viper771

Wow that paint looks totally different! I wish my paint job was as nice. I have one what is good enough as long as you aren't trying to really impress anyone lol. Awesome job!

Don R.

Thanks Allan,
The PO told me the engine and transmission had both been rebuilt less than 3000 miles ago and my experience so far with both leads me to think he may have been telling the truth - a refreshing experience. My other current car is a 57 Lincoln with many issues on the other side of the coin. I figure the buffer should pay for itself pretty quickly and kick myself for not getting it sooner.


My lifetime Olds tally is:

• 64 88 Sedan
• 64 Jetstar 1 Coupe
• 65 98 Convertible
• 67 Toronado
• 69 Cutlass Convertible
• 69 Hurst Olds
• 72 Cutlass Coupe
• 73 88 Sedan
• 77 98 Coupe
• 78 98 Coupe
• 78 Cutlass coupe
• Plus numerous parts cars

The big cars win but I wish I still had the Hurst Olds...

Don R.

I've been working on my other hobby car, a 57 Lincoln, and haven't done anything to the Starfire for awhile except drive it. Now I am finally going to rebuild the steering column rag joint, it was worn out to the point of causing slop in the steering. I'm also going to clean and lubricate the driver's power seat mechanism and check under the dash. Today I removed the drivers seat, carpeting, and the steering column. It is a non-tilt column so the rag joint is riveted directly to the steering shaft with a splined joint only on the steering gear side, necessitating the column removal. That's as far as I got but I was pleasantly surprised to see that the carpet was factory original and the floor pan underneath is almost perfect, still in red primer with no rust. The sewn-on rubber and aluminum mats kept the carpet from wearing and it looks like it never got wet, first GM car I've ever owned that I can say that!

viper771

Wow!!! It looks like my car a bit.. but I think yours is cleaner. I should lube up my power seat stuff too since I took it out of the car so I could mess with the dash. I haven't been able to work on my car at all I wish I could drive mine.. maybe next summer. Keep up the good work!!! You motivate me to keep my car and remind me that it won't always be parked in the garage!

PetChemMan

I remember redoing all of the vacuum lines to the AC/heater controls pushbutton unit on the dash in my '62 Starfire. That job can be a real headache to get right , so proceed very carefully. I don't think I ever did get the controls completely right, and it had a slight vacuum hiss for years.

viper771

I redid all the lines... but the main switch won't turn on the heater blower for some reason. I don't know if I put the actual dash switch together wrong (I took apart to clean and relube) or what... If I push the vac diaphram that sits ontop of the heater box from the engine compartment side, it works... just I don't have enough vac for some reason to have the diaphram operate like it is supposed to. I notice that the engine runs different affer that diaphram is activated..... so I dunno what is really going on. I haven't messed with it lately bec it was too hot but I hope to get some time to fix it. I like stuff working right.. but it is a total pain to work under the dash!!!!!!!!!!! I am glad I don't have an AC unit, it would be a million times worse lol

Don R.

Yesterday I got to work on the steering column rag joint. The rubber disc had deteriorated to the point of cracking resulting in almost an inch of play. The way it was assembled is a good example of 1960's planned obsolesence, the joint is held together by what are essentially big rivets, the only way to get it off was with a cutoff wheel. With everything cleaned up I installed a bolt on rebuild kit with a new disc and got the column back in today. I still need to play with the driver's seat, hopefully tomorrow.

viper771

How hard was this to do and where did you get your rebuild kit? I would like to do the same thing, esp since mine looks like your old rag joint lol. Good work!!!

Don R.

I got the kit at my local NAPA store. The hard part is having to take the steering column out and cut the old joint apart, putting the kit in is easy. I did have to make a new ground wire that ties the two metal parts together so the horn would still work.

viper771

I didn't know they even sold that kind of stuff at NAPA.

Don R.

It's a universal kit, NAPA part number 630-1012, so many cars used that type of joint - it comes with a bunch of extra parts I did not use.

My local NAPA is the first place I go for parts, it is an older shop with experienced counter guys who still know how to look thing up in the actual BOOKS when the computer draws a blank. I've been able to get a lot of parts for 50s and 60s cars there but places like Autozone and O'Reilly's don't want to spend any time looking anything up so they just say they don't have it...

viper771

Yeah I only get certain things at Advance. There is a NAPA in town I found just recently, but I have been doing business with a smaller type chain store (K.O.I. for you guys in the tri state area). I will have to check that kit out and shop more at NAPA!

Don R.

I took Friday off but worked on the driver's seat today. It's a 4-way tilt power seat and the mechanism operated very slowly and it seemed as if it wouldn't go back far enough so I wanted to check it out. I was pleased to see that, like the floors, the seats had never been exposed to water or much humidity and had no rust. I found one problem right away, one of the four bolts holding the power track to the seat frame had loosened up and fallen out, blocking the track from sliding. I removed the whole power assembly and cleaned/greased/oiled it up, then mounted it in the car to check the operation. It moved smoothly through all four directions of travel. I reinstalled the carpet and kick panel trim then installed the seat assembly after some upholstery cleaning. The seat now moves faster and quieter and I now have some additional legroom!

Of course we all know the rule of old cars - if you fix one problem, another one will immediately pop up to replace it. Well, it happened to me - I started the car to take a ride and smelled gas. I pulled off the air cleaner and the carburetor is leaking, wonderful. I'll either have to rebuild it myself or find someone to do it, just what I did not need right now. Can anyone recommend a Rochester 4 jet expert in the DFW area?

viper771

I should do this too with my power seat and windows. I need my carb rebuilt too since the gas of today totally ruined the fuel pump/carb. I replaced my fuel pump and fuel lines, but haven't gotten around to the carb yet. I was thinking of just sending it to Fusicks, but that route is kind of expensive

Don R.

I still need to clean and lube my rear windows, they work but very slowly. Does Fusick do carb rebuilds? I know they sell the kits but did not know they did rebuilds - how much do they charge?

viper771

I want to say somewhere in the 350-450 range for a carb rebuild/repaint. They also do brake booster/master cylinder rebuilds too. It sounds expensive, but that seems to be the going rate for carb rebuilds with a repaint of the body in correct colors etc. I will end up sending a power brake booster to them for a rebuild so I can get rid of the uncorrect aftermarket booster that came with my car.

My windows work kind of slow too. What do you use to lube them? Just white grease or something more heavy duty?

Don R.

I don't like white grease as it can harden up, I'll use engine oil on all pivot points and wheel bearing grease on rollers and slides.

That is a lot of money for a carb rebuild, I got a quote of $285 plus shipping from Then and Now Automotive, who I have used before for fuel pump rebuilds but that also seems like a lot. I wonder how much of that money is for cosmetic restoration? In my case the carb is in working condition and doesn't look bad, so I'm going to buy a rebuild kit for $28 and do it myself, I'll keep you posted on how it comes out.

viper771

I would like to hear how it goes!! I have NEVER taken a carb apart before so I am not sure if I even want to try it. But I need to do it or have it rebuilt since ethanol has eaten up the gaskets/rubber pieces. The weird thing is that the carb looks like it was redone not long ago, or at least repainted. I will have to check out Then and Now automotive. I still need that brake booster redone

Good info on the oil... Never thought of using engine oil but it makes total sense! Check on the wheel bearing grease as well!

D. Yaros

Carb rebuild is not that difficult. Just a need to pay attention to detail.

Here is a link describing the process, albeit on a Caddy 4 barrel Rochester -
Carb Rebuilld Hopefully, it will give you some idea what all is involved.

viper771

I would just be afraid to mess something up that I had to adjust. Very good info!!! I am going to read this over... trying to get ready to do some work over the winter so HOPEFULLY I can have the car at least around the block a few times this next summer

Don R.

I finally got the Rochester 4GC rebuilt and back running, like everything else I do it took longer than I expected. Since the carb was coming off I originally planned to combine that with replacing my heater control valve and also clean and repaint the top of the engine. I put plastic down over the garage floor and totally covered the car. I pulled off the carb, it appeared to be leaking from the front where the air horn met the carb body. I had also started to notice a worsening bog when I hit the gas, especially when cold. I took it apart and cleaned everything with carb cleaner and air pressure but it was actually quite clean inside. I reassembled everything and checked all the adjustments, the float levels were a bit off, especially on the secondary side. I changed out the heater valve and was lucky that nothing was rusted too bad, the bolts came out clean. Right then life got in the way and I had to cancel the repainting and wrap things up, put the carb on and started it up AND IT STILL LEAKED! I was pissed and had to park it until this week. When I got back to it I noticed that it was leaking from the fuel inlet fitting, the one thing I HAD NOT removed from the carb. I pulled it off, replaced the casket and put it back but it still leaked. I pulled it again, applied Permatex High-Tack to all the threads, and that finally did it, leak free. Wrapped it up today and readjusted the idle then took it for a ride, what a difference! It now idles smoother and slower and it positively JUMPS when you hit the pedal, I think I had an accelerator pump issue since I got it. This was also the first time driving it with the the new steering rag joint, it handles much better with no wander or play in the wheel. This car is now a real pleasure to drive and I will be using it much more than I have in the past. Both of these repairs cost me a total of less than $50.00 out of pocket and I must say they are very high on the bang-for-the-buck scale, wish I would have done them sooner.

D. Yaros

Don,

Lookin' good to me. Glad it turned out well for you!

viper771

I REALLY need to do this. I was thinking about either just sending it in, or trying to take a crack at it myself. I mentioned before that I have NEVER ever messed with a carb.... so I would be learning on the fly. I wouldn't really know how to adjust anything, but I am pretty sure I could replace the gaskets. I love reading about your progress! I will hopefully get to work on my own car over the winter a bit.. I am sure the leaky carb is just one of my problems lol

daves62

This has been a great thread to read. I am battling a lot of the same issues as you guys.
Viper if you are little scared to jump in with both feet on your orig carb go get a old quad at a wrecker and do a practice run its not hard just take your time

viper771

That is a good idea actually!! I guess I could get familiar with it that way. I like the color combo of your 62 Dave!!! So far, I haven't seen ANY cars with my color combo yet. I guess it wasn't that popular (white body with red top). I have to admit that I would rather have a color combo like yours Thanks for the awesome idea!!!

Don R.

I can't believe its been almost a year since I have posted anything about this car! Two things responsible, the main one was the acquisition of a 1934 Packard as a second hobby car which kept me very busy for awhile. The other was that I haven't had any real trouble with this car and have just been enjoying it. As we all know there is no such thing as a "finished" car project and this 63 is no exception, I still have a to-do list with a number of unchecked items. Now that our hot Texas weather is moderating a little I've decided to do some underhood things that I probably should have done sooner.

The first and foremost is getting my power steering pump rebuilt, as long as I've owned the car it has groaned when turning the wheels at idle speed. This has gotten worse lately and now includes momentary loss of assist, so I'm sending it to Lares Corporation. The other item is replacement of the alternator. The previous owner had an incorrect "one-wire" alternator crudely installed which has a single groove pulley. My car has factory A/C which normally uses two belts to turn the compressor, however with the incorrect alternator only one belt can be installed. The result has been a slipping belt and premature wear. I had a correct alternator built by Powermaster with a dual pulley and the original three wire hookup with an external regulator like original.

It's going to take a couple of weeks to get the steering pump done so while I'm waiting I'll also do some sorely needed underhood cleanup and spray can detailing. I started today by taping a 9' by 12' drop cloth to the floor and positioning the car, after I took the photos I covered the whole car to keep dust and overspray off. I drained and removed the pump without spilling too much fluid and will ship it to Lares tomorrow. I'll also need to visit my friends at NAPA to get a new voltage regulator, belts, and some new hose for the steering line.

Oldskeeper

Hi Don, just reminder that the 63 regulator is a one year issue and when you get the new belts get a match set that way one belt isn't tighter than the other.
Now lets see some pictures of the Packard
Steve

Don R.

Thanks Steve. Do you know what is unique about the regulator? The one on the car is a newer looking NAPA unit, currently disconnected, but I'm replacing it as insurance for the new alternator. All the belts will be new for the same reason.

Here are a few shots of the Packard, it is an original car in good running and driving condition and came with all documentation back to the original purchase, not too many of those left!

Oldskeeper

Hi Don, I've purchased a few of the regulators for my 63s and was told by everyone behind the counter that 63 only, I've never tried to install a 62 or 64 on mine.
I really like the Packard such a nice car and a beautiful survivor, thanks for sharing the pictures and enjoy driving it around.
Steve

Don R.

I shipped the PS pump to Lares and they received it yesterday so my fingers are crossed that it will rebuild OK. Today I started stripping stuff off the engine to get it ready to clean and paint, the side with the A/C compressor will be a challenge. I did remember I wanted to check something and I was very glad I did. If you follow this thread you'll know I've had a lot of problems with vacuum leaks on this car, most of which were traced down to bad hoses and diaphragms which I replaced. Even after that I still noticed noise from the underdash A/C diaphragms when I would accelerate, as if the doors were moving. I knew this was a symptom of either a vacuum leak or inadequate vacuum supply.

Another problem I have recently noticed was an increase in braking pedal effort, not all the time but noticeable in a hard stop. I did a full brake job on this car when I first got it but had the master cylinder replaced with a new one by a shop when I had all the suspension work done. With the above symptoms I began to wonder if they had forgotten to install the O-ring seal on the master where it enters the booster, I had made this common mistake years ago on my Riviera but remembered it having a much worse effect on pedal effort. I pulled the master today and found that yes, they did forget the O-ring, but they had wrapped the master with some kind of close cell foam to seal it instead. It must have partially sealed the booster but had quickly degraded and fell apart when I touched it. I ordered the correct flat O-ring from "Booster" Dewey, hopefully this will solve both my brake and vacuum problems!

Don R.

My "small project" continues to grow, sound familiar? I have not had cooling problems with this car but I have had some seepage from the far side of the top tank and looking inside I see a lot of blockage in the tubes. My past experience with radiator "flush and repair" jobs has been poor and after I heard the preposterous prices to recore a copper radiator today I decided to get a new radiator. The one I ordered is a copper / brass stock replacement as far as size and appearance but has a high-efficiency core with more tubes than stock, advertised as cooling better than high performance aluminum cores. I'm also going to replace the lower flex hose with a correct molded one. I pulled the old radiator and shroud today, an added benefit will be that I can now see and reach things not possible with the radiator in place which will help my detailing. I'll post some "after photos later.

Don R.

Now that the radiator and fan have been removed I can see the front of the engine clearly for the first time. One thing I noticed was that the fuel hoses were poorly, and dangerously, routed. The factory A/C cars have a 3/8" fuel supply and a 1/4" fuel return with steel lines running along the frame rail but rubber hoses connecting to the tank in the rear and fuel pump in front. I had these hoses replaced when I first got the car but they cut them too short in the front, leaving the supply hose pulled at a sharp angle to the inlet fitting and the return hose actually rubbing against the upper control arm. They weren't damaged but that is pretty dangerous. Today I extended both hoses with splice fittings which put them back in factory position and out of harm's way. Tomorrow I'll start backflushing the block in preparation for the new radiator.

Don R.

Back again, I've spent most of the last week on other things but I did keep going a bit on this project. I did flush the engine out, that was a comedy of errors. I took out the thermostat and bypassed the heater core then hooked up my drain hose to the top hose outlet and my flush gun to the lower hose going into the water pump. The car is sitting way back in my tandem garage so the drain hose ended in a bucket far from the door. Water and air were connected to the flush gun so I started with the water, as soon as it worked its way down to the bucket out it flopped shooting all over the floor. This didn't really surprise me although it shot residual antifreeze all under the Packard which was still in the garage. With the water running I tapped the air pressure lever which popped the flush gun out of the hose and neatly drenched me face first! I then installed the clamp which I had forgotten and kept going. I got plenty of dirt out with all the water but did not see any hard chunks. Needless to say I spent more time hosing down and drying the garage floor than I did actually flushing the motor.

I received the master cylinder O-ring from Booster Dewey and installed it. I also got the rebuilt power steering pump back from Lares. The rest of last week was spent cleaning and degreasing the underhood area. I use Super Clean which is a water based solvent, spray it on, leave it a few minutes and wash the residue off with water. Works very well. I wire brushed the old paint and finished up with an overall wipe with wax and grease remover. I start painting tomorrow, the silver valve covers will be first, then the red engine, and all the surrounding black last. An awful lot of masking involved, I use a lot of aluminum foil because its easy to form around things and you can reuse it. I need to get more masking tape!

L69 equipped

Looking good Don.

I have always loved these cars and yes, aluminum foil is GREAT for masking off unwanted areas.

Dave

Don R.

Thanks Dave.
I've been masking and painting for three days and am finally done. I wanted to take advantage of good weather, its supposed to rain today. Wednesday I painted the silver valve covers plus cleaned and painted all the removed parts and fasteners. Thursday I remasked everything and painted the engine red and started remasking again to do the black engine compartment but had to wait for the red to dry. Friday I finished masking and did the inner fenders, brackets and A/C compressor. One last masking session and I did the core support and surrounding area. I left the red and silver to dry overnight because I had to apply tape to the new paint and did not want it to lift. I used Scotch blue tape in those areas and it worked well, only had one small area of red that I had to touch up. I pretty much filled a garbage can with used foil and tape, this would have been a lot easier if I pulled the engine! I'm going to take a couple days off then I'll start putting it all back together, hopefully my radiator will arrive on Monday.

L69 equipped

Looks VERY nice!


Dave

oldcutlass

Well I see retirement has kept you busy. The engine compartment looks great. Hows the Packard doing?

Don R.

Thanks Eric. Retirement is great as I can work on the car whenever I want - or not. The Packard is doing fine although I have been spending most of my time on the Starfire.

Another week gone, I'm still making progress but a few obstacles have popped up. I found out last Tuesday that the radiator I ordered came in - severely damaged in transit. The dealer sent it back so it will be another couple of weeks for them to make a new one. The good news is I may get a partial credit, we'll see. With my sails partially de-winded I started to reassemble what I had removed to do the cleaning and painting. I upgraded the heater hoses to NAPA Gold Stripe which is Semi truck stuff, long life but thicker than normal so a bit harder to route. Getting the new Powermaster alternator in was fun, there is JUST enough room for it to slide past the fragile original A/C hoses and I had to tape it so the sharp edges of the pulley fan wouldn't cut anything. After I got all the wiring back on and the ignition hooked up yesterday I wanted to start it to be sure there were no fuel leaks where I had fiddled with the fuel pump hoses. It started and ran fine but DumbA** forgot to connect the trans cooler lines together so I pumped about a quart of trans fluid on the floor! And, true to form, I do have a fuel leak from the return hose. I wrapped it up at that point and will take a couple days off as the weather has deteriorated. Nothing is ever simple...

viper771

Very good work as usual!!! I am taking a slight break from my 62 SF for now and working on my 68 442. Both kind of need similar work anyway. I love seeing your progress! When I get a chance I need to put the new intake gasket on and get rid of the heat riser valve in my 62... which should fix quite a few problems. Then the hard stuff... like new suspension components

Don R.

I need some help from the 63 Starfire experts out there. As part of cleaning up my engine compartment I would like to add any decals or labels that would have been factory original. I already have replacement aluminum air cleaner signs but I do not know what else is correct. Can anyone post photos showing the location of any labels and also advise where they are available as reproductions?