chip-powell

Head scratcher here. Maybe I'm just hot and not thinking strait from being outside in the heat all day. Two weeks ago, my cutlass was running fine. No problems at all. Purring like a kitten. It's been parked since then. This afternoon I go out to start it up and take it out for a drive.

My first clue that something was not right was that the door buzzer didn't go off when I opened the driver's door. No lights either. Put the key in the ignition and nothing, not even a click. OK. I figure that somehow my 6 month old battery somehow died. Put it on my tester and it comes back fine. Try to jump it...nothing. Same thing, no buzzer, interior lights, not a thing.

My fogged brain started thinking solenoid or points, but that can't be it can it? If that was the problem, it should be cranking, but not starting. I'm just getting nothing.

Any ideas out there in Olds land? I'm going outside again to crawl under the hood to see if a wire came loose somehow while it has been sitting.

Vintage Chief

Do you have 12V from battery to horn relay junction block?

chip-powell

I was just going through the CSM and was started thinking the same thing. How would I tell if it's gone bad?

Vintage Chief

I will say about 9 out of 10 times it's often the negative (-) ground connection(s). Battery negative (-) ground cable to block. Ensure negative (-) battery post is clean, battery cable end terminal is shiny & clean, negative (-) battery cable attachment point at the block is clean - remove it, wire brush/sandpaper to ensure you have solid metal-on-metal and ensure the battery cable end terminal is squeaky clean.

Vintage Chief

Since your electrical devices require 12 VDC to operate, the first thing to determine is if the battery cable wire from positive (+) battery post to horn relay junction/distribution block demonstrates 12 VDC. Verify you have 12 VDC on that wire first.

Fun71

Check battery cables for tight connections and no corrosion. Either of these can cause no +12Volts at the horn relay junction/distribution block Norm mentioned above.

chip-powell

Thank the heavens for small mercys.
It WAS the battery. I just got back from Autozone where I had them test it again. I figured that I bought it there 6 months ago, I'll let them test it and possibly replace it because it's still under warrenty. Apparently, my tester is bad. They tested it and said that it is completely dead and gave me a new one. Came home put it in, and she started right up.

By the way, thanks for the advice guys. Just to let you know, I know it wasn't the battery cables. They are clean and I had a really tight connection to the battery. I was worried there for a few. I'm more of a body and light mechanical guy when it comes to working on cars. Electrical and wiring has always been something that I've been leery off, so I really did not feel like tracing the wires back from the battery to find the fault.

The one thing that has still got me thinking is "How did the battery die?" My Cutlass is completely stock so nothing should be drawing a charge when she's parked. Did I just have a bum battery or is something else happening. If the alternator (which is only 3 years old) had gone bad and was not charging the battery, I would have found out before now.

It was just weird. She went from running great, to completely dead after only 2 weeks of sitting.

Vintage Chief

Measure the voltage at the battery with the car running. You should measure ~14.3 VDC while the ALT is running and charging the battery. A reading of 13.8 VDC - 14.6 VDC indicates the ALT is charging the battery.

Vintage Chief

Being completely stock has no direct bearing w/ a parasitic draw. Devices which continue to work after the car is shutdown is the leading cause of a parasitic draw. A parasitic draw can manifest itself in several ways - often times it's wiring which has become faulty or the device itself (e.g. cigarette lighter, map light remains on, etc.).

Vintage Chief

You should state what year & model car - guessing on our part doesn't work so well. Internal VR or external VR?

chip-powell

1971 Cutlass Supreme 350 4bbl. Everything except anything made of rubber is original (including the wiring).

I'll check the charge tomorrow. I just got out of the shower, dinner's on the table and I don't feel like sweating through another set of clothes. Thanks again.

Vintage Chief

A 1971 CS 350 4 bbl should have an OEM ALT w/ external VR.

72455

Just to verify it's not a parasitic draw, measure your battery voltage several times a day over a week (if possible, and without starting it). If you notice a steady drop in the voltage, then you have a draw somewhere. Ask me how I know...

Fun71

What type of tester do you have? An actual battery load tester, a DMM, or something else?

Vintage Chief

"If" you suspect you may have a parasitic draw draining your battery this is a parasitic draw file I created sometime prior to the last ice age which works on any vehicle (see attachment).

fleming442

If your factory (mechanical) clock is functional, that would be a constant draw that will kill the battery. You can: unhook the battery between drives, use a good float charger (CTEK), or drive the car everyday.

72455

Mmmm...I disagree with that. I have the factory clock in my '72 Supreme and it was parked for two weeks and it cranked right up.

BackInTheGame

Norm, thanks for posting your parasitic draw troubleshooting document.

Vintage Chief

chip-powell

Sorry it took a while to get back on the site. Got called in to work to fix an issue and have been there for the last 2 days.
I found the power leech. I decided to troubleshoot it the way that I do computer systems at work and start with the easiest option and work my way out from there. It turned out that the map light on my rearview mirror was on (congrats to Norm for the guess, you win a kewpie doll). I must have inadvertently bumped it while cleaning the windshield, since I never really use it).
Thanks again to Norm for that parasitic draw pdf. I've printed that off and placed it in my CSM for future reference.

zl1 camaro

This test is what you need to do. we use this method all the time. YOU will not need to wait to test this after hooking up you amp tester because you have no module's to draw down the system for 15 to 30 minutes.

zl1 camaro

You still should check the charging system and definitely ck for a parasitic drain the system. if present this will kill the new battery as well.

fleming442

Just remember this: dead batteries kill alternators and dead alternators kill batteries. It's a 2 way street.

taa442

Hadn't heard that dead battery or dead alternator could cause each other to ruin. Why is this?

fleming442

A battery with a shorted cell or not holding a charge is a short or excessive load on the alternator.
An alternator with a defective regulator/burned diode causes a drain on an otherwise good battery, until it cycles itself to death.

taa442

Ok. Thanks

Fun71

I did the same thing back in the 90s. Cleaned the inside of the car, then the next morning when I got in to drive to work I saw the rear view mirror was cracked. I touched the glass and burned my finger. Apparently I swiped the map light switch when I was wiping the windshield and couldn't tell the light was on since it was still daytime.