I wanted to get some opinions on a complete frame off. Any suggestions? items to watch out for? Do’s or Don’ts? I have a 1969 Cutlass S that isn’t too bad of shape. I have had it for about 7 yrs now with no plans of selling it. The olds had started its life with the original 350 but I have replaced it with a 455. That need to go fast is still there. I have also redone the complete suspension breaks springs, ball joints, tie rod ends etc. The car is at the point where I need to really get into it by replacing one floor pan, some metal work around the back window and rear quarters. On top of that the wiring is getting brittle so a new wiring kit as well. So what are the biggest pains or challenges? I have seen some Major build posts. I especially liked the car dolly’s to move the body around.

 

Well, having basically done 2 '68s in the span of 6 months (one that was completely rotted and was not worth restoring), I might be able to help you a bit.

If you have never taken apart an entire car, and I'm sure you've read this before, but try to be as organized as humanly possible and take pictures of things that might be difficult to put back together. A digital camera can be your best friend because the assembly manuals aren't always that great. And if you think you'll remember how it went, chances are you won't. I sure couldn't.

Additionally, I would suggest getting a bunch of boxes. When you take nuts/bolts/screws off of a particular part, put it in a ziplock bag and label it well. If the part can fit it in a box, put the fasterners in their respective bags in with it. If parts can't fit in a box, create a box for a specific part of the car (underhood, interior, etc). Trust me. It will make a ton of difference when you go to reassemble the car.

Once disassembly is completed, I would personally highly suggest having the car and frame media blasted. While it is not cheap, the amount of money I spent on one of my cars on chemicals, stripping pads, etc, wasn't all that cheap either. Factor in the massive mess and/or time it takes, and I am now of the addage, do it once, do it right. This will rid you of your rust and let you REALLY know what needs to be done metal-wise. The strip shop I went to was able to separate the body from the frame, and then loosely reapplied it to the frame for its return trip home.

Once blasted, I've seen two major rust issues on these cars (even from the Southwest or West Coast): 1) the area below the windshield on the cowl/dash is almost invariable rusted on some level and requires work, and 2) often, the rear window has trapped in moisture and caused the channel and the surrounding area to rust.

It sounds like your suspension and tie-rods, etc, are all in good shape, so remove what you can prior to blasting so it doesn't get damaged. If you're doing a "frame-off", this will need to be taken apart anyway to paint the a-arms and frame properly, so it just a necessary evil, even though you've already done the work.

You didn't state it, but I assume the engine and transmission are fine? I personally would have the transmission, drive shaft and rear end gone over, at the least. I thought mine were fine, and I actually needed all rebuilt. While my car didn't have many miles, it was driven hard. Additionally, if you're making your engine compartment look new, you'll need to at least clean up and paint the engine (unless you've already done so).

In terms of parts, I predominately used Fusick and The Parts Place. A few things weren't exactly as I needed, but I was able to return them without issue.

As far as interior goes, if you need it, definitely go with Legendary Auto for '69. The dimples on the '68-69 PUI interior are way too shallow and it simply does not look original.

Feel free to ask more questions, but hopefully this is a decent start.

 

Thank you for the information. I would agree with you on the marking of parts. The first time i pulled the front clip off i just tossed all the bolts into a bucket. Yes it was a mess trying to figure out which bolt went where on a fender. The engine and tranny were both redone, but not the rearend. I will have to look at doing that. My 69 also has some of the rot you had mentioned. I suppose with some patients and time patching it all in. I am going to get started on the tear down this weekend. I might check back with you if i have any questions.

 

I can't decide if I want to tackle this yet or not. I'd love to rip it down, but then I feel like I'll be missing out on driving my car. I;m redoing the suspension on mine now. I guess I can start there anyway and one day in the future, I may do a complete frame off. For now, do what I can get to and eventually pull the frame.

 

I can't tell you how many cars in the last 30 years I've seen half dissassembled, sitting in a garage with the years just passing it by. It sounds like you have a driver car that you enjoy. I have talked to more than one guy who said as soon as the car was restored, the fun was over. Simply because after the restoration and the huge amount of money spent, you have to worry about door dings, scratches, weather etc. I had an Old 70 SS Chevelle that needed a paint job real bad but never got one. The car was alot of fun. It was faded and weathered but attracted more attention the the restored Chevelles it was parked next to. I like cars with patina.
Why don't you post a couple pics.

 

I prefer a car that runs and needs restoring over a car on jack stands! I've just seen too many 'just a quick ....' project take the car off the road for years. (GUILTY)

 

I agree with the others BerBer, unless you have a bunch of money and time (or even more money if you don't have the time because you'll have to hire someone else to do it), I'd simply fix whatever needs fixing and drive it. Only tackle a resto if you're willing to be without that car for quite some time. This is obviously easier to do if you have another car you enjoy doing, but if not, it's torture.

 

well my quick resto turned into a quagmire, I drove my olds into the garage, needed some work in the rear quarters, thought about redoing the suspension, well it has sat in there for a long long time now ( 10+ years) I have the body off the frame, have redone all the suspension, did the frame, and only recently just bought repop quarters, I also picked up a 455, correct exhaust manifolds etc etc etc but what the guys are telling you is true, have a PLAN, not like me ( wat a snapper head), I should have changed the quarters before pulling the body off, now i have to remount the body, etc etc etc I got some excellent advice here, if your gonna eat an elephant it starts with one bite at a time, if your changing the quarters, do that first or the wiring, or something ( look at the brought a 61 back from the dead thread improvements while he is driving it, make sure you have a budget, 90% of my delays came from having cash sitting in the bank and the missus saying your gonna spend that on your toy when we need xyz, and you have a new truck? so the money goes for something else..

be realistic in what you can and can not do and plan accordingly..

and also be realistic in if I sell this car I will get x amount of dollars add to it what the bodywork wires etc will cost and can get this other car in this condition already done.


just some thoughts

 

Moving right along. the car went vinyl topless this week. I have some holes and around the rear window but the good thing is i have a donor roof so all the fab work is minimal due i can just section what i need from the donor. Getting pretty close to lifting off the body but have to ask why on the remount? is it due to having to make sure the body lines match/ Just needing the advice you got. Also need opinions from everyone one on a rotisserie. Yes they are expensive but a friend and i talked about splitting the cost due to he has a ride that will be started in a year. If yes any suggestion on models? I have seen a few on the internet but it is a tough call.

 

That's the way I feel. My car has a little rust on fenders and quarters but that's it from what I can tell. My suspension pieces are coming in piece by piece and before you know it, I'll be ready to do that. It's a complete suspension package from mark at savitske. I'll let you guys know how that goes when it gets started. Good luck with Everyones restos

 

X3. I'm now trying to put mine back together from a previous off body restoration that never took off. All I can say is that the body did come off the frame

 

Took me 19 months and a lot of work to do a frame off on my car in the drive way. I am now driving it and enjoying it. The advice about bagging and tagging everything is SOOO true!! Whatever you end up doing, make sure it is worth it to YOU in the end.

Keith

 

Room

Do you have room to have a car in pieces for an extend period of time.

 

2 car garage just for my workshop. The olds shares the garage with the riding mower and a couple of quads. Plenty of room. I was at the point of either selling it which we all know when you have one bad floor pan, and rust that the normal tire kickers can't see past that to put up the $$$$. Plus if i sold it then us married guys know what happens to that money. LOL

 

I hear ya on that. We currently have a one car garage in the townhouse we live in now and we're going to be moving into a house with a 2 car garage and I already told my wife that she's NOT parking her car in the garage. It goes in the huge driveway. I told her she can do whatever she wants to the rest of the house, but the garage is all mine. I hope she at least lets me sleep in the bed with her still. haha. Once I get in there, I'll be able to do some more serious work on my 68. I'll have to post some pics for you guys.

 

When building an Oldsmobile, you have to know that most likely, you won't be able to sell it for what a Chevelle is getting. So I don't even think about it ever leaving my possession. I've got a very understanding wife that encourages me to build my car. But I find it hard to buy new seats when bills need to be paid. As stated earlier, if you've got the space, time, money and organizational skills, a frame off would be great. With me, a frame off in the mist of an essentially one car garage, 2 kids and one on the way and trying to become debt free, it's tough. More power to you. And if you do, please post pictures.

 

Thanks. Pretty much i have the ok from the misses. She was tired of putting her feet to the side due to the floor pan rot. When i told her what is wanted to do she was all over it and has even helped a bit in the labeling of pieces.

 

Then you my friend, are half way there. And most times women are more detailed then guys.

 

A rottissere saves alot of time and makes the project easier and safer. I pulled my body and set it on blocks for awhile, it was ok but I didn't go under for fear of it falling. I borrowed the rottissere from a friend and finished the underside and put it back on the frame. The Autotwirler rottissere is what I used very nice!

 

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I made a bit of progress with the teardown this weekend. I have pulled the rear window out and got the headliner out. I have some rust on the top but should be able to patch. I did run into a snag though. I need to remove the chrome strip on the drip rail. What is the secret in getting this off?

 

1) Get some high quality masking tape. Cover the molding with 2-3 layers.

2) Buy (or go in the house and get one) an old-school style bottle opener. I put a layer of tape over the sections I thought would contact with the aluminum drip rail molding.

3) Starting at one far end of the molding & using the tab (the little prong that would generally set under the bottlecap to pry the cap off), gently place it under the lip of the molding.

4) Gently pry up on the molding. Catch the lifted piece with your free hand. Do NOT pull up on it at any point. Simply move down every inch or so and pry up. Eventually, as you get toward the other far end, it'll be easier to pop off.

Just take your time with this. Never force anything, including the prying or lifting of the molding. They're incredibly fragile and easily damaged.

Hope this helps.

 

Well it has been a long time since I posted something up here. I hadn’t had much time to get to the olds since August but now really tearing into it. About 500 pictures later and boxes of tagged items, I have the body off and the frame is down to the roller. I will have the suspension off in a week so I will have the frame. So I need advice on next steps. I power washed the roller the other day to get all the dirt and grime off of it. Now just the surface rust to remove. So what is the best way to take the frame to the metal? Next is the finish coat. I see guys on the web site sending the frames to powder coat, where others paint the frames. This is my first resto and not looking to make the car a custom or show car, just something really nice to drive on the street and save a bit on expenses. I am curious if powder coating is the way what would I roughly be looking at for cost.

 

probably the easiest way to do the frame is to have it sand blasted if you have a decent compressor you could buy a cheap sand blaster set up and do it yourself, I used a heavy wire wheel on mine and then painted the entire frame with por 15, while it was still slightly tacky i sprayed it with GM chasis black, it comes premixed and fairly cheap from year one.

the por 15 says you do not have to remove the rust but I did anyway.

I then sand blasted the front end parts etc and did the same, or used some of the "correct" spray paints from eastwood, I don't know how correct they are but what the heck you need to paint the parts anyway lol...

you might want to look into replacing the brake lines and fuel lines, I got mine from inline tube and got the stainless ones.

I didn't think about a disc brake conversion at the time but now i am seriously considering it so if your changing spindles etc now is the time. and this will tie in with the brake lines if your replacing them. also now is the time to look at the fuel tank, ( you did look for the build sheet on top of the tank right? sometimes it is under that black roofing mat thing)

I am also doing a 69 convertible so just trying to share what I did and what i have learned with 20/20 hindsight.

 

Thanks for the info. So i understand what was the purpose of adding the GM chassie paint? Yes i have pulled all the brake and fuel lines. I figured they did their job for 40 years so it is time to replace them. Yes the black mat was on top of the tank. So my next question is, would it be wise to replace the tank? The bottome of my tank has a few dings and dents. Nothing major. I am curious if we use the por 15 on the exterior of the tank as well or go with a different look I am taking suggestions.

 

Before you put it back together, install new fuel lines. The fuel lines are most easily replaced with the body off. It's a pain with the body on. I just figured my fuel lines were good and, when we went to start the car for the first time, both lines rained gas on the shop floor. Best to just change out those lines while the body is off.

 

Here are some pics of last weekend in taking the body off.

 

Here are some additional pics

 

Nice pictures, thanks for posting them. I did the same to my 69 Cutlass that I recently sold. My frame looked to be in the same condition as yours, some surface rust and maybe a little worse behind the rear wheels. I wire wheeled mine, sprayed it with rust encapsulator black primer from Eastwood, and then sprayed the frame and floor with Eastwood extreme chassis satin black paint. Came out amazing. I did grind off most of the surface rust but they say you only need to get off the loose stuff.

IMG_0191.jpg?t=1259252439

IMG_0138.jpg?t=1259252546

I would open up the gas tank and look inside. If it is clean with no rust, I would just clean up the outside, spray it with Eastwood tank tone, and put it back in. That's what I put on mine. Hope that helps.

IMG_0443.jpg?t=1259252913

 

You look to be in about the same spot in the resto as my Vista Cruiser. I would sandblast and paint the frame. I have a company near me that will sanblast the frame,crossmember and core support for around $350 so for me it's not woth the mess and time to do it myself. You will go through $100 worth of sand easy plus the mess,nozzles etc. I have blasted frames myself and it is not a pleasent job. Good luck with it as it will be worth it in the end.

 

Your cutlass looks alot like one I sold in 1992. Im curious if it is. Do you know any history of this car?

 

I had purchased the car on the internet from a guy in Hamlin TX. The car is relitively solid except for one floor pan and the typical rot around the rear window.

 

This past summer I finished a 6 year, body off restoration of a 31 Chevy Coupe. Except for the engine block machine work, all work was done by yours truly.

There have been a lot of good advise posted. Don't get in a hurry, this is a very labor intensive endeavor, and at times extremely frustrating. A couple of of times I had to walk away for a couple of days.


31004-1.jpg

 

Thanks. It is alot of fun and hard work. As an update i have the car down to a roller. I have been working on removing the suspension. I have had a few bolts that have not cooperated worth a dam.

 

I dug up an old pic of my cutlass taken in 1990. Its probably not the same car but the resemblance is amazing. I sold my car in 92 to a guy in queens, NYC

 

Pretty dam close. Yours is in better shape.

 

I have finally gotten the car down to the frame. I found some items that could be improved upon but wanted to get some input. I had found where the lower passenger side outside side of the control arm was bent in a bit so the control arm has a curve to it. I don’t think it can be heated and hammered out so this leads me to the solution. I know I can pickup used lowers on ebay pretty cheap and redo the bushings, but trying to weigh options. I seen in Fusicks that they have new arms and bushing but they are just as costly as aftermarket custom control arms. If I keep the originals I am planning to box them in.

Also never having a car down to the frame I discovered how light the perches for the upper and lower control arms on the frame. Has anyone ever re-enforced these? The car currently has the 12 bolt that will go back in it once I am done with the frame.

Lastly I found on the frame side rails towards the inside the bottoms in 2 locatons are kinda bent up about a ½ inch. My guess is misplacement of a jack. I am going to get it straightened back down, but has anyone went as far as boxing the side rails in as well?

 

Could be a lot of work!! At that point, I would sell my frame, take the procedes, and buy a 'vert frame....already boxed!

 

If you're referring to the rear CA perches, the common fix is the upper to lower braces in either original stamped part or aftermarket like this....


If you're referring to the front, I saw a series of nice posts w/pics on the 'Net a while ago where a guy strengthened his A body frame for (circle track ?) racing and did a bunch of welding in plates/washers here & there. I remember he seemed to have a lot of experience with the common failure areas, but can't find it now....Maybe you can Google it...

Sniff around over at www.pro-touring.com. Lotsa people have done it to a variety of cars...

Or do like ent72olds said !

Hope this helps...

 

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It has been a busy winter and now that the snow has melted and warm enough to paint it is time to get some things done. I spent the winter brushing on the frame and suspention pieces. Amazing a car from texas would that much crud in and outside the frame. I used por15 for my frame and suspension paint. Here are the pics on my progress.

 

looks great making good progress keep chopping at it though... are you leaving the glossy por 15 finish? or the more factory look of satin gloss?