How much would you pay....

[scott_442]

.... for a 1971 442, West coast (blue plate), running/driving/road worthy, rust-free, low option (ps,pb,ac,posi,buckets/console, hubcaps), low mileage (128K), very original, big block (unsure about numbers matching), just painted (wrong color), no documentation, solid 442 needing only minor cosmetics that has been stored for the last 20 yrs? Does a low sequence number in the VIN (100123) add any value? The value guides seem to be all over the place with these cars....i get nothin' but a headache even looking at the guides....so I take my question to the Olds fan club. Don't see many of these 'survivor' cars around so it's hard to find comparable values. So, I ask the familiar question...what's it worth?

[viper771]

do you have any pictures of it? Does it run? I am curious myself about the value of it. Sounds like a deal though.. I would estimate around 10k? give or take. 442s are awesome

[68conv455]

They sprang for AC, Big Block, console, PB, PS,.... and hubcaps? I would check this carefully for originality. Assuming a 442 with no rust and new paint, I'd agree on 10K+-. A little less if the engine bay and interior need an overhaul. I'd say 7 or 8K for a clean cutlass with the same equipment.

[Olds64]

Just get a clean Cutlass and drive the bejeezus out of it. About $6000 would be a good price. You wouldn't want to do that with a 442. It might become a piece of furniture.

[2blu442]

From what I've seen numbers matching or not can make a significant difference in value so I'd verify that before talking money. Plus is it a real 442 or a clone?

Then to follow up with Olds64's comment what are your plans for it? Are you looking at it as an investment, something to restore and show, a toy to drive once in a while or a daily driver? Any one of those can be a valid use for the car, but before you invest a pile of money it would be good to consider your future plans for it.

I agree that prices can vary widly or wildly! I would suggest you don't look to the auction houses for value. Some of those cars sell for way more than they should in the real world and can lead you astray. I think the bottom line will be how much do you want to spend and how bad you want this car. John

[scott_442]

Based on the VIN and body tag, it's a real '442' despite some minor points that would suggest otherwise such as a 'Cutlass' emblem on the glove box door, steel wheels with hubcaps, etc. Regarding the engine, the pad that should have the numbers matching some part of the VIN is null/blank/empty/void....no numbers, which suggests a factory/dealer replacement?

Anyway, most of the value guides I've looked at suggest a range of 13K - 15K for a #3 car which I'm considering this car. So far, I hear from this board that 10K is about right. Hence, the point of my confusion....that's a 3- 5K difference...What could account for such a big difference? I see regular Cutlass 'S' cars with prices approaching 10K pretty frequently. Shouldn't a #3 '442' bring considerably more money?

I'm a hobbyist, not an investor looking to make a quick buck but at the same time, I want to get my money's worth. The plan is to turn the keys over to my son once he reaches driving age so that he'll have a classic to drive to HS. As with all classic cars, I'll be sinking funds into it over time but I expect to get some return on the money I put into it....I seem to have several other money losing projects and don't need another

[2blu442]

I'm skeptical of the value guides and prefer to look around at cars that have actually sold. But cars like this one don't hit the market every day so that makes it a little more sketchy. I dabble with project cars that need a lot of work and I don't have a good feel for something in this condition. When I find a rare part I look to ebay for a ballpark figure. But even there it could be two guys that have too much money and really wanted that part. So just because one sold for that last week doesn't mean mine will sell for that this week. You can look at the ads on 442.com for cars for sale, but once again that's the asking prices which may not be what they will actually sell for. I used to look through the AutoTrader online but often the prices there seemed way high compared to what I saw selling locally. The best I can suggest is look around a lot and try to find several examples of cars similar to this one to see what the price range is. John

[Lazy]

Originally Posted by scott_442

...Regarding the engine, the pad that should have the numbers matching some part of the VIN is null/blank/empty/void....no numbers, which suggests a factory/dealer replacement?

Perhaps that is a "Service Replacement" motor put there by the techs @ a dealer during the power train warranty period, but that sounds a bit like wishful thinking to me. Without some supporting evidence to show off, like something scribbled in that car's warranty book or a copy of a dealership work order listing the repair most would be real skeptical of your claim.

An even more likely scenario just might be that decking of the block was included by the rebuilder as part of his normal Engine Overhaul & Rebuild Service.

Find the block & head(s) casting date(s) since that is really all you have left to go by. Compare them to the embossed assembly date stamped in to the body tag. At least you will be able to determine which came first: the engine or the car.

It would also motivate me to seek out all the other key identifiable part #'s and the things that should be date coded too like the trans, rear axle, distributor, carb, alternator, glass panels, etc. I would want to know everything that was or was not exactly when where and what it should be.

Originally Posted by scott_442

...The plan is to turn the keys over to my son once he reaches driving age so that he'll have a classic to drive to H.S. ...I seem to have several other money losing projects and don't need another

From over here it sounds a lot like you do not already have enough money losing projects yet and are looking forward to creating yourself another, even bigger one. Turning the keys for that investment quality 442 Olds over to a high schooler could turn into your very own personal pot-hole in the road where bushels of your money could easily get sucked down into the depths of. ANY high performance car, especially a Classic American Muscle Car that can still perform anywhere close to, or even better than, the level it originally could is far more car than is needed to commute a student to school, Libraries, dates, or anywhere else he/she would need or want to get to.

Never mind loosing the money that you pour into the car, imagine loosing the money spent on any property damages and/or personal injurys, court fines, lawyers, doctors, hospitals, bail, towing, impound fees, etc.

Will you want to insure that car for full market replacement value, or have a company that specializes in collector cars (Grundy,Heacock, Haggerty, etc.) underwrite you an "agreed value" policy? Younger or even multiple drivers, if they are even within the realms of possibility with some underwriters, can typically double or triple the amount of the policy's premiums.

I recommend getting the kid a decommissioned patrol car from your nearest sheriff's department auction. Let him get acclimated to controlling a performance car in something with a maintenance history, is relatively inexpensive so as to be disposable once it becomes severely wrinkled.

[The_Jeremiah]

How does $20 bucks sound, its all I got. Lol jk

[BigMike70]

Originally Posted by Lazy

From over here it sounds a lot like you do not already have enough money losing projects yet and are looking forward to creating yourself another, even bigger one. Turning the keys for that investment quality 442 Olds over to a high schooler could turn into your very own personal pot-hole in the road where bushels of your money could easily get sucked down into the depths of. ANY high performance car, especially a Classic American Muscle Car that can still perform anywhere close to, or even better than, the level it originally could is far more car than is needed to commute a student to school, Libraries, dates, or anywhere else he/she would need or want to get to.

Never mind loosing the money that you pour into the car, imagine loosing the money spent on any property damages and/or personal injurys, court fines, lawyers, doctors, hospitals, bail, towing, impound fees, etc.

Younger or even multiple drivers, if they are even within the realms of possibility with some underwriters, can typically double or triple the amount of the policy's premiums.

I recommend getting the kid a decommissioned patrol car from your nearest sheriff's department auction. Let him get acclimated to controlling a performance car in something with a maintenance history, is relatively inexpensive so as to be disposable once it becomes severely wrinkled.

I don't intend on being mean but honestly how old are you? How long has it been since you've been in high school? My car turns heads no matter where I'm going but it really gets attention when I'm pulling into my high school parking lot. At 17, my car is one of the most important things in my life and I gotta tell you, driving a car that most grown men dream about is a hell of a feeling. A bad day is one smokey burnout away from being turned around into a great day. I drive my 1970 442 everyday despite the terrible gas mileage. However, I was never handed keys. I had to work my butt off to get where I'm at. At the same time your statement, although extreme, does hold some truth. I beat the hell out of my first car a 1965 Chevy Impala SS. Granted I picked it up for only four grand, it was just a small block 327 and I still found ways to get into trouble with it. Now, my 455 packs a whole lot of power, but with that comes a whole lot of respect and responsibility too. You're absolutely right, a muscle car for at my age isn't necessary, but it's awesome!

[Ranzan]

My first legal car to drive when I was 16 was my 66....... 16 or 60 doesn`t mean anything as long as responsibility is there. but that`s just my 2 cent`s I started teaching my son to drive when he was 10 so by this time next year when he does have his license he will know what to do behind the wheel just like my dad taught me. And if we get it done in time he will be driving a 67 to school

[viper771]

well, you guy are LUCKY! I didn't drive until I was 18, and my first car was a 1990 ford aerostar VAN that was handed down to me. Talk about un cool!!!!

[The_Jeremiah]

Originally Posted by BigMike70

I don't intend on being mean but honestly how old are you? How long has it been since you've been in high school? My car turns heads no matter where I'm going but it really gets attention when I'm pulling into my high school parking lot. At 17, my car is one of the most important things in my life and I gotta tell you, driving a car that most grown men dream about is a hell of a feeling. A bad day is one smokey burnout away from being turned around into a great day. I drive my 1970 442 everyday despite the terrible gas mileage. However, I was never handed keys. I had to work my butt off to get where I'm at. At the same time your statement, although extreme, does hold some truth. I beat the hell out of my first car a 1965 Chevy Impala SS. Granted I picked it up for only four grand, it was just a small block 327 and I still found ways to get into trouble with it. Now, my 455 packs a whole lot of power, but with that comes a whole lot of respect and responsibility too. You're absolutely right, a muscle car for at my age isn't necessary, but it's awesome!

I agree totally. Being 17 myself you couldnt be farther from the truth. Lol my first car was a 78 lincoln continental. It had a 460, and i would drive it all week at 10 bucks a day, and fix it all weekend lol. once i get my cutlass done, it will definently turn heads, which im very excited for, because where i live i have the only 69 cutlass that i know of. there is a 71 4-door here, a 72 4-door in the junk yard, and there is like a 67 2 door rolling around town i think. so everyone will know who it belongs to. the only punishment it will ever go through is at the dragstrip.