electrical problem with starter relay
May 11th, 2015, 05:35 PM
#1
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Idaho
Posts: 59
electrical problem with starter relay
ok, so this will be a little long, but its the best way i can find to explain it.
After having the majority of the front replaced with all new bolts and gaskets and more...i decided Alice was good enough to take a road trip up north a few hours for a fishing derby. The morning we were leaving (car packed up full) we were at the coffee shop, and when i go through the drive through i like to turn her off so i can hear and so i dont waste gas.
When i went to turn her back on, she starting giving me a quick ticking like a spark plug or the alternator was out (more spark plug though). after waiting a second, i turned her over and she started right up with no noise, but as soon as i started driving, i smelled something burning, so i left her running and opened up the hood and the clip that holds the throttle cable to the bracket was on fire. i was able to get it out, but it melted the plastic clip to where the throttle cable was useless.
I pulled the choke out and idled back at 10mph 2 miles away and left her at my brothers for the weekend.
When i got back, i had a friend help me figure out what was going on, when he tried to start it, the cable where the clip attaches instantly started glowing bright red.
we thought we found the problem when one of the positive wires for the starter relay was out and touching the fender, but about a week later, it did it again. Luckily i was able to catch it so i didnt have to spend an other $35 on a throttle cable kit.
We have looked all over and are unable to find out where this hot wire might be coming from.
It only happens when your trying to start her, and not very often.
I even tried to start her today, and she didn't act up.
Any guesses?
and I am looking for a heavy duty braided engine ground strap to put on her to see if that works.
After having the majority of the front replaced with all new bolts and gaskets and more...i decided Alice was good enough to take a road trip up north a few hours for a fishing derby. The morning we were leaving (car packed up full) we were at the coffee shop, and when i go through the drive through i like to turn her off so i can hear and so i dont waste gas.
When i went to turn her back on, she starting giving me a quick ticking like a spark plug or the alternator was out (more spark plug though). after waiting a second, i turned her over and she started right up with no noise, but as soon as i started driving, i smelled something burning, so i left her running and opened up the hood and the clip that holds the throttle cable to the bracket was on fire. i was able to get it out, but it melted the plastic clip to where the throttle cable was useless.
I pulled the choke out and idled back at 10mph 2 miles away and left her at my brothers for the weekend.
When i got back, i had a friend help me figure out what was going on, when he tried to start it, the cable where the clip attaches instantly started glowing bright red.
we thought we found the problem when one of the positive wires for the starter relay was out and touching the fender, but about a week later, it did it again. Luckily i was able to catch it so i didnt have to spend an other $35 on a throttle cable kit.
We have looked all over and are unable to find out where this hot wire might be coming from.
It only happens when your trying to start her, and not very often.
I even tried to start her today, and she didn't act up.
Any guesses?
and I am looking for a heavy duty braided engine ground strap to put on her to see if that works.
May 11th, 2015, 07:08 PM
#5
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 7,286
The cable is passing electricity, and a lot of it.
Not designed for that
Major starter current is supposed to go:
Battery
cable
Solenoid
coils
starter case [now at ~0 volts, having done its work]
Ground strap
block
ground cable
battery completes the CIRCUIT
If your MAJOR current [not just the solenoid current] cannot take this path, it will take other paths, and generally turn those paths into heaters, as you see.
If ANY of these starter circuit links is broken or failing to conduct due to corrosion, etc. then the current will favor another path. Electricity takes ALL available paths. It just favors the least resistance. Remember that. ALL paths. All the time.
You want it to avoid [really, minimize] the throttle cable, trans cable, etc.
Does your skill set include the use of a voltmeter and/or ohm meter to troubleshoot?
At least physically verify -
battery (-) cable secured to ENGINE BLOCK. Not a bracket or head bolt. Well, the factory did use a head boltstud for some applications, so, sure, use that if you like. Loosen, inspect, make sure the star washer is in there between cable end and block or head bolt stud. Re-secure. Use a volt/ ohm meter if possible to verify a good connection.
Starter ground/support strap in place- otherwise current must go thru starter nose to block, often a poor path due to paint or oxidation...
body ground in place from aft end of RH head to firewall- bare braided wire about 1/2" wide.
Radiator support/ headlights should have a grounding wire also, typically feeding right off the (-) cable at the battery.
Not designed for that
Major starter current is supposed to go:
Battery
cable
Solenoid
coils
starter case [now at ~0 volts, having done its work]
Ground strap
block
ground cable
battery completes the CIRCUIT
If your MAJOR current [not just the solenoid current] cannot take this path, it will take other paths, and generally turn those paths into heaters, as you see.
If ANY of these starter circuit links is broken or failing to conduct due to corrosion, etc. then the current will favor another path. Electricity takes ALL available paths. It just favors the least resistance. Remember that. ALL paths. All the time.
You want it to avoid [really, minimize] the throttle cable, trans cable, etc.
Does your skill set include the use of a voltmeter and/or ohm meter to troubleshoot?
At least physically verify -
battery (-) cable secured to ENGINE BLOCK. Not a bracket or head bolt. Well, the factory did use a head boltstud for some applications, so, sure, use that if you like. Loosen, inspect, make sure the star washer is in there between cable end and block or head bolt stud. Re-secure. Use a volt/ ohm meter if possible to verify a good connection.
Starter ground/support strap in place- otherwise current must go thru starter nose to block, often a poor path due to paint or oxidation...
body ground in place from aft end of RH head to firewall- bare braided wire about 1/2" wide.
Radiator support/ headlights should have a grounding wire also, typically feeding right off the (-) cable at the battery.
May 15th, 2015, 06:24 PM
#6
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Idaho
Posts: 59
Thank you all for the responses, after talking to a few good friends finally i was able to get a good layout with it. yes, that was the problem, And i bought a nice braided ground strap (heavy duty) and hooked it to the engine hoist bolt and down around to the engine mounting bracket bolt. Also got a negative and hid it and mounted it from the battery to the power steering bracket. Needs a little more work to look good, but then again, so do a lot of other things.
Problem is now solved, and thank you again.
Problem is now solved, and thank you again.
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