Front crankshaft seal

Steeb · March 8th, 2009, 04:16 PM

How do I remove the front seal that goes on the timing cover just behind the harmonic balancer? I removed the harmonic balancer, and found that the seal is probably the source of my horrible oil leak. I don't want to remove the timing cover if I don't have to.

The shop manual refers to some tool, but I doubt I'd be able to find it by the part # in the manual. Is there a modern equivalant that I might find at the local Autozone? Or better yet, any homebrewed methods? I don't care if I destroy it in the process, but would like to keep from having peices fall into the motor.

Also, once I get that seal out, does anyone know where I can find a replacement?

It's a 56 Olds 324.

Thanks!

Yellowstatue · March 10th, 2009, 03:51 AM

I would get the new seal first so you know what the shape is inside , then play with getting it out, possibly with a thin screw driver or similar object to collapse it...there will be a thin spring on the inside circumference of the lip of the seal...good luck..

Steeb · March 11th, 2009, 07:15 PM

Any tips on getting this front oil seal off???
I tried hammering a thin flat head screwdriver in on one side, to try and pop it out a little, but all it did was poke right through the metal. So I tried prying it out, and it just ripped the metal more. So I grabbed the torn chunk with some pliers and pulled and now it's a giant mess, and the thing is not even budging.

88 coupe · March 11th, 2009, 08:48 PM

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=91352
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=35556

Norm

64Rocket · March 11th, 2009, 10:00 PM

You have to pull the front cover off. For that is a rope type seal and uses a retainer on the inside.

Gene

Steeb · March 12th, 2009, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 64Rocket

You have to pull the front cover off. For that is a rope type seal and uses a retainer on the inside.

Gene

Are you sure? Not according to the manual.

64Rocket · March 12th, 2009, 10:08 AM

Well, it looks like it to me. If not that seal is stuck in there real good. You may have to just keep working it out. It has been 20 some odd years since I have worked on the style engine and I just don't remeber for sure. The part in the pic looks like you broke the housing. Is that just a piece of tin from the seal. If so, just keep at it and it should come out.
Maybe the ever knowing "Norm" resident 371/394 expert can chime in and give us the low down.

jensenracing77 · March 12th, 2009, 03:02 PM

what i have done many times on all types of seals is to , first be very careful and drill a small hole in 3 or 4 spots then screw a sheet metal screw in it and then pull it out with pliers. just don't go to deep or you will regret i give you this advice.

Steeb · March 12th, 2009, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=91352
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=35556

Norm

I picked both of those up from Harbor Frieght today on my way home from work, so we'll see how that goes...

Steeb · March 12th, 2009, 06:56 PM

Got it.

Yellowstatue · March 13th, 2009, 03:34 AM

Nice job!! Which tool did you use to pull it out...

Steeb · March 13th, 2009, 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yellowstatue

Nice job!! Which tool did you use to pull it out...

This seal puller that 88 Coupe recommended...

It broke in the process, but hey it's Harbor Freight. You get what you pay for!

citcapp · March 13th, 2009, 08:19 AM

glad to see your got the seal out, The right tool always helps

Steeb · March 13th, 2009, 10:43 AM

When I put the new seal in, should I use any kind of silicone or anything? The manual says to apply something, but I'm not sure what it's talking about.

Thanks!

citcapp · March 13th, 2009, 12:07 PM

Lube the seal with oil before install. You don't need any sealer around the metal part of the seal it is a press fit

Steeb · March 13th, 2009, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by citcapp

Lube the seal with oil before install. You don't need any sealer around the metal part of the seal it is a press fit

Thanks! Now how about the balancer itself? Do I need to use anything when installing that?

Steeb · March 13th, 2009, 04:59 PM

So the new seal arrived.

But it doesn't actually seal around the crankshaft. It fits into the hole on the timing cover nicely, but there is about an eight to a quarter inch gap all the way around between the crankshaft and the rubber seal.

I haven't actually pressed it in yet. It looks like it is definitely the right part.

I understand that there is a thin metal sleeve that is sometimes used over the end of the crankshaft if a slight groove is worn from the old seal, but in this case the whole crankshaft end is about a half inch smaller diameter than the seal.

There is a spring inside the seal, so I'm wondering if it somehow decompresses when it's pressed into the timing cover??? I doubt it.

I don't know what to do now.

And also, there is a raised lip that runs the length of the end of the crankshaft, which is to key the balancer I guess. How is the seal affected by that?

jensenracing77 · March 13th, 2009, 05:13 PM

look at the back side of your balancer. the seal should seal to the collar made on the back of it. the key way will be covered by the balancer. it's not a bad idea to but just a dab of RTV silicone on the key to prevent oil from leaking there.

mugzilla · March 13th, 2009, 05:20 PM

nice pics ...

Steeb · March 13th, 2009, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jensenracing77

look at the back side of your balancer. the seal should seal to the collar made on the back of it. the key way will be covered by the balancer. it's not a bad idea to but just a dab of RTV silicone on the key to prevent oil from leaking there.

Ahhh... Thanks! That makes perfect sense. I don't have the balancer back from the rebuilder yet, so I was just looking at the seal and the bare crankshaft.

Phew, I feel so much better now!

March 8th, 2009, 04:16 PM	#1 (permalink)
Steeb Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Delaware Posts: 52	Front crankshaft seal How do I remove the front seal that goes on the timing cover just behind the harmonic balancer? I removed the harmonic balancer, and found that the seal is probably the source of my horrible oil leak. I don't want to remove the timing cover if I don't have to. The shop manual refers to some tool, but I doubt I'd be able to find it by the part # in the manual. Is there a modern equivalant that I might find at the local Autozone? Or better yet, any homebrewed methods? I don't care if I destroy it in the process, but would like to keep from having peices fall into the motor. Also, once I get that seal out, does anyone know where I can find a replacement? It's a 56 Olds 324. Thanks! __________________ 56 Olds Ninety Eight, 324 cid, 4 bbl

March 10th, 2009, 03:51 AM	#2 (permalink)
Yellowstatue Certified Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Too close to Toronto!! Posts: 567	Seal I would get the new seal first so you know what the shape is inside , then play with getting it out, possibly with a thin screw driver or similar object to collapse it...there will be a thin spring on the inside circumference of the lip of the seal...good luck.. __________________ '57 S88 HC et al; '68 442 M20; '68 442 M21; '68 W30; '68 Vista et al; '80 -'84 Regency et al; '96,'98.'99 Aurora..Ignition ON

March 11th, 2009, 07:15 PM	#3 (permalink)
Steeb Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Delaware Posts: 52	Any tips on getting this front oil seal off??? I tried hammering a thin flat head screwdriver in on one side, to try and pop it out a little, but all it did was poke right through the metal. So I tried prying it out, and it just ripped the metal more. So I grabbed the torn chunk with some pliers and pulled and now it's a giant mess, and the thing is not even budging. __________________ 56 Olds Ninety Eight, 324 cid, 4 bbl

March 11th, 2009, 10:00 PM	#5 (permalink)
64Rocket Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Union City Calif.94587 Posts: 301	You have to pull the front cover off. For that is a rope type seal and uses a retainer on the inside. Gene __________________

March 12th, 2009, 10:08 AM	#7 (permalink)
64Rocket Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Union City Calif.94587 Posts: 301	Well, it looks like it to me. If not that seal is stuck in there real good. You may have to just keep working it out. It has been 20 some odd years since I have worked on the style engine and I just don't remeber for sure. The part in the pic looks like you broke the housing. Is that just a piece of tin from the seal. If so, just keep at it and it should come out. Maybe the ever knowing "Norm" resident 371/394 expert can chime in and give us the low down. __________________

March 12th, 2009, 03:02 PM	#8 (permalink)
jensenracing77 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: brazil indiana Posts: 1,022	what i have done many times on all types of seals is to , first be very careful and drill a small hole in 3 or 4 spots then screw a sheet metal screw in it and then pull it out with pliers. just don't go to deep or you will regret i give you this advice. __________________ 70 Rallye 350 72 Cutlass 00 Silhouette 90 Toronado Trofeo

March 12th, 2009, 06:56 PM	#10 (permalink)
Steeb Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Delaware Posts: 52	Got it. __________________ 56 Olds Ninety Eight, 324 cid, 4 bbl

March 13th, 2009, 03:34 AM	#11 (permalink)
Yellowstatue Certified Fanatic Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Too close to Toronto!! Posts: 567	Seal Nice job!! Which tool did you use to pull it out... __________________ '57 S88 HC et al; '68 442 M20; '68 442 M21; '68 W30; '68 Vista et al; '80 -'84 Regency et al; '96,'98.'99 Aurora..Ignition ON

March 13th, 2009, 08:19 AM	#13 (permalink)
citcapp Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,445	glad to see your got the seal out, The right tool always helps __________________ Pat 1957 Super 88 with a 455 1948 2dr series 76 with a 455

March 13th, 2009, 10:43 AM	#14 (permalink)
Steeb Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Delaware Posts: 52	When I put the new seal in, should I use any kind of silicone or anything? The manual says to apply something, but I'm not sure what it's talking about. Thanks! __________________ 56 Olds Ninety Eight, 324 cid, 4 bbl

March 13th, 2009, 12:07 PM	#15 (permalink)
citcapp Super Moderator Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,445	Lube the seal with oil before install. You don't need any sealer around the metal part of the seal it is a press fit __________________ Pat 1957 Super 88 with a 455 1948 2dr series 76 with a 455

March 13th, 2009, 04:59 PM	#17 (permalink)
Steeb Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Delaware Posts: 52	So the new seal arrived. But it doesn't actually seal around the crankshaft. It fits into the hole on the timing cover nicely, but there is about an eight to a quarter inch gap all the way around between the crankshaft and the rubber seal. I haven't actually pressed it in yet. It looks like it is definitely the right part. I understand that there is a thin metal sleeve that is sometimes used over the end of the crankshaft if a slight groove is worn from the old seal, but in this case the whole crankshaft end is about a half inch smaller diameter than the seal. There is a spring inside the seal, so I'm wondering if it somehow decompresses when it's pressed into the timing cover??? I doubt it. I don't know what to do now. And also, there is a raised lip that runs the length of the end of the crankshaft, which is to key the balancer I guess. How is the seal affected by that? __________________ 56 Olds Ninety Eight, 324 cid, 4 bbl

March 13th, 2009, 05:13 PM	#18 (permalink)
jensenracing77 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: brazil indiana Posts: 1,022	look at the back side of your balancer. the seal should seal to the collar made on the back of it. the key way will be covered by the balancer. it's not a bad idea to but just a dab of RTV silicone on the key to prevent oil from leaking there. __________________ 70 Rallye 350 72 Cutlass 00 Silhouette 90 Toronado Trofeo

March 13th, 2009, 05:20 PM	#19 (permalink)
mugzilla is Fast Enough ... Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: dogtown Posts: 848	nice pics ... Last edited by mugzilla; March 16th, 2009 at 03:36 PM..

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Jetaway front seal	68ragtop	Cutlass	3	December 1st, 2008 07:00 AM
removing and installing harmonic balancer/front oil seal	smcurro	Big Blocks	19	September 17th, 2008 04:28 PM
th 400 front seal leak	dynamic88	Transmission	6	August 30th, 2007 12:43 PM
Easy ? RE: Front Seal	kcompton	Big Blocks	3	November 16th, 2006 05:42 AM
59 Hydromatic Front Pump Seal	Wes	Transmission	6	August 21st, 2006 02:26 PM