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If you have jack stands to support the vehicle it would be extremely easy to support the rear-end w/ an additional set of light-duty jack stands which can be purchased pretty inexpensive - just need a small set to support the rear-end. It's easy to finagle the rear-end for lowering, raising and aligning if the rear-end is sitting on jack stands when/if you elect to lower/remove the rear-end. In any case, good on you for tackling the job. It really is not a difficult job - one you'll actually enjoy. As Eric has previously suggested, jack the car up as high as you can. If you aren't comfortable perhaps with the jack-stands you have to support the entire vehicle, make certain you certainly side on the side of safety & ensure you're using the right jack-stands. You'll feel much better about gaining the freedom you need to work comfortably & safely under the vehicle.
That's tempting me Eric, and I've considered that. (Like so often is the case in restorations, this started out as a simple fuel/sender, etc, R&R, and now this.) My concern with pulling the whole axle out is getting it back in, aligned so that I can bolt it back up. If I drop the axle and "roll the rear" as you eloquently described it, leaving the lower arms connected, I'm confident I can align it aligned to bolt the upper arms back in. (I also don't have the luxury of an extensive amount of room to work.)
I used to be able to take a headlight replacement into a complete frame off from MAW's... Its not that hard to get things lined back up, I did it with the help of my 106# wife. Once its all bolted together its self aligning to the car, so nothing to mess up there. I don't know how I messed up a rib (I think that's what I did) in the process laying on my side, probably just getting old I guess. Basically set the rear back on jack stands under the car, then shifted it around and aligned each side for the lowers and then connected the uppers.
I do have two pair of jack stands, one set capable to support at least a small truck (which I'm using on the frame), and the other more than adequate for the Cutlass, let alone the rear axle. Thanks for the safety reminder, which I'm all about, as well as the continued words of encouragement. You guys are the best that the CO forum has to offer!
On a related question ... any suggestion(s) on how to minimize the brake fluid spill & loss when disconnecting the front-to-rear brake line, axle hose, and axle lines? I don't want to inadvertently drain the master cylinder reservoir either, and be stuck with having to remove and bench bleed it.
I put rubber caps on the ends until I was ready to reconnect the lines. Your going to have to bleed the rear system either way because once you break the line connections you lose a bit of fluid and allow air into the lines. Clean up the spill as required and use cardboard to lay flat under the car to minimize the mess.
You can also just make your own using your old ones as welding jigs. I made these lowers recently for my 77 B body. Although center to center the lowers where the same length as the GM A body I still made them from about 60 bucks with 120 wall DOM tubing and 3/4 OD. Tubing for the bolt sleeves. The solid sleeves offer no difference in ride harshness. I used GM A body adjustables for the uppers the length difference was 10 inches with the A body and 11 with the B body but they adjust so they worked lol. Just a little outside the box thinking.
I'm now at the point where I "rolled the rear" (Eric's description) having removed the lower arm bolts holding the axle to the rear upper arms. Axle being held now only by lower control arms on jack stands. Looking for any tips or suggestions for removing the crusty upper arm bolts to the frame before trying anything. The lower arm bolts weren't too difficult with a breaker bar. I used penetrating oil. Same method for the upper arm bolts-to-frame? Apply heat? Use an impact gun?
Will there be alignment challenges bolting the replacement rear upper arms back to the axle? Roll the axle back up to align with upper arms?
They are probably seized in the bushing sleeve. Usually use a flat but on an air hammer to punch them out. Might have to sacrifice the bolt and hammer it out.
Tom - I had no issues removing mine. I'm not completely certain about the entire roll the rear scenario honestly. I placed my rear axle on jack stands, hoisted the axle ever so slightly (straight up in the air) to remove any tension on the bolts, removed the nuts and beat out all the bolts w/ a hammer. Twist & wiggle the axle as you beat the bolts out w/ the hammer. You'll have no issues w/ alignment. You're inserting new bushings embedded in polyurethane or rubber anyways. Beat those suckers out of there - don't baby them. You can purchase identical length GRADE 8 zinc bolts from Ace Hardware if you screw the pooch.
Tom - With more clarity I should have said. While the rear axle is supported on both sides with two jack stands (one each side), take your floor jack (or bottle jack), place it under the axle of the side you're working on, and just ever so slightly raise that end of the rear axle and bang out the bolts. Do the same on the other side.
For what it's worth if you have a friend with a motorcycle /atv jack they work awesome to remove rear ends. I bought one for 40 bucks at a swap meet. Best 40 I ever spent. I also use it for transmission work to install.
Tom - With more clarity I should have said. While the rear axle is supported on both sides with two jack stands (one each side), take your floor jack (or bottle jack), place it under the axle of the side you're working on, and just ever so slightly raise that end of the rear axle and bang out the bolts. Do the same on the other side.
Thank you Norm. I did bang out the bolts holding the upper arms to the axle. I have the body raised up high leaving the wheels on, then lowered the axle to separate the arms from the axle. In doing so, the axle did roll back slightly as Eric had mentioned, which would allow more access to remove the bushings on the axle.
The upper arms are now held on by the bolts to the frame. The lower arm-to-axle bolts/nuts weren't too difficult to loosen. Should I expect the same for the upper arm-to-frame bolts/nuts? I will remove wheels for easier access to those bolts, supporting the axle with jack stands of course.
Last edited by Toms cutlass; April 6th, 2020 at 10:00 AM.
Tom - I replaced my rear springs, upper control arms, lower control arms and bushings; I removed my wheels before I began the entire project. If you already have the nuts/bolts removed from the axle the axle should be sitting freely on the jack stands. In reference to the nuts/bolts holding the arms to the frame they should be a cake walk; well, except for the fact you have to noodle your way 'inside' the frame with a wrench to hold the head of the bolt (as I recall). In such a position, what I generally do is liberally pack the inside of the socket w/ grease so as to assist in retaining the bolt as you remove it. Honestly, I can't recall if it's the nut or the bolt which is inside the frame. In any case, packing the socket w/ grease will help to retain the item (nut or bolt) as you remove it.
Thank you again, Norm. You have a good memory ... the bolt head is to the rear and the nut is tucked up under the frame above the mufflers. I have new grade 8 bolts w/nuts for the arms. Like you, I'm also replacing the lower arms after the upper arms are installed (along with new shocks, rear axle brake lines, hose, etc.). If the axle isn't perfectly lined up to bolt up the new rear upper arms, I'll get some 'muscle' assistance from my sons along with the jack under the axle.
How difficult was replacing the lower arms? I have boxed lowers to install. It appears the mufflers (it has duals) may be obstructing the complete removal of the front lower arm bolt. Did you have to loosen the exhaust?
I replaced everything at the same time (as I mentioned above), so I removed/loosened anything which may have obstructed/hindered the process. Yes, the exhaust pipes and/or the mufflers obstructed removal so I removed the exhaust clamps and re-positioned the mufflers/pipes for removal of the control arms. I have Flowmaster duals.
IMO, the entire job was easy - including removal of the bushings on the pumpkin. The most difficult (for me) item in a frame-on suspension rebuild is the R&R of front springs. Compressing, aligning and inserting front springs is what it is - time-consuming & tedious. You just need to get your head around it from the beginning and live with it.
Tom, I was born in Chicago, raised in Chicago & Elgin, IL. Anything you do in the winter in Northern, IL is done slowly. Looking forward to the day you can say "done".
Update: slow but steady 'Northern IL' progress ... rear upper arms removed, axle bushings removed, shocks removed. Now removing old and installing new rear solid brake line, rear flexible brake hose, and axle brake lines. The rear hose-to-solid brake line connection at the frame was very questionable. I'll have peace-of-mind now that this won't fail. Axle painted with Por-15 (black). Lower arms R&R to follow ...
March 24th, 2020, 02:16 PM
