oldsrocket88

http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/pts/2605579673.html

hmmm.....

stevengerard

not too far from me, what options weren't available, maybe the tach other than that all those sound like normal options on that car

Vega

Interesting. Im wondering how they got an 11:1 motor to burn regular pump gas
Wouldnt give $1200 for it but would hate to see it go to the crusher

stevengerard

There were plenty of cars that came with 11:1 compression back then, heck mine has 10.5:1 Back then regular gass was what 93 octane, almost all stations had high 90s back then many had 100 or 101 if I remember correctly. I remember putting in over half a tank of gas with a $10 bill

redoldsman

I remember Esso (now Exxon) selling what I believe was called something like Golden Supreme that was 103 octane. I think it had a black and gold pump. I don't think it lasted very long since there was probably not enough demand for it.

svnt442

Regular gas didn't mean what it does today. When he said regular gas I think he meant leaded.

rcorrigan5

I find it interesting that they call this car the "Brass Hat Engineers Car of 1967".

"Brass Hat" was a termed used back then to denote a car driven by a zone manager. Since they refer to this car as an "engineers car", I highly suspect it was driven by a "service" manager in one of the districts within a zone. Each zone was divided into districts and each district had a "sales" manager and a "service" manager that worked that district within the zone.

A "Brass Hat" car would be purchased new by the Oldsmobile Division of General Motors and titled and licensed under their ownership. From what I have seen, "Brass Hat" cars would get titled and licensed in the state where the zone office was, even though the car might get used by a zone manager in a different state within the zone.

Zone managers got to drive brand new cars for about 3 months or until they had about 3000 miles on them, whichever came first. At that point, the "Brass Hat" would get sent to a dealership for re-sale. I say "re-sale" because, at that point, the car would be considered used since it had already been owned by someone else (in this case, the Olds Division of General Motors). Dealerships competed to get "Brass Hat" cars because they offered a good deal to both the dealership and the future buyer. The former "Brass Hat" came to the dealership at a lower mark-up than the same car that came straight from the factory to the dealership, so the dealer could sell the "Brass Hat" at a lower price. And, although the car was considered used, the buyer still got an essentially new car with a one year 12000 mile warranty.

I found out all of this info in just the past few months. The '68 4-4-2 I now have was a former "Brass Hat" as well, according to the president/owner of the former dealership where my dad bought the car (yes, he is still alive and I was able to locate, talk with, and show him, the car I have). The president/owner of that dealership remembered the car well because it was the lead car for his annual convertible sale.

I also had the great fortune of talking with a former zone sales manager in the mid- to late-60s while at the Olds Nationals in Reno last July and he gave me lots of interesting details on "Brass Hat" cars. BTW, his most favorite car by far was the 1966 Olds Toronado - to this day, he says that was the nicest, neatest, slickest car he ever drove in his life!

So, although they call this car the "Brass Hat Engineers Car Of 1967", this car was most likely driven by a zone manager for about 3 months or 3000 miles before it was turned over to a dealership for re-sale.

Randy C.

joe_padavano

The seller is clearly clueless. UHV electronic ignition, disc brakes, and reclining seats were all options available in the 1967 model year (though rare). And don't get me started on the "numbers matching" claim. What numbers "match", exactly, considering that Olds didn't start stamping the block with the VIN derivative until the 1968 model year. Yeah, the P-O-P will trace the unit number back to the VIN, but no mention of having the P-O-P in the ad.

jrzybob442

My uncle’s brother’s friend, who was engaged to a waitress who worked across the street from the Lansing assembly plant and used to talk to the workers in engineering knew all about this car. It was originally a “brass hat” car ordered with a Toronado Engine driving the rear wheels, but the Dealer removed it because it had ultra high compression cylinder heads (14:1) and a double reentry supercharger.

The options were ordered by a retired accountant for Oldsmobile who wanted to see how high he could jack up the final sale price, because he needed a tax write off. Word is that John Beltz personally signed the order and if you look under the window washer bottle, you will find the letter from him to the plant manager entitled “Make this car for my friend, or else”.

The numbers match – a losing lottery ticket that the original owner stuffed in the glove compartment. Anyone who wants a unique car – should buy this one and immediately trade it for the 1962 front drive 442 I’m selling.

allyolds68

My dad's best friend is a retired GM zone manager. All we ever got was a highly optioned 83 Malibu Wagon, 2 tone black & gray. My dad got to "order" the car with everything he wanted & his friend drove it for 3 months. There were probably thousands of these cars sold every year.

Later, before retirement my dad's friend was the Northeast regional rep for Corvette. My dad never got one of those though.

f-85

Well im going to pick this car up this morning. Im sure in its day it was a great car. But now its mostly junk. But i like junk!

Vega

+1

DreWRoolZ

sweet post some pics and details when/if you get it

f-85

OK guys here are the details so far. So first it sucked getting it home. Long story short the front brakes "are" locked up. So moving it or getting it on or off the trailer sucked. Oh and while loading is when i noticed it didnt have disc brakes. But the nice pc of "Art" work that came with it makes up for it

I guess we can start with the pics. Here are a few.

f-85

Here are some hand written notes from their friend who they bought it from. I guess you cant blame them for what they posted. They went off the notes. LOL





They some how had the title from their friend.

They bought it in 87, but the car has sat since 91.

rcorrigan5

Now that's some neat stuff. That car has some pretty neat options for its time, too (cruise, remote side mirror, AM-FM, tic-toc-tac, to name a few). The fact that it is a convertible is a real big plus. Good luck with your 98 - it has lots of potential!

Randy C.

jensenracing77

the art work is great. avoid.... mint condition. is that what it says.

f-85

Yep you nailed it.

f-85

Randy


I wish is wasnt that bad. But it is. Anything is savable. But this car is a pc of sh*t. I just bought it because it has a bunch of cool parts on it, and i knew no one else would. Ill pull all the good parts off and save them first. I got it cheap so i wont loose money. I might make a few bucks and have some cool parts floating around. Thanks


Josh

f-85

Ok so here is alittle more info. Here are the note frome above



Ill type it out

67' old 98 "brass hat" on display 67' chicago auto show
Cat purch. from Leslie Olds Glen Ellyn- 68' or 69'

Engine test vehicle


Engine- 425 ci 375 h.p. Toronado Trans st400
Comp- 10.75-11.0 REG FUEL w/electronic variable pitch
Special Heads Converter
" " Cam
" " Pistons
" " Ign system
" " Carb

Test Veh for options, tac, reclining seats, cruise, tilt& telescope

J-(Chicago)

Cool junk.

svnt442

Whoahhh.......You had better pull one of those pics. I see someone ss#.

f-85

I didnt even notice that. Thanks. I pulled it. Ill cover it up and take another pic, then repost. Thanks again.

wmachine

F85, it looks like you have a well optioned 98 there.

I've examined the evidence, and so far there is nothing to support that the car is anything abnormal. The seller added the 11:1 compression and disc brake claims to what was stated on the "paper". The disc brake claim has already been dismissed. The paper still claims a Toronado engine (which is not 11:1), but so far there is nothing to support that. The "Starfire" engine decal indicates otherwise, but a check of the engine unit number should help clear that up.
The rest of the claims about "experimental" in regards to electronic ignition, tilt and tele, tach, reclining seat, and cruise are meaningless because they are all available options (along with the K50 Climate Combustion Control) in the '67 98.
So with this much misinformation already uncovered, one has to doubt the validity of Brass Hat and Chicago Auto Show claims. So far, none of the claims of being extraordinary have been confirmed. Just an objective view of the evidence.

f-85

Hey Kurt


NO you nailed it!!!! I was hoping someone would have. I knew it from the day it came home. Just a bunch of fairy tails. I didnt do anything to the car yet. But i did dig around the first night.

First off the original title. Its :date of Purchase" is 4/3/70 (they said it was bought new from their friend)

Second- we know about the brakes.

Third- The engine. It is a 10.5 starfire 425 Engine unit (R130431s) BUT from their notes. Special carb= 1967 buick riv 430 qjet, Special heads= one C, and one G. I took a couple plugs out and checked the pistons. Its still stock with the high comp pistons.

fourth- the build date code 03B second week of march 67. A little late to be in the car show. LOL

It is a cool car with cool options. To be honest, its really sad they let the car go like this. They had a huge warehouse right in front of the car. With lots of room in it. But they let it sit outside uncovered for years. By the time i left with the car i really didnt like them anymore.

wmachine

Well, I have to admit, that *is* a special engine!

f-85

Yeah "Special" like a person thats mentally handicap. LOL

aliensatemybuick

I think it IS a special engine, in the sense that the Starfire engine was offered in 1967 even though the CAR no longer was. I'm not sure I've even seen that particular valve cover decal before.

Def. a neat car in terms of rare options; in such "fairy tale" cases, its the CAR, not the story, that may be (and in this case was at least for the rare parts) worth checking out.

f-85

Yes it is odd they offered the starfire engine for another year. But its in my book. It was another $100 to get that motor in it. I Did a do a quick peak at the extra costs, and that had to spend an extra $1000 just on options. On top of the $4500 they payed for the car. So really they could have had his and hers cutlass's for less.