significantly damaged in the collision, and mounting another bumper would require significant metalwork at the bumper mount points. In other words, there might not be anything left to mount the bumper TO!