switching engines #2

[geckonz08]

New to here on the basis that I have decide to LEARN a bit (or a lot ) on OLDS and vehicles in general.
Am miles away(new zealand ) from American parts but that just makes sure you try n order the correct part.--don`t sayit!!
Anyway, I have an 86 Cad. Fleetwood with the olds 307--reliable and economical but thats it .So, I have decide to rebuild and fit a TORO engine --have imported one with a spun bearing ?? --have yet to pull it down --head and engine ID shows it as a 66 425 toro--Also brought over a th400 to replace the 200 in the caddy. And an oB4 int. man.
Enough intro --so, which if any parts eg 4bbl carb,starter,dizzy etc are going to shift over--any ? none ?(other than intake manifold ,h20 pump --not much else remains )
Also , I guess too has anyone here converted anything similar ? --thinking about how much rehashing of bodywork is likely
Am committed to spending a few bucks and have the time to undertake the project--because of that I intend to enjoy it !!!
ANY HELP APPRECIATED -cheers mike

[Olds64]

The 425 should fit right in where the 307 was. The 425 just has a taller deck height so you might have some interference issues with the valve covers hitting the power brake booster, or the air plenum. Nothing a little modification can't fix. I am not sure how easy it will be to replace the transmission with a TH 400. I don't know how different the TH 200 is from the TH 400. One thing I can tell you is that 425 would easily shatter the TH 200 that is in the car now.

Since you got an Edelbrock O4B intake you won't be able to run HEI ignition. I suggest you use the old points distributor off of the 425 and convert it with a Pertronix ignition kit. You will find that most people here will suggest building a Qjet carburetor for that engine. They are dependable and very streetable.

[geckonz08]

tx olds64 that is exactly the sort of knowledge which I require.have just done a little read up on the the pertronix in an original dizzie and that sounds just the ticket. Qjet ,yeah , I am a believer .Could I use the qjet that is currently on the 307 ??The 425 has been stripped of the carb.
tx mike

[Rallye469]

I think you'll find that the carb on your 307 will be very restrictive on your
425. You'll want to look at 750 cfm probably.

I've never run an OB4 intake but, is there no way to grind off a bit of it
to fit your HEI back on?

[Warhead]

Originally Posted by Rallye469

I think you'll find that the carb on your 307 will be very restrictive on your
425. You'll want to look at 750 cfm probably.

I've never run an OB4 intake but, is there no way to grind off a bit of it
to fit your HEI back on?

*****Please do NOT try to grind the manifold to clear the HEI. You will end up inside that runner*****
Also, you will NEED to change distributor gears to run an HEI on the 425. The 330, and 425 gear is .060 shorter, and will jam against the block, and possibly ruin the gear, cam, and block.

The q-jet is not restrictive, the secondaries open for only what the engine wants. Most q-jets (AND ALL that came on 425's) were rated at the same "750" number (actualy, I think that is more like 735 cfm). I would be more concerned with fuel metering with factory jets, and the computer shyt. You may want to look into an earlier q-jet.

It would look more like a factory install (not to mention run better, and use FAR less fuel) with the q-jet, but you may need to have the O4B opened up to match the secondary throttle plate size. Most O4B manifolds did not have the spread bore pattern cut, but they can be modified for it.

Nice engine, 39 degree lifter bank (although with .921 lifters), cool manifold (check underside for cracks, and make sure to block your heat risers when you run this one), water pumps interchange, DO NOT try the 307 starter, it will let you down. Use a 425 starter. You may need a spacer betwen the alt, and power stering brackets due to deck height of engine. Factory engine mounts for the Caddy/307 will bolt right up to the 425. Get the shortblock rebuilt, and have some fun!!!

GOOD LUCK!
Jim in Phx.

[Rallye469]

The q-jet is not restrictive, the secondaries open for only what the engine wants.

!!!
Huh, learn something new every day.

[Warhead]

BTW,(thankyou Ralley469), make sure the linkage will open the secondaries all the way. Several that I have worked on, would only open the secondary side about 10%, until the secondary linkage (located on the drivers side of engine) was tweaked.

[geckonz08]

warhead,ralleye69--yeah heaps more info here that I will store n use . Well it looks like the 307 carb(smog?) may be a poor option .And point taken on the starter. Actually ,I have someone interested in the 307 so may leave it as entire as possible . I did note in an article by Bill Crupp ?? on q-jets that almost all are interchangeable.Does this infer that a an early 4mv(or similar) off an olds,cad,chev. or buick will fit ??As long as it is around the 750 cfm it should be ok ??
Was also wondering ,as I have the original manifold ,should I not replace it with the o4b as I had intended--this should ensure that I can , if I so wish ,use HEI and should be able to direct fit a qjet carb with no adaptations ??
I am really appreciating the advice BUT so is the wife who is threatening to rip into the 425 --now I am worried ,not the least because the garage won`t be my own .
Might start her on some high torqued bolts(with a 6" spanner) to wear off the novelty.
cheers mike

[gearheads78]

Originally Posted by geckonz08

engine --have imported one with a spun bearing ?? --have yet to pull it down

I would be doing that before doing anything else. Rod bearing is no big deal but if it was a main you main have imported scap metal. I hope that is not the case.

[geckonz08]

Originally Posted by gearheads78

I would be doing that before doing anything else. Rod bearing is no big deal but if it was a main you main have imported scap metal. I hope that is not the case.

now there`s a (crucial )thought --guess I had better have a look -still only cost me $us 100 (craigslist) and $250 to ship so its not like Bin Laden has arrived .
Tx -will get onto that ASAP
MIKE

[gearheads78]

Originally Posted by geckonz08

now there`s a (crucial )thought --guess I had better have a look -still only cost me $us 100 (craigslist) and $250 to ship so its not like Bin Laden has arrived .
Tx -will get onto that ASAP
MIKE

I can't even get a motor shipped from a few states over for that money. That sounds like a heck of a deal on freight.

[geckonz08]

Originally Posted by gearheads78

I can't even get a motor shipped from a few states over for that money. That sounds like a heck of a deal on freight.

yes , it seems that inside the states is very expensive re shipping goods .
But ,I guess you don`t have to wait 6 weeks .The $250 I stated is $US and this is from wharf shipping agent in the states(kiwicobra) to trucking depot locally (nz).
Have brought in 2 cadillacs --one from florida ,the other from LA --about the same cost $2500-(one goes through the Suez and the other of course does not ---again 6 weeks
The real killer is ,like anywhere ,GOVT TAXES

mike

[geckonz08]

all seems pretty good with the engine so far(and not without some luck)I had the heads tanked and crack tested -spot on apparently.
At this point I have cleaned the block myself with little brushes ,solvents and lotsa h2o . Will get around to crack testing soon Am paying great attention to what you guys are telling me and reading heaps from mr mondello`s publication etc .
Hard from this distance as there is not even an olds engine in the vicinity I can look at --yep chev n ford n a bit o mopar--nearest I have seen is a pontiac.
Anyway, a pic attached to show where I am at --of course just a wee mock up --couldn`t resist it!!!

[gearheads78]

good to here it turned out ok