Horn button..what's missing ?

[JPDPG]

Hello..our 1967 442 appears to have had it's steering wheel removed and was replaced without it's proper parts..the wheel is orignal (I think) 16" plastic wood looking,Olds emblem horn button, 3 brushed metal spokes. Trying to get the turn signals to cancel and the horn to work. Would anyone know where I might find a diagram to check out ? I have a service manual but it's not clear to us. Thanks for your help !

[2blu442]

I've seen that style wheel on a 1968 but not a 1967, Buick used the three spoke sport wheel a lot as did other GM products. The horn assembly would be the same as the 1970-77 4 spoke wheel. There's a couple places the contact may be missing. Does the horn button depress on the sides and pop back up when you release it? If you haven't purchased a Chassis Service Manual for your car put that on the list of things to get, they're the best repair manuals out there in my opinion. If someone else doesn't come up with what you need sooner I have a parts car with a sport wheel on it, I could take it apart and photograph each step but it may be next weekend before I have time for that. John

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by JPDPG

Hello..our 1967 442 appears to have had it's steering wheel removed and was replaced without it's proper parts..the wheel is orignal (I think) 16" plastic wood looking,Olds emblem horn button, 3 brushed metal spokes. Trying to get the turn signals to cancel and the horn to work. Would anyone know where I might find a diagram to check out ? I have a service manual but it's not clear to us. Thanks for your help !

If the turn signals don't cancel, then you're likely missing the cancelling cam. This is the round plastic part that goes under the hub of the steering wheel. There is a horn contact slip ring on the bottom and a tubular post that sticks up through the hub of the steering wheel. There is a spring and eyelet that fits in this post and makes contact with the ring that holds the horn cap.

[kevinkpk]

I replaced the plastic cam on my 70, that was available from autozone, in a "generic GM" prepackaged. I think the steering wheel puller, and the cam together were around $10.

[JPDPG]

Thanks...The cam is not there as well as any horn contact. The ring that holds the horn button is there ,so I'll look for a cam and contact and pull the wheel to see what if any more is missing.. Thanks very much

[markowyo]

I just went through this last weekend, with my '64 Cutlass' original steering wheel. It is best, and pretty easy, to isolate the problem before trying to fix what you think might be wrong/missing.

1st, test the horns. They are grounded, so just jumper a hot lead from the battery to the horns, at the horn and make sure they work. If not, could be the ground or the horn.

2nd, test the horn relay. This is on my firewall, probably is for yours too. An electrical schematic is desireable here ... but the relay takes the low current circuit that goes through your steering wheel and horn buttons and converts it to a higher current feed to your horns. The coil relay is always hot, and the (on mine) green wire hot going in to the relay gets grounded (mine is black, so green/hot into the relay, black/ground out)) by the horn button which then pulls the horn relay coil down which closes the contact on the always-hot line and thus beeps your horn. You can remove the whole relay and test it off the car, or you can remove the harness connector and jumper on to your relay hot (mine is green) and you should hear the relay go "click". If it is clicking fine, then the problem is probably at the steering wheel.

3rd, the steering wheel button grounds the (mine is green to black) circuit through the relay. You can take off your steering wheel and ground the brass spring loaded contact and your horn should beep (if the above 2 things are working). If they do, than the contacts inside your steering wheel are probably dirty or broken. The contacts are spring loaded and need to press in nicely, onto clean contacts.

Turns out my horns worked (1), I had to clean my realy contacts (2), and my steering wheel contacts and spring were kinda weak and dirty (3). Once I got the horn relay working and the contacts clean, she sings like an opera star.

Hope this helps.

[JPDPG]

Again thanks, I first tested the horns and relay and found the horns were shot and the relay working, thats what brought me to the steering wheel to find the missing cam and any contact between the button and what ever it makes contact with, I have new horns when I get the contact thing sorted out. Thanks, I'll pull the wheel this weekend.

[markowyo]

My contact "assembly" was pretty shot. It has a little plastic piece which holds a spring in place which pushes the contact down, and all this fits through a hole in the center of the steering wheel. I added another spring and held the little plastic thingy secure with some electrical shrink wrap. I think my mod is better than the original.

If you have nothing in there but the horn contact, you can probably fashion something from a Bic pen or plastic tubing from the hardware store (plastic thingy) and a spring with some shrink wrap.

If you can't find a picture, I have a blow up from a late 60s shop manual which should help you visualize it, & which could probably be faxed or scanned/emailed.

Good luck.

[kevinkpk]

Originally Posted by JPDPG

Thanks...The cam is not there as well as any horn contact. The ring that holds the horn button is there ,so I'll look for a cam and contact and pull the wheel to see what if any more is missing.. Thanks very much

The plastic cam is an odd looking shape that turns off the turn signal(s), has nothing to do with the horn, sorry for the confusion. Horn has as was stated a "pin" with a spring that rides on a fixture under the wheel, and the contact is a round copper plate, the pin rotates with the wheel within the fixture.

[markowyo]

If you have only the wires, no contact, I have a brass contact from a mid 60s wheel that you could have. You would have to fashion the assembly, including crimping or soldering the contact on, adding a spring, and fashioning a plastic holder (e.g. electrical shrink wrap). Once you have the blow up in hand, please contact me it you need more assistance.

V/R
Mark

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by kevinkpk

The plastic cam is an odd looking shape that turns off the turn signal(s), has nothing to do with the horn, sorry for the confusion.

I disagree. The attached picture shows a part called a "turn signal cam". The bumps on the part are the cam lobes that cancel the turn signal, just like the cam lobes on a camshaft actuate the valves in the engine. The part that this cam activates is part of the turn signal switch. The circular metal contact ring is the horn contact slip ring. The post on the right side of the photo is what fits through the steering wheel hub. The spring and eyelet fit into this post and are retained with a plastic quarter-turn ring. The horn button retainer ring has a tab that touches the eyelet to complete the circuit.

[kevinkpk]

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

I disagree. The attached picture shows a part called a "turn signal cam". The bumps on the part are the cam lobes that cancel the turn signal, just like the cam lobes on a camshaft actuate the valves in the engine. The part that this cam activates is part of the turn signal switch. The circular metal contact ring is the horn contact slip ring. The post on the right side of the photo is what fits through the steering wheel hub. The spring and eyelet fit into this post and are retained with a plastic quarter-turn ring. The horn button retainer ring has a tab that touches the eyelet to complete the circuit.

The part I replaced is plastic that engages when the turn lever is moved up or down, it is called a turn signal switch, that was what was wrong with my turn signal (rh) not clicking off after the turn. If the horn contactor is missing, and Joe is correct about the cam lobes on that device, then you have more of an issue with turn signals.

[88 coupe]

Joe is correct.

P/N PF8231B is available at http://www.opgi.com for under $30.

Norm

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by 88 coupe

Joe is correct.

P/N PF8231B is available at http://www.opgi.com for under $30.

Norm

Yup. Or $3.09 from Partsamerica.com:

http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductD...rtNumber=83232

By the way, am I the only one worried that OPGI uses the same part number (PF8231B) for these two different canceling cams:

[88 coupe]

Originally Posted by joe_padavano

Or $3.09 from Partsamerica.com ........

Looks like a different part.

........ By the way, am I the only one worried ........

Looks like a typo.



PF8231B is on the left. Looks just like the one in my Chev II.

PF8231A is on the right. Looks just like the one in my Cutlass.

Norm

[2blu442]

Hello,
I don't know if you got your horn problems straightened out yet, but I did dismantle part of a 1972 steering column with the 4 spoke sport wheel today. I took a photograph of each step and with some I took more than one photo to try and make it more clear. I don't know if your 1967 column will be significantly different, but I thought this would be worth a try. I did upload them backwards... so you'll have to choose the view all option and start at the bottom! Let me know if you have any questions, or if something isn't clear in the photos. John

http://s90.photobucket.com/albums/k2...el%20Assembly/

[JPDPG]

Thanks for all your help..seems the cancel cam and contact that runs through cam were missing, replaced horns, cam and contact ,now I'm honking at anything that moves !!Again, Thanks