mitchy

I'm 15 looking for a project car to get running before I get my licence and I found an AD for 1972 442. I have a couple questions I'm hoping you could answer. First, how do I tell if it's a real 442? Is it worth saving? What is a fair price?
http://www.oldsmobilecentral.com/for...Hackensack.php

Oldsmaniac

This car is or was on ebay a day ago, owner knows Oldsmobies very well. If he says its legit it is, yes I think it is worth saving, and is great with the 4 speed.

vette442

Do you have strong welding and paint skills? Do you have at least $15K to work with? If not, this isn't your car.

The body is a mess based on the Ebay pictures, and that's just what you can see externally. You'll be broke and frustrated and still won't have a car that is street ready.

There are many nicer '68-'72 Cutlass cars out there at decent prices that will be so much more enjoyable for someone your age getting started. You will still have work to do on just about any car of this vintage so you'll be able to learn and tinker, but don't suck the fun out of your teenage years with something this rough to start with.

Terry

Octania

Unless you have a large garage space and welder and skills and 2-3 years to work on it and some experienced helpers and yeah oh $20k cash. I hear that paint alone properly done costs $10K on up. Maybe a better project for someone well settled into a house with a large pole barn/ workshop and a lot of extra cash.

Allan R

I know this may cause controversy, but there's absolutely no way to tell if this is a real 442 unless you find one of the following items to document it:
- original Bill of Sale
- Broadcast card showing the W29 option
- Build sheet showing it's W29 option.

72 442's are very hard to authenticate based on anything else, unless it was a W30.

Yes, the seller can say it's a real 442 but he needs to be able to prove it also instead of just 'saying' it is. I saw that ad a while back but it really didn't have any 'proof' then either IIRC.

oldstata

In my opinion buy the best you can afford!!

With that said, if your high school has shop most of the work can be done in class, or if your able to do college course of body/ mechanic as some schools offer.

I did most of my body work with help for under 3k full paint job and rust repair to bare metal.

Just saying use all options available to you

Welcome! hope you find a great ride.

oldcutlass

If it's as solid as the owner says, it would make a great project for you. It's nice to see younger folks taking an interest in these old cars.

Gary M

If you did not buy this one you can look online and write down a list of parts prices like seat covers, seats, door skins, ETC. Call some paint shops and get an idea of what body work and paint costs. It will help you keep from getting in too deep and I agree that it's great that young people are interested in these cars but if you get one too far gone it may not end well financially.

anthonyP

I spoke with the previous owner in New York who was selling the 442, who had owned the car for many years. The seller said the buyer was going to restore the car since it was an all original 4-speed "M" engine code (factory 350 4bbl Dual Exhaust) 442 with factory gauges and posi rear axle. The price was very reasonable at that time, and the seller was even willing to drop the price even further if the buyer was going to restore it or was buying it as a keeper, as he was hoping the new owner would keep stock, not strip it of it's original parts, or just flip it.

Oldsmaniac

Just to let the OP know my brother purchased this car Sunday for 3000. I believe it to be legit and for sure now it was not the car for you. It is restorable but the effort required is considerable to say the least. We have a parts car that will surely be needed.

anthonyP

Glad to see that someone purchased the 442 and plans on restoring it. The 442 will be a sharp car again, with the brilliant green paint, factory stripes, and a 4bbl, 4speed, and dual exhaust. Always thought the '72 442's with the 350 engines were unique, especially when equipped with a manual trans. It would also be nice to see it done with the flat louvered hood and hood stripes - do not see too many 70-72 442's anymore with the standard hood. May you and your brother have a good time restoring and enjoying the 442.

Oldsmaniac

Thanks, there is a build thread starting on this car. The 350 will be saved but for now a 455 is being built for the 442. We are happy to have saved this car.

68442

Unless it is a V,U,Or X code in the Vin. Right.They put the engine code in the vin starting in 72. I don't think you could get a 455 in the "S" body style unless it was a 442

Allan R

That's where you'd be wrong 2 out of 3 times. The ONLY 442 in 72 that can be authenticated by the VIN is the X code W30.

The 442 in 1972 could be ordered with any of the available engine choices. The only body style in the Cutlass lineup that 442 was NOT offered on was the Cutlass Supreme Hardtop (aka Holiday) Coupe.

You most certainly could order ANY of the Cutlass lineup with a 455, U or V code. Only difference between the 2 is V code is for SMT M20 and U code is AT M40.

Since Vista Cruiser is also part of the A body lineup, it could also be ordered with a 455, but the U code only since it required M40 trans (TH400)

Oldsmaniac

We are lucky the broadcast card was located under the carpet on this one and it is a W29 car.

Allan R

That's perfect for authentication! Nice find. Can you post a pic for others to see what we're talking about?

Does the car have any other special options listed on the card? I don't remember if this is a Lansing car or not, but I found 2 broadcast cards for my car under the carpeting too! It was Lansing built.

Oldsmaniac

The paperwork is in poor condition but here are the pictures.

68442

Yes i stand corrected i did not realize the u or v could be had on a reg cutlass in 72.
This is confimed from Terry's site.

Allan R

Very nice! Looks like it was built before the end of 1971. Nice to see the A51 seats

That other piece of paper is really confusing. The M31 is a Jetaway transmission, and N40 is power steering rpo from 68-70. I wonder if someone wasn't in there before and left something behind from another car in their collection?

BTW, did you notice that the W29 comes under the heading of Special Order from COPO?

Allan R

No problem, I don't need Terry's site to know when I'm right though. There are many other sources of info besides that BTW.

U and V code in the VIN for engine ID weren't specific to just 1972 though.

anthonyP

Hopefully the 455 is only temporary, and we will soon see the original 350 back in the 442, especially since it is one of the few factory 350 4bbl dual exhaust (M-Code) 4-speed 442's built. The 350 is a great engine, especially for a driver - while still giving performance beyond most other small blocks.


As a side note, has anyone ever seen a factory "J-Code" 350 2bbl dual exhaust Cutlass or 442? It must be very rare, as no one recalls ever seeing or hearing of one.

68442

anthonyP

As you speculated, the other piece of documentation must be from another car. In addition to the wrong dated codes, it includes the C60 air condition option code, which this 442 does not have.

Oldsmaniac

These 2 pieces of paper were both found Saturday under the carpet on passenger side near seat belt retractor. I would say they had never seen the light of day till Saturday but yes the smaller one is strange but it was there...

Dont worry the 350 will be safely stored away and nothing will be done to take away from what it was that cant be reversed.

Oldsmaniac

I can see any special codes on the broadcast card, it is pretty dirty. The car does not have many options. I was wondering if all 72 442's had the wheel well trim as this one does not but I think it should. There are no top drip rail moldings either. The posi rear was said to be a 342. I thought I saw a 10 bolt cover but it had a rib on it like a Chevy rear would have?

Allan R

The model you have is 3387 which is the Cutlass S, so it should have wheel opening trim, but no rocker trim. It should also have deck lid reveal too. The roof drip molding was only added automatically to vinly top cars, so if yours doesn't have it, it was built that way. There's a different filler on the roof drip at the front where the A pillar channel joins the roof runoff channel. If the car was a 350, it's more likely the rear end was a 3.23:1 than 3.42:1. Most of the 3.42:1 gears went to the 455 equipped cars.

Glove box emblem should have 'Cutlass' script, not 442.

70cutty

So, what happened to mitchy and the car??

Allan R

The 72 Cutlass does. Have a 10 bolt rear and the cover does have that 'rib' you describe. The standard rear for the Cutlass S was the SA code 2.73:1. That stamping is on the top right side axle tube next to the breather vent. It will also have the ordinal date of production. Mine was coded SA O101. Translated to 2.73:1 Olds produced on 101 day of 1972 which is spot on with the time build code for my car and it's authentication docs from GM Heritage.

IMO you have a diamond in the rough waiting to be polished.

You should also have an FE2 suspension on that car, front and back. Rear boxed control arms, sway bar, HD springs, 1" front sway bar and HD springs. Cosmetic changes are easy to research. Is the car going to be stock looking when done?

Oldsmaniac

Clearly this thread was hijacked but since he did not purchase the car things happened. Mitchy is still searching for a car and some here are trying to assist with leads on another thread. There is a build thread for this car in that section.

Oldsmaniac

Everything is correct for W29 on this car, yes same color restored stock except a 455 will be there for now and the 350 saved for future. Will research rear code to find gearing.

Allan R

If this is a Lansing car never mind the rest of this. If it's from anywhere else (Framingham, Arlington, Freemont) you might be lucky enough to find the actual build sheet on top of the gas tank. Other place they often left it was under the package tray. If you find it, that will also detail the posi carrier and the gearing the car was ordered with. Should be in box 107 IIRC.

Oldsmaniac

It is a Lansing car and there was nothing atop tank as expected.

Bozang1

Saw this car a while back on craigslist but I passed on it. I already have a project. Happy I passed cuz I picked up a Suzuki Quadzilla LT500R for a good price shortly thereafter. Always wanted one...