VprRacr

I am rebuilding a 1969 442 with a supposedly 1970 W30 motor. It has the F heads and the F block. The intake, carb and distributor has all been upgraded to current aftermarket parts. The block is currently out of the car and the heads are getting redone. My friend said you still cannot verified that this is a real W30 motor. What other identifying parts were exclusively to the 1970 W30 455 motor? Thanks

4Speedy

If you look at the vin stamp the pad under the driver's side towards the front. Can tell you what year.
the F heads what is the 6 digit casting number?
center just under the valve cover. I ask because
they could be E heads ground down to look like F's.

other then F heads, Intake, Distributor, Carb there wasn't any way to know if a real w30 or just a 455 with w30 heads or other w30 parts!

Note: If they're real F heads sell them to someone restoring a real w30 it'll fund a huge part of your project.

OLDSter Ralph

Your friend is right. Who told you it was a 1970 W-30 engine ? Did you pay exta for the engine because it was supposedly a W-30 engine ?

VprRacr

The history of the 1969 442: I bought it while in High School in 1976 from a Oldsmobile dealer used car lot. I sold it to my friend in 1982 and he blew the original 400 motor.
The history of the 1970 W-30 motor: Another friend of mines owned the W30 car, he sold it to another person who "rebuilt the motor". Later on this car was rear ended and totaled. The totaled W30 was sold to another friend which gave the engine to be used in my old 1969 442 since the original motor was blown. My old car sat in a garage since 1991 due to smog control restrictions in California.
Fast forward to 2020, the 442 was taken up a valuable parking space in the garage. I was offer to take the car back which I did. My friend said you cannot verify if the motor is a original W30 motor. ( He said in the 70's people were passing off 350ci truck motors with 4 bolt mains as LT1 motors).
I believe it is still the original W30 motor, but need to verify what other exclusive W30 parts belong on the engine. Are there certain part # stamped on the cam.pistons, rods, cranks...etc....?

4Speedy

The cam for the w'30 were specific to the w30.
There were 2 types of w30 cams,
1 for an auto and
1 for the 4spd.
​I don't have the numbers handy right now but post what you have and the info I asked earlier.
plus the pistons should be the high compression type for that year. Not a guarantee because the standard 442 and a few others also had the high compression pistons also.
Either we can rule out No way its a w30 or it could be possible. That's the best you can get.

69CSHC

Ughhh, many key parts to identification and maximum value are gone...

If your certain beyond a shadow of doubt that your freinds car was an original W30. Contact him and see if he has any piece of paper, regi, insurance, etc. That may have the W30 vin number then match it to your engines stamped numbers on block. At least that will give you some certainty. As far as proving it to the world, he would still need to have the build sheet or original sales receipt. If he ever had them to begin with.

Long shot I know....

joe_padavano

The first question is, are they REALLY "F" heads, or are they "E" heads doctored to look like "F"? Check the casting number above the center two exhaust ports, which is typically not changed when someone makes bogus "F" heads. Real F heads have the casting number 404438. E heads have the casting number 403686. All 455s are "F" blocks. And frankly, a 1970 W-30 motor out of an automatic car is no different from any other 455 from an automatic 442 except for the heads. The cam is the same 285/287 deg cam.

rob1960

Boy, your story brings back some memories!! In '77 a buddy of mine bought a '69 442/ 4 spd. Being 18 he promptly blew the 400. I lived by Niagara Falls at the time & in nearby Lockport was a junkyard that had tons of "Musclecars" I can't for the life of me remember the name of the place( anyone from western NY??) but the owner was way ahead of the times. He had pretty much everything there, all organized by brand!, even a section of wrecked vettes, The place just blew me away!. When we told him we needed an engine for a 442 he showed us 2 wrecked '70 W30s one was a stick the other was an auto!! He wanted $400 for one( you could buy low miles V8s for $50 all day long back then) & my buddy just couldn't afford it ( he was still in high school, working part time busing tables) He ended up getting a nice '70 350 4bbl instead. It wasn't hard to find stuff like that back then but who took the time(or knew to check vin #s, original paperwork, what was that!), After all they were just used cars then. The guy also had complete cars for sale. I saw my first W32 there & we were like what the hell is that!! We all knew about W30s & W31s, there were quite a few potent Olds around where I grew up but we'd never seen or heard of a W32!

VprRacr

Picture of pistons and F stamping on block

green1972

What are the numbers on the pad by the #1 piston, that will tell you what year Block

4speed455

It will also tell you what factory it was from. All w30 blocks should have a M for Lansing Michigan. This won’t confirm a w30 motor but if it’s not an M then it’s not a w30 motor.

Fun71

No. The cam and pistons would be the only internal component specific to the W-30 engine, but as you said the engine has been rebuilt so those likely have been replaced. And the "W-30 specific" carb, distributor, and intake manifold are gone.
So what you're left with is the F heads and a run-of-the-mill 455 engine.

joe_padavano

Exactly the same on every single 455 block.

VprRacr

Is this the M stamp ?

On the rear of the motor

joe_padavano

What's the VIN derivative stamp on this pad?






It should look like this:

VprRacr

The engine was suppose to have been rebuilt. This would have taken place in the 80’s. So far the bottom end seems intact and wasn’t touched. I am looking for any information that it still has the original pistons and crank.

joe_padavano

That is a 1970 motor from Lansing. The "M" just means it came from Lansing. It DOESN'T mean it's a W-30.

joe_padavano

Those look like OEM pistons.

joe_padavano

Is this an AT or MT motor? If it's an AT motor, the W-30 short block is identical to any other 442 AT short block from that year (including the cam).

Bigmikey65

1970 W30 pistons would have this stamped on them. A 1970 W30 stick camshaft would have 2 green stripes on it.

joe_padavano

So would many non-W pistons. This is like the "M" assembly plant code. It's necessary but not sufficient for proof.

VprRacr

404 438

pizza442

From what I have understood over the years, since the W30s were hand assembled "blue printed" in a separate area, the pistons had unique markings (letters) so they each would be put in a specific cylinder bore

OLDSter Ralph

The pistons were no different. The W-30's had "select fitted" parts.....pistons were stock items, just assembled in engine blocks with more skirt clearance. The only cam that was specific to W-30 SMT was # 402569 (328/328 degrees). The W-30 AT came from the factory with 285/287 degree camshaft.

joe_padavano

ALL Olds motors had pistons that were sized and marked. The "select fit" W-30 motors used "A" sized pistons in "D" sized bores to get more piston-to-wall clearance.

joe_padavano

Well, those are $4000 heads right there.

pizza442

Ah, yes that was it. So not exactly proof for this engine but good circumstantial evidence

Bigmikey65

I stand corrected on the pistons - thank you Joe. But the W30 stick camshaft will have had 2 green stripes on it in 1970.

Bigmikey65

joe_padavano

Yes, but we don't know if this is an AT motor or an MT motor.

green1972

unless your attached to the heads, sell them to someone doing a restoration, and buy a set of aluminum edelbrocks and have money to spare

VprRacr

it is a automatic

VprRacr

This is the Water pump we pulled off the motor

VprRacr

it does have an “A” on the piston face.

VprRacr

that is what everyone is telling me to do but I wanted to keep what is left of this motor intact.

4speed455

If the W30 that matches that number is gone it’s just another 455 block. $4000 for the heads $4500 for the whole package sounds like a good starting point. Most people who would be interested in the heads would not want to ship the block IMO.

Koda

Why? There is absolutely no provenance to those heads since the car they are in is destroyed, and you are putting an incorrect size and year engine in a 69 442. There is absolutely no point to keep those heads as you could finance the entire engine rebuild, and another set of heads, and rebuild those too, for selling the F heads. If everyone is telling you this, you should listen.

joe_padavano

To what end? Do you have the original intake, carb, and distributor? If not, then all you have is a generic 1970 442 short block and a set of heads that are only really valuable to someone restoring a 1970 W-30. The heads are already off the block, so you've lost the use of the original steel shim head gaskets. Even if those are original "A" pistons in "D" holes, that will be lost if the engine gets rebuilt with new pistons. The cam is nothing special. The crank is nothing special. And none of that hardware is correct for a 69 anyway.

Obviously do whatever you want with it, but that "preservation" ship sailed long ago.

scrappie

Arent those high compression pistons? Im just throwing stuff against the wall.....

joe_padavano

Yeah, so? Used in every 455 in the 1970 model year except the RPO L30 low compression 2bbl motor.