Benton Quest

Hi All,
I'm going to see if this is a W30 this weekend.
Engine and trans have been replaced.
Owner says he is not sure.

Can anyone tell me what/where this is and maybe send a pic?

"Should have boxed lower rear control arms"

Thanks,
M

72 w29 all green

rev1-3.jpg

Do you see where the rear sway bar attaches on each side? Those are the "boxed" control arms. Now keep in mind that this isn't going to confirm whether the car is an original W-30 since standard 442s and some others also got the same boxed rear control arms.

442much

What year is the car? If it's a 72, then there will be an "X" in the VIN. If it's not a 72, then you'll need to see paperwork. If the car was built or sold in Canada, then you can trace the car's history. If that is the case, go to our website www.oldsclub.ca and go to the "Links" page. Under "Heritage" click on "GM Vintage Services". Good luck.

joe_padavano

ALL 442s, as well as non-442 Cutlii with the FE2 suspension package, got the boxed lower arms, so this is not a discriminator. Without the original engine and trans, and without a build sheet, you cannot prove the car is a W-30. More to the point, without the original engine, it's just a Cutlass body shell.

Benton Quest

Ok. Thx. I read that the boxed were on the 1970 W30's only.
I really need more help.

droptopron

I gather the car is a '70. If you provide some more details on the car some of these guys can probably give you some ideas what to look for. If its a stick it should have manual disc brakes & no A/C. Obvious is the OAI hood and red wheel wells.

507OLDS

It also needs to have been built in Lansing,Michigan,as ALL W30's were built there.However,non-W30 442's were also built in Lansing as well.

droptopron

I guess you could say that there are some tell tale signs to say its not but without documentation nothing to say it is. VIN should start 344.

GAOldsman

Anyone can switch an intake but it should be aluminum and have this part # 406115 as well as OLDSMOBILE W-455 cast in it as well, unless it's a late build and will have OLDS W-455 but the same part # 406115

The trans if automatic will be coded O W and will have a VIN derivative stamp on it as well as the engine that should match the actual VIN on the car.

507OLDS

The problem is the original engine & trans are missing.

allyolds68

Without a broadcast sheet, build sheet, window sticker, or GM of Canada docs there's no way to verify it's a W30 beyond a doubt. Other than GM of Canada (if it was exported there) there is no current documentation available

You really need to be more specific on the year. The distributor, carb, intake, heads (if they are still there), are generally specific to W30's (though not a specific car)

Generally I look at undocumented W30's as being worth what a 442 is worth and then adding the worth of the W30 specific parts that may still be on the car.

edit:

Oh yeah....red inner fenders 68-71 (maybe a few at the beginning of 72????)

GAOldsman

Ah I missed that part where he stated the engine and trans have been replaced But yes without those then you need some original documentation to prove without a shadow of doubt it is a true W-30.

Benton Quest

Ok
1970, red inner fenders, 344 vin, Lansing built, punched in W30 emblem, no papers. I know these don't validate anything, I just wanted to tell you what I know.

442

Maybe some original bolt on parts were used on the replacement motor. Might want to check the carb no. which should be 7040256 for a manual car and 7040258 for an automatic. I think the distributor would be 1111979 for an automatic, don't remember what the manual number is. By the way, any affiliation with the Jonny Quest series on TV years ago?

Benton Quest

Thanks for the info. I'm going to take all of these numbers with me and go over it good.

No affiliation with the cartoon, just a fan.
I tell my kids the best cartoon ever made. They roll their eyes!
BQ

Benton Quest

Ok, more info.
Aluminum intake with Oldsmobile W455, W on LH manifold with numbers 402295 (or something close), the right mani has a Z on it but can't see numbers, block 396021F (F is a fancy F), heads have a Ga on it, I can see number on it, but can make them out.
I really don't understand the diff, but it has a black round cover with 12 bolts.
Trans has a tag on it, but it is very worn. All I can see on it is 70-OG- 7965.
What do you think?

allyolds68

It should be an OW tranny. If the partial VIN on the tranny matches the VIN on the car it would confirm that it's not a W30...(I think...., someone else that knows 70's should confirm this)

Benton Quest

Hi,
I bought the car knowing it has a non matching eng and trans. The prev owner sold it to me not claiming it was a W because he could not confirm it. I did not pay a W30 price either. It has some parts and I was just curious.

allyolds68

I know and I wasn't being critical in any way. I think you got a hellava car at a helluva price. The tough thing with these cars is it's often easier to prove what it isn't rather than what it is. A VIN number on the tranny could prove what it isn't....

507OLDS

The 70-OG trans is correct for a 70 442(non-W30).The intake with the full word OLDSMOBILE W455,is from an early 70 W30.The GA heads are 72 455 heads.The W/Z manifolds are correct for a 455 A-body car.

344870M

Just out of curiosity. Would a letter from the originating dealership suffice as documentation? My local dealer remembered my car when he first saw it. And it was sold out of a dealership 24 miles away and 20 year prior!

GAOldsman

Unfortunately no and being that the car was assembled in Fremont, California (Z on broadcast card) it cannot be a W30.

344870M

I'm confused about your reply. I get the 'No' to the dealer query, but the Z on the broadcast card does indicate Fremont, CA. I think a Z in the VIN does. My VIN is 344870M168265. The card was stuffed into the springs of the back seat. It is a legitimate W car. Tha cowl also reads 'LAN'.

Did you or I misunderstand each other?

344870M

This is a better look at the card.

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

442

I have a signed statement from the owner of the dealership my car was sold from; I don't consider it official documentation, but along with statements from the previous owners I think it validates the history of the car. A letter from the dealership certainly can't hurt!

GAOldsman

Yes I misunderstood your signature statement as to "Why is there a "Z" on my data plate?" But yes M and LAN = Lansing, Michigan. And like 442 says above it cannot hurt to have it but it isn't considered a "bulletproof" document. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

344870M

It's all good.

Octania

What luck, I wish I had a broadcast sheet for my car. Reupholstered long before I bought it. Only my auto trans proves it's a real W30.

So, if your body tag number reads 269757 I'd say you have documentation. Guard it like the crown jewels. Make copies to hand around and examine, and put the original in a sealed frame to protect it.

Seriously.

507OLDS

Do you guys have any cars with a "Z" next to your interior trim code?I have owned numerous cars with the "Z".but not all of them.I think this topic was dicussed before,but I don't know if anyone ever came up with the explanation.Yes,these are all Lansing cars,if that matters.I am NOT referring to a letter "Z" that would be in the VIN or body number.

344870M

Chances are I'm the 'Z' post guy. I've asked on two other forums, Yahoo! answers, and numerous other people places to no avail.

I'm still holding out that a Z code doubles the value of the car. HAHAHAHA

344870M

Octania - I have it tucked neatly away and several hard copies and jpegs for backup/display.

I also have the pre-delivery checklist signed by a Jesse James. Nobody famous, just a cool name. I learned that this guy was quite the cowboy in his day. He drove his motorcycle between two buses on the highway and had his leg torn off. Makes me wonder how hard he 'checked out' the cars that were sold.

m455sx

would the rear end code help prove that it is a w-30 car? Should start with a T?

507OLDS

In regards to a 1970 W30,the rearend can possibly help determine if it is a W30,if you know it hasn't been changed,and depending on what ratio it is.The 3:42 & 3:91 ratios were the only ones to get a different code for the W30,TM and TO.The 3:08 and 3:23 used the same code for Cutlass,442,and W30.

72xw30

Brian- I have broadcast cards for all my W cars and only 1 of the cars has the "Z". No special or different options on the car. I have the window sticker to the "Z" car too with all options. It is the only 70 W car I have that was delivered in Canada. That is the only difference???

Cheers,

Sam

507OLDS

We were moving Nate's blue W30 to my building yesterday,and that car has the "Z" on the cowl tag as well.70 W30 4-spd,astro blue,black stripe,blue vinyl top,blue bucket interior,late december/69 build,sport wheel,tilt,no rally pac,3:91's,M21.
Does your car with the "Z" on the broadcast sheet also have the "Z" on the cowl tag? That is how his is,and the ones I own right now are also like that.

Mike77

I don't get the point. If the original engine and tranny are missing how can it be anything but a nice Cutlass?

72xw30

Yes Brian, "Z" on the cowl tag and broadcast sheets.