steverw

Hi all,
I recently bought 2 more 67 442's. One is a great builder the other is a parts car but has some desirable parts. I was originally going to take the options off of the better of the two to put on the 67 im currently building. It has factory tilt column,remote drivers mirror,headrest,tic toc tach,and an electric antena. It has a 10 bolt rear which i havnt checked yet to see if its a posi. All this the seller disclosed before i bought it. I bought it not running, it has an F block 455, Holley intake and big Holley carb. However I also found that it has or had the UHV ignition. It still has the ignition box on the front passenger inner fender but the distributor is gone. It has a Mallory Unilite. The coil is also missing. It appears the UHV box is still wired in.
Question: Is it possible to use the UHV box with the Mallory Unilite dist.? As im not yet sure if it is in fact still connected. I dont know if its still functional, I havnt tried to get the motor running yet. All i know is i can turn the motor by hand using the 4 blade fan thats on it. I dont have a key for the car/ another problem. Is there a way to get the ignition switch out of the dash without a key?
The Parts car also has a tic toc tach, factory disc up front and a 12 bolt, dont yet know if its posi, I just got these cars last week. It has no motor or tranny. It has the disc brake master cylinder set up. Its a column shift car. Both are 442's
The good one is really too good to rob parts so im thinking instead of doing a frame off resto on the one i have been building, ill just wrap it up, put it back together, and use its "i think original" E block motor i just rebuilt into the good more optioned car i just aquired and do a complete build on that car.
Anyway my main question is on the UHV ignition. Can the ignition box be bad but still work? Or is it a it works or not thing? And can it work with the Unilite distributor.
Sorry this was so long, any help would be apprecitate.
Thanks
Steve

joe_padavano

Not without major rewiring. The inside of the stock distributor uses a reluctor and mag pickup just like a later HEI distributor. In fact, the UHV is the predecessor to the HEI. The 1960s-vintage electronics couldn't be packaged in that little ignition module inside the distributor the way it was done for the HEI, so this large external box was needed. If the UHV box is bad, you could almost certainly gut it and replace the electronics with an off-the-shell HEI module. This would be undetectable from the outside.

Octania

Joe, you are a genius.
I figured the guts of an MSD box would be a neat trick but I like your idea. However, he has not the UHV distributor, which are not as easy to come by as say 7040255 carbs which we see on epay all the time. \


Steve writes:
"I recently bought 2 more 67 442's. One is a great builder the other is a parts car but has some desirable parts. I was originally going to take the options off of the better of the two to put on the 67 im currently building. It has factory tilt column,remote drivers mirror,headrest,tic toc tach,and an electric antena."
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What, you have a factory issue in-dash gage pkg?
*keeper* including the wiring harness that feeds it.



It has a 10 bolt rear which i haven't checked yet to see if its a posi.
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I thought the '67's came with 12-bolt cover "12-bolt" rear ends. Yes, we all know they have 10 bolts on the ring gear, but that is immaterial. It's larger and stronger than the 10-bolt 10-bolt rear end. Check on the posi thing.


However I also found that it has or had the UHV ignition. It still has the ignition box on the front passenger inner fender but the distributor is gone. It has a Mallory Unilite. The coil is also missing. It appears the UHV box is still wired in. I dont know if its still functional....
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Interesting. I am working on reviving a UHV system for a '67 Toronado. Long process. I have a nice copy of the UHV wiring diagram if that will help. PDF via e-mail?



I dont have a key for the car/ another problem. Is there a way to get the ignition switch out of the dash without a key?
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That one is easy- get a key. ASSUMING the ign still matches the door, remove door panel, remove lock from door, read code stamped into the lock cylinder on the OD, use that info to have a key cut. Use that key to remove ign lock cylinder and thus the ign lock. I have the book to translate 4-character code to the 6 key cuts in case your locksmith cannot perform that task. You will probably find that the GM dealer is now useless for oldschool keys.



The Parts car also has a tic toc tach, factory disc up front and a 12 bolt, dont yet know if its posi, I just got these cars last week.
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say what, you 'gots' TWO in-dash gage pkgs?
What an embarrassment of riches.


It has no motor or tranny. It has the disc brake master cylinder set up. Its a column shift car. Both are 442's
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Well, good score there. I am now sure disk brakes were available in 1967, if so they were hellaciously rare and the 4-piston type.



Anyway my main question is on the UHV ignition. Can the ignition box be bad but still work?
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You MIGHT find a Pontiac guy that can rejuvenate / test the UHV box. If you do, let me know. I recall seeing an article about that in a magazine MANY years ago, how they replace the capacitors and the transistors as needed. Frankly, w/o the UHV distributor, your UHV box is not all that useful. Is there ANY chance the seller has that distributor stashed? spotter tip- TWO wires terminating in a plastic connector body. Usually flexed to death at the entry to the distributor housing.

I have become the UHV expert I guess, so keep this handy:

Chris Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist
1303 W. Miller Rd.
Lansing MI 48911

text or call: 517-449-043 two
RocketScience443@hotmail.com <== CHANGE "443" to the obvious correct number!

wmachine

All the '67 performance rears I've seen (3.55 and numerically higher) have been 10 bolts with 4-pinion carriers, and that is also what the '67 W30s had. These 4-pinion units were actually pretty decent. No worse that the O-types.
Typically found in the 4-spd cars due to gears.

steverw

Hey thanks Joe, Octania, W Machine,
I will contact the guy I bought them from. He bought them from a guy that lost his storage I think. Hes a dealer but maybe he can contact the previous owner and ask about the original distributor...
Joe the HEI module in the box is a great idea as I do have an HEI distributor I could use in it.
I had been wanting a Tic Toc Tach for the 442 im currently building but couldn't find one after Ron Roth quit. Then someone on this site mentioned these cars had been on Craigs list but moved to Flea Bay. I found the cars and saw the options on the better car, and the Guage package also on the parts car, which also has the 12 bolt. I couldn't find and buy all these options for what I paid for the cars so I had to buy them. The better of the two has minimal rust problems, just the typical for these cars. The interior is in nice shape but still will need some work, the door panels are perfect. Dash is perfect but needs a pad. Console needs a top plate but I have an extra. As I stated I can turn the motor by hand. It has a big Holley carb on a Holley intake. I think with minimal work I can at least find out if the motor will run, It should.
The parts car has a lot more rust issues and the gauge lens is incorrect or the Tic Toc Tach did not come in the car. The lens is the one for idiot lights it says "Gen", "Oil" and "Hot". So did someone change the lens or add the TTT to the car using the original lens........ don't know, don't really care. I now have 2 Tic Toc Tachs.
Now im torn to finish the car I started with less options, nice car though or build the Optioned car and put the disc brakes on that car for more options. If I do that ill probably put my fresh E block motor in that car, and the 455 in the first car which I have cleaned and rebuilt the front susp. and painted the front frame. I did post some pics of that recently.
Anyway thanks for the help and comments, there is a great deal of knowledge in this site, some of you guys amaze me, actually a lot of you do.

Steve

steverw

Hey Octania
Im certainly no expert but the car im currently building is or appears to be a virgin. As in all original never rebuilt, original everything except one half a$$ paint job some where in the distant past. The motor still had the nylon cam gear. Anyway it has an open 10 bolt, which I would believe to be the original but who knows. It is an O axle 3.08 SC code its an auto tranny car. I had 2 other 67 442's in the past, both auto, both 10 bolt open rearends. Im really hoping that both of the rears in these cars are posi's with streetable gears. I plan to use a turbo 200r4, so even lower gears may be ok. Preferably no lower than 3.55. Im going to get the codes off the axles this weekend, but we all know gears can be changed.
The parts car appears it was raced at some time, it has a drive shaft loop.
It has some funky bucket seats, they look like they came out of a rice burner car, and a decent 4 spd console out of something American, not sure what but I think its there for looks as I didn't see a hole in the floor.

joe_padavano

You can fabricate a passable UHV distributor by stealing the reluctor and mag pickup from an HEI and swapping them into a Delco points distributor. I suspect some machining will be required on the top of the reluctor assembly where it interfaces to the mechanical advance weights due to the smaller diameter distributor. Combine this with an HEI module mounted in the gutted UHV box, add a red distributor cap (Mallory, not a mega-dollar Delco original) and you're good to go.

On the key problem, PM me with the four character code off the door lock cylinder and I can punch you a new key. I've got the code book and a Curtis Key Clipper tool.

Octania

"You can fabricate a passable UHV distributor by stealing the reluctor and mag pickup from an HEI and swapping them into a Delco points distributor. I suspect some machining will be required on the top of the reluctor assembly where it interfaces to the mechanical advance weights due to the smaller diameter distributor. Combine this with an HEI module mounted in the gutted UHV box, add a red distributor cap (Mallory, not a mega-dollar Delco original) and you're good to go."
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Hass this voodoo been done, or just a plan?
The mechanical advance systems are completely different.
Then again, with torch and welder, all things are possible.
Maybe a lathe too...

joe_padavano

I have not built one myself, but I've seen the units built by Dave Ray. Note that on his web page he talks about HEI and MSD conversions. I'm only talking about the HEI ones. He's reticent to talk about how he does it, but I looked at his distributors at the Long Beach swap meet one time and it's pretty obvious that he combines parts from a HEI distributor with a points distributor. I'm sure some machining is involved.

Dave's Small Body HEIs

Note in this picture (a Buick Nailhead distributor) that the HEI module is mounted on the bottom of the distributor body.

steverw

Wow that's very cool, I think ill contact this guy and see about converting my points dist. and the UHV box to MSD or HEI, is one or the other a better system? I have an MSD bilit dist on my Vette for about 9 years now, it works great no problems so far. Think I have the 6A box. But also I think the HEI is a good reliable ignition.
Thanks Joe, very interesting!
Steve