Front Lower Control Arm mount/ear hole wallowed out
#1
Front Lower Control Arm mount/ear hole wallowed out
I went to install my stock front lower control arms (with ES poly bushings) earlier and ran into a problem. The hole (circled in red) on the rearmost drivers side frame mount/ear is wallowed out a bit. On the inside of this mount, the metal protrudes about 2-3mm or so on the top of the hole as a result. This will need to be smoothed out obviously. The bolt jiggles up and down a bit on the wallowed end, but not all the way up. The 'true center' seems to be the bottom where it sits in the pics. I can stick about half inch of my index finger through the hole. What would be the best way to tackle this?
Inside pic of mount/ear...
Inside pic of mount/ear...
Last edited by oldzy; October 22nd, 2011 at 09:32 PM.
#2
My suggestion would be to weld a good quality washer of the correct size to the mount at the proper hole location. I had the same problem many years ago on a '69 Chevelle drag car on the rear upper mounts. We found some washers that were the exact size of the original hole and welded them on. No one will know it's there but you!
#3
I've got the same situation in the right upper rear-end mount on the frame of my Chevelle.
It was raced pretty hard before I got it in 1980, and I drove it every day for 10 years.
Now it's wallowed by about 1/4", and has a very interesting "throttle steer" quality to it.
I've pretty much decided on an alignment jig of my own design for whenever I get "a round tuit," because I've got no idea exactly where the original hole was to begin with, and I don't want to permanently align it wrong.
Also, it would seem that the replacement metal can't just lay over the original, but has to sit within the hole, because the rubber bushing has a toothed central tube which is supposed to be squeezed tight between the metal mounts, and if I leave the hole big, it won't be squeezed at all.
I'd love to hear from other who have fixed similar problems, though, before I do mine (which ain't gonna be soon...).
- Eric
It was raced pretty hard before I got it in 1980, and I drove it every day for 10 years.
Now it's wallowed by about 1/4", and has a very interesting "throttle steer" quality to it.
I've pretty much decided on an alignment jig of my own design for whenever I get "a round tuit," because I've got no idea exactly where the original hole was to begin with, and I don't want to permanently align it wrong.
Also, it would seem that the replacement metal can't just lay over the original, but has to sit within the hole, because the rubber bushing has a toothed central tube which is supposed to be squeezed tight between the metal mounts, and if I leave the hole big, it won't be squeezed at all.
I'd love to hear from other who have fixed similar problems, though, before I do mine (which ain't gonna be soon...).
- Eric
#4
Step bit hole out to 1 ".
Cut a 15/16 replacement disc from proper thickness material with a hole saw.
Weld the replacement disc - centered - into the 1" hole. Grind front and back smooth.
Use the drill hole from the hole saw as your guide to drill to the proper size for the bolt.
Paint it and you will never know it was ever worked on.
Cut a 15/16 replacement disc from proper thickness material with a hole saw.
Weld the replacement disc - centered - into the 1" hole. Grind front and back smooth.
Use the drill hole from the hole saw as your guide to drill to the proper size for the bolt.
Paint it and you will never know it was ever worked on.
#5
If it was me, it seems the original hole is fairly easy to define. I would smooth everything to eliminate the metal bulging on the inside, clean away the paint inside and around the hole and just fill the area that is worn away with a good weld. There's not that much missing and this will be an easy fix. Just make sure the welding is done correctly to get correct penetration into the existing metal. Grind everything smooth, clean up the hole and you'll be ready to go with no evidence of a repair; that is as long as you touch up the nice paint you have on your frame.
#6
If it was me, it seems the original hole is fairly easy to define. I would smooth everything to eliminate the metal bulging on the inside, clean away the paint inside and around the hole and just fill the area that is worn away with a good weld. There's not that much missing and this will be an easy fix. Just make sure the welding is done correctly to get correct penetration into the existing metal. Grind everything smooth, clean up the hole and you'll be ready to go with no evidence of a repair; that is as long as you touch up the nice paint you have on your frame.
#7
I've got the same situation in the right upper rear-end mount on the frame of my Chevelle.
It was raced pretty hard before I got it in 1980, and I drove it every day for 10 years.
Now it's wallowed by about 1/4", and has a very interesting "throttle steer" quality to it.
I've pretty much decided on an alignment jig of my own design for whenever I get "a round tuit," because I've got no idea exactly where the original hole was to begin with, and I don't want to permanently align it wrong.
Also, it would seem that the replacement metal can't just lay over the original, but has to sit within the hole, because the rubber bushing has a toothed central tube which is supposed to be squeezed tight between the metal mounts, and if I leave the hole big, it won't be squeezed at all.
I'd love to hear from other who have fixed similar problems, though, before I do mine (which ain't gonna be soon...).
- Eric
It was raced pretty hard before I got it in 1980, and I drove it every day for 10 years.
Now it's wallowed by about 1/4", and has a very interesting "throttle steer" quality to it.
I've pretty much decided on an alignment jig of my own design for whenever I get "a round tuit," because I've got no idea exactly where the original hole was to begin with, and I don't want to permanently align it wrong.
Also, it would seem that the replacement metal can't just lay over the original, but has to sit within the hole, because the rubber bushing has a toothed central tube which is supposed to be squeezed tight between the metal mounts, and if I leave the hole big, it won't be squeezed at all.
I'd love to hear from other who have fixed similar problems, though, before I do mine (which ain't gonna be soon...).
- Eric
#8
#9
#10
#11
#12
I know the comment may be about 9 feet off from the topic of the thread, but it seemed apropos of the general topic of wallowed suspension frame mounts.
I suppose you're going to boot me to the "Other Makes" section now, too, since the question was about one a those durn Chebbies...
- Eric
#13
I know the comment may be about 9 feet off from the topic of the thread, but it seemed apropos of the general topic of wallowed suspension frame mounts.
I suppose you're going to boot me to the "Other Makes" section now, too, since the question was about one a those durn Chebbies...
- Eric
I suppose you're going to boot me to the "Other Makes" section now, too, since the question was about one a those durn Chebbies...
- Eric
#20
#22
They did have wire feed welders back then - big industrial ones, even though the hobbyist only got them in the last 20 years. If you think about the little scrap rod from stick welding you throw out at the end multiplied by hundreds of thousands of car frames, GM probably saved a bunch of money in weld wastage alone.
My car frame had a bunch of weld wire pieces like that.
My car frame had a bunch of weld wire pieces like that.
#23
Another issue on this front lower mount... there is a 1/4" or so gap in between the bushing and mount. See below pic.
NOTE: the bolt is just snug... not torqued at all yet.
NOTE: the bolt is just snug... not torqued at all yet.
Last edited by oldzy; October 22nd, 2011 at 08:26 PM.
#29
Could you weld a washer to the inside to fill the gap. Then weld the worn part of the hole up to the washer. File the hole to clean it up. Shouldn't be any worse than trying to deform (or reform) the bracket. Just a suggestion.
#30
if it were me i would take out the A arm. i think it would be best if it were closer together to begin with. that way there won't be spring tension on it. if you torqued it to 120 (other than bolt issues) i would be worried that when you re torqued it to 80 it may not actually be tight enough for the bushing to be tight. the gap may be gone but still not tight enough to the bushing. i am far from a professional so i am sure you will have better or more advice coming soon.
#31
When you tighten those control arm bolts, you are only going to close the gap as far as the metal sleeve in the center of the bushing will allow. You don't want to have it close against the rubber or poly portion of the bushing or that would create a terrible noise every time the coltrol arm moved up and down. You may be fine where it is as long as the tabs are pulled tight against the metal sleeve in the center of the bushing. If they are in contact with each other, any attempt to close the gap more will be unnecessary.
#32
When you tighten those control arm bolts, you are only going to close the gap as far as the metal sleeve in the center of the bushing will allow. You don't want to have it close against the rubber or poly portion of the bushing or that would create a terrible noise every time the coltrol arm moved up and down. You may be fine where it is as long as the tabs are pulled tight against the metal sleeve in the center of the bushing. If they are in contact with each other, any attempt to close the gap more will be unnecessary.
#33
That is a good point. It is near impossible to tell if the inner sleeve is touching the arm or not. I will try to find out. However... the poly sides do touch the arms on all other contact points of the front LCA's.
thx.
thx.
#34
Did you ever measure the frame bracket on the other side to see if it is the same as this one. may be the cause of all your problems if it has been bent or somthing. You can take a large ajustable wrench and use it to bend the bracket back into proper shape.
#35
UPDATE: I don't know why I did not check this properly earlier... but the EXACT same gap (although a touch wider on the one in my older post above b/c the one ear is still a bit 'bent' on the inside.. as well as wallowed out hole that needs to be correkted.) exists on ALL other (three) lower front control arm bushings.
And the reason for this... the inner sleeves on the poly Energy Suspension bushings protrude. See pic below. I dug some spare bushings up, and this is the case on ALL the 'round' bushings. However, the inner sleeves on the OVAL bushings (I opted for the all round control arms, although my car came with round and ovals originally) do NOT protrude like the round ones. There must be a reason for this. Will have to contact ES and find out why.
On a related note, after torquing my rear upper Hotchkis control arms, I noticed a gap there as well. Pic below. It is their supplied poly bushing, so I assume this is normal (although it looks weird).
And the reason for this... the inner sleeves on the poly Energy Suspension bushings protrude. See pic below. I dug some spare bushings up, and this is the case on ALL the 'round' bushings. However, the inner sleeves on the OVAL bushings (I opted for the all round control arms, although my car came with round and ovals originally) do NOT protrude like the round ones. There must be a reason for this. Will have to contact ES and find out why.
On a related note, after torquing my rear upper Hotchkis control arms, I noticed a gap there as well. Pic below. It is their supplied poly bushing, so I assume this is normal (although it looks weird).
Last edited by oldzy; October 22nd, 2011 at 08:26 PM.
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