71 Olds Cutlass Rebuild Questions

[rboehm]

I am a new member of this forum, but I have participated in a number of these before. I look forward to your help and helping others.

I am rebuilding a 1971 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible and I have a couple of questions and requests for help.

We pulled the 350, tore the block down to metal, had it machined, and rebuilt it. We added a Flowmaster exhaust, Hooker headers, MSD ignition, MSD distributor, MSD coil, and an Edlebrock 4 barrel carb. We also replaced all of the other components needing replaced. We also had the transmission rebuilt. So the drivetrain is complete.

We are now working on the interior and the convertible parts. Everything works, but we need to recover the top - which we will get to eventually. I have two basic questions.

1. The top rail above the windshield is rusted in many places. In fact, the previous owner smeared some type of plastic goo over it to seal it as best as possible. However, when you peal it back, there is a very rusted metal plate behind it. Do you have any suggestions about to get this part replaced? It is beyond my capabilities, but what should I ask to have done?

2. The bumpers are basically in really good shape, but the chrome is flaking. Should I have them rechromed or should I just purchase new ones?

Thanks, and I look forward to your help.

RJB

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by rboehm

1. The top rail above the windshield is rusted in many places. In fact, the previous owner smeared some type of plastic goo over it to seal it as best as possible. However, when you peal it back, there is a very rusted metal plate behind it. Do you have any suggestions about to get this part replaced? It is beyond my capabilities, but what should I ask to have done?

The part you need is called a header bow. All 68-72 GM A-body convertibles use the same header bow, and reproductions are readily available. Look for a 68-72 Chevelle header bow, it's the same part on your Olds.

[perro]

i have a convertible and i have found that one of the cheapest resellers of the convertible parts is thepartsplaceinc.com
they have the repop header bows new, and also carry the other stuff like the latches, knuckles, pins, etc etc.

if youre going to send it out to have the work done, you can probably get away with replacing the header bow yourself. Its only held on by a couple bolts.

youd have to peel back the top where its glued and stapled to the bow, and then unbolt the latches and replace the header bow with the new repop one. Then you could have the new top put on by an upholstery shop. Probably save you a bit of cash by swapping the bow yourself.

the fisher body manual for 1968 has convertible top instructions in it


and as far as the bumpers, you will pay less money having yours rechromed as long as a ton of work is not needed to bring them back to straight.

[rboehm]

Joe,

Thanks for the information. I thought the header bow was actually the part that was part of the convertible frame that came down on the windshield frame and then latched in. In otherwords, it was the part of the frame that the vinal top connected to and then latched into the frame. If I am looking at the right part, it is my windshield frame that is rusted. If the header bow is the top most part of the windshield frame, then how to I remove it? I don't see any obvious way to remove it, but maybe it is hidden under the goo.

perro,

Thanks for the parts tip and for the instructions on the header bow. As you can see, I am still somewhat confused about which part this is. Also, thanks for the advice on the bumpers.

Rodney

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by rboehm

Joe,

Thanks for the information. I thought the header bow was actually the part that was part of the convertible frame that came down on the windshield frame and then latched in. In otherwords, it was the part of the frame that the vinal top connected to and then latched into the frame. If I am looking at the right part, it is my windshield frame that is rusted. If the header bow is the top most part of the windshield frame, then how to I remove it? I don't see any obvious way to remove it, but maybe it is hidden under the goo.

You are correct. I was assuming you were talking about the header bow on the top mechanism because that is the part that usually rusts out. If it's really with windshield frame, your only option is to remove the glass and weld in sheetmetal. There may be a bolt-on cap that is chrome plated. Be sure it's not a bolt-on part that's rusted (which would be easy to replace).

[perro]

any chance you could snap a picture?

the very very top of the windshield frame on my 68 has vinyl inserts - is it possible thats what the goop was for?? Does the top of your windshield frame have these?

im unfamiliar with 71s, but i would think they would be the same as 68 since 68-72 a body shared alot of the same parts

[rboehm]

I am sorry it has been so long since my last post, but I have been traveling and not able to access my car. I have attached pictures of the top of the windshield frame to explain my problem. Again, it might be beyond my capabilities, but I wanted to see if anyone had any suggestions. Thanks for the suggestions thus far.

Rodney

[perro]

dont quote me on this, but i THINK this is half of what you need



http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cheve...spagenameZWDVW

[texasred]

Sorry perro, those are the post side covers.

I have a friend in Austin, TX that replaced a large chunk of his convertible's windshield frame. His name is Ben Napier (bnapier1@harrell.com). Send him the pics. He may have suggetions for you.

C.J.

[joe_padavano]

Originally Posted by rboehm

I am sorry it has been so long since my last post, but I have been traveling and not able to access my car. I have attached pictures of the top of the windshield frame to explain my problem. Again, it might be beyond my capabilities, but I wanted to see if anyone had any suggestions. Thanks for the suggestions thus far.

Rodney

OUCH!. Unfortunately, there's no easy fix, just brute force welding of new metal.

[perro]

Originally Posted by texasred

Sorry perro, those are the post side covers.

I have a friend in Austin, TX that replaced a large chunk of his convertible's windshield frame. His name is Ben Napier (bnapier1@harrell.com). Send him the pics. He may have suggetions for you.

C.J.

i have to disagree with you C.J., and im not trying to be rude, but those are not the pillar covers

it looks like you have a 71 CS convertible with the Uber rare super karate monkey death car option. I know its a pain, but go pop your top and look at yours a bit closer. Im fairly certain that these are 1/2 of what he needs to fix his problem.

look a bit closer at the auction picture - you will see the holes in them for the convertible frame pins that screw into the header bow to enter.


those are split in the middle and joined by your rear view mirror bracket - you can see the indentions in the middle where the rear view mirror bracket sits

these are side pillar covers
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Pilla...spagenameZWDVW


im pretty certain those are the parts that sit in the top rail track - look at my photos of my convertible top again, you can see it a bit better

i do not believe that he has to weld anything. I believe if he finds both sets of the top rail trim, and has them recovered with vinyl, then it will fix his immediate problem. Of course, what lays beneath that trim that is actually part of the window frame is a whole different story


Mike

[perro]

check this picture out, should make sense after this - click this thumbnail to enlarge it

and my original disclaimer of i THINK it will fix it still applies.
im not sure if they changed that between 68 and 71
that looks like a dead ringer for my 68 and if my 68 had rust in that same spot, these would be the 2 pieces i bought to fix it.

i dont see pin holes in his top - and i also dont see the brushed chrome pin receptacles like that are on my car, so i cant say for sure these parts will fit a 71
i KNOW they fit a 68, and assumed 71 would be the same

[perro]

after looking closer at mine, i stand corrected i think. I know they are not pillar covers, but i believe those 2 are the parts that are inside of your car at the top of the frame. the part your visors mount to.

the holes in those are not for the convertible pins, those holes i believe are for the visor brackets. i still think this is half of your equation to what you need.

welding could be required - i havent disassembled mine to see whats under there, but it sure looks like an insert covered in vinyl that sits in the top of the window frame. The 2 pieces linked in the auction would screw to the section you are showing thats bad

[texasred]

Perro,

I stand corrected.

I took a closer look at the pics and they are the indeed the covers for the inside of the header, as you describe. My car and my parts book are at storage and I'm too tired to chase it down tonight to get the "real" name for it.

Sincere apologies for any confusion I may have caused.

C.J.

[mp71conv]

I don't have any info for your top problem, but I do have a question....
How did the engine fit with the headers. I too have a 71 conv and
am interested in headers, but always read that they do not fit
cutlass supreme or conv.

[rboehm]

Wow, thanks for all of the posts and suggestions. Perro, it does look like those are the parts I might need and will peel back all of the goo to make sure.

mp71conv, I have a 350 and the headers were installed by the PO. When we pulled the engine to rebuild it, I just put the old headers back on because they were still in good shape. I can take pictures if you want. It will take me a couple of days since I am traveling again.

[perro]

Originally Posted by texasred

Perro,

Sincere apologies for any confusion I may have caused.

C.J.

No appologies necessary my brother, just looking to help the gent out

ive never had mine apart so im not 100% sure how it all goes together, but by looking at it with the top down, it sure looks like an insert that is covered in vinyl to me and it looks like it pops out.

ill be interested to see scans of your parts book when you run across it

Mike

[texasred]

mp71,

Not to jack the thread, but this is an old, old myth. A Cutlass is a Cutlass is a Cutlass. Just order headers for a Cutlass S and they will fit.

Debating the true usefulnes of headers is certainly another matter and subject for another thread.

C.J.

[yogi442]

Originally Posted by texasred

mp71,

Not to jack the thread, but this is an old, old myth. A Cutlass is a Cutlass is a Cutlass. Just order headers for a Cutlass S and they will fit.

Debating the true usefulnes of headers is certainly another matter and subject for another thread.

C.J.

I'm with CJ on this. This is getting old and you would think by now that everyone would have caught on regarding the old myth surrounding Cutlass' and headers. It most likely started when someone had to tweak a set to get it to fit and therefore assumed Cutlass' cannot accept them. Far from the truth. I have several cars and have had Cutlass' for years and never had problems with headers. Granted as CJ points out, the debate of whether they help or not is another discussion.

[perro]

i bought my 68 with a set of hedman headers on it
the only thing that no longer fits is a factory starter.
im dreading the day when this starter goes out cause ill have to drop the headers to get it out. the super genius who put the headers on must not have checked to see if the starter could be removed before he put the headers on

but anyways, the headers fit my car just fine, and with the aluminized pipe setup with X pipe and the flowmasters sounds REALLY nice - thats one thing the previous owner did do to my car that wasnt a total hack job

[Maverick]

Originally Posted by perro

i bought my 68 with a set of hedman headers on it
the only thing that no longer fits is a factory starter.
im dreading the day when this starter goes out cause ill have to drop the headers to get it out. the super genius who put the headers on must not have checked to see if the starter could be removed before he put the headers on

but anyways, the headers fit my car just fine, and with the aluminized pipe setup with X pipe and the flowmasters sounds REALLY nice - thats one thing the previous owner did do to my car that wasnt a total hack job

I couldn't get the starter out of my '72 either . They just need to be loosened, not removed. THats what I found, but still a pain.

[wdwnut]

I just bought a '71 Cutlass Supreme convertible. The frame of my car had the same type of rust damage, but it wasn't that far gone. A little body filler was enough to take care of it. Is there supposed to be anything on top of that metal, like a vinyl strip? After I repaired mine, I painted it the color of the car because it looks like that was what it was before. I had a '70 drop top years ago but I can't remember. What really knocks my socks off is the price of the header bow! Mine needs replacing, but I can't find one under $300!