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Hey guys! Not new to oldsmobiles (I have a 62 starfire still, but sold my 68 442 a few yrs ago) but I recently purchased a 67 toro in turquoise frost with black top and blue interior. Rust isn't very bad considering its from Michigan (trunk SOLID, just a little sub frame rust, little tiny bit around windows, door areas, and rear floor pans). But, that being said it has a stuck engine. The last owner purchased it from the orig owner (I still have the orig 1967 title) who had it stored in a barn since I think the late 70s or early 80s. I guess it had some carb trouble, carb was removed... and then stored with the air cleaner just sitting on the intake (the intake was nut storage for mince for many years). I have been soaking the cylinders in kroil, ATF/kerosene, and sea foam deep creep. I used a bore scope camera to look at the pistons and they dont look bad, and the cylinder walls dont look rusty at all. But she still wont turn over by hand. I have been going as easy as I can on the crank bolt so I don't break it. I was hoping to use a flywheel turning tool but since I am unfamiliar with these, I noticed there is no dust cover for the flywheel with the fwd th425.
So other than pulling the engine, or risking breaking off the crank bolt... is it possible to get some kind of pry bar into the area where the starter engages the flywheel? People have said that trying to get an engine rotating from the flywheel is the way to go. I don't want to have to pull the heads or anything yet. Any advice would be awesome! As for now I will just keep soaking the cylinders. Before anyone asks, yes the car is in neutral, all the belts are off (all the accessories all spin without any seized), and engine had oil in it. Radiator still had anti freeze in it and the trans was still full of fluid. Thanks in advance!
Try removing the starter to access the flexplate, Use a VERY large screwdriver or bent tip prybar to engage a flexplate tooth and fulcrum it against the starter mounting. Even better if someone could work the crank bolt while simultaneously tapping/shocking it. Stay reasonable with the force, don't break anything. Without an access plate I don't think the tool above will work.
This is my experience with " stuck " engines .
The first was a '48 Lincoln V-12 . We went so far as towing the car down the road with the clutch in, and letting it out .
That didn't work . I took it apart and used a sledgehammer and a block of wood to remove the pistons . The engine was later rebuilt .
The second was a '47 Buick straight 8 . It was "freed up" by pulling it down the road , I ran it for a couple of hundred miles . It still smoked like a steam locomotive .
I sold it to someone who didn't know better .
The third was a '57 Olds 88 . I broke this one loose with a breaker bar on the balancer bolt . It ran , but poorly for about 100 miles .
I pulled it apart , and one of the cylinders was so bad , it had to be sleeved .
In conclusion , my advice is don't waste too much time getting it "freed up" . Because you will most likely have to re-build it anyway .
actually i did buy that exact flexplate rotating tool!!! then to my surprise i saw yesterday that there is no way to use the tool on this engine without removing the transmission. there is no unboltable inspection cover below the flexplate like in a typical setup. its all one solid piece.
so yep the starter hole is plan b. i do have both a long screwdriver and a bent tip prybar. ill see if i can use a block of wood to help prying.
i figured this engine would need a rebuild anyway..but i could at least drive it around on my property in this state if i can get it running. worst case ill pull the heads and do the hammer on block of wood on the pistons. ill keep you guys updated!!! ill take valve covers off too and see how things look too!
Last edited by viper771; December 3rd, 2018 at 05:23 PM.
Reason: stupid phone
Just don't break any castings, ears etc. The flexplate is replaceable so that isn't a big deal. If you have time put tension on the bar and tap it lightly in both directions with the plugs out, walk away and repeat, repeat, repeat. Could also pull the distributor and oil prime it if you are so inclined.
How many miles on it?
That is a nice looking ride, I hope it breaks free...don't be surprised if it does!!!
Just don't break any castings, ears etc. The flexplate is replaceable so that isn't a big deal. If you have time put tension on the bar and tap it lightly in both directions with the plugs out, walk away and repeat, repeat, repeat. Could also pull the distributor and oil prime it if you are so inclined.
How many miles on it?
That is a nice looking ride, I hope it breaks free...don't be surprised if it does!!!
it says 30800 on the odo so im thinking 130k. it has a trailer hitch that looks like a dealer install ( makes sense that they would tow with a toro in Michigan). when the plugs came out they were not too crusty from moisture.
im hoping that the bar through starter hole will do the trick. ill pull the intake eventually to get all the mouse pee n poop off it..and the nuts from the inside of it. i do hope it breaks free
1. I think sucking all the debris out of the intake passages would be first. Neck down a "wetvac" hose to a smaller piece of tubing to get deep into the intake manifold.
2. Something to try would be welding a "quick connector" to the base of spark plug. Put more penetrating oil in cylinders but not full. Screw in the "special tool" and connect air from the compressor for a few minutes to help work the penetrating around the rings. Repeat with each cylinder.
.....Just my two cents worth
1. I think sucking all the debris out of the intake passages would be first. Neck down a "wetvac" hose to a smaller piece of tubing to get deep into the intake manifold.
2. Something to try would be welding a "quick connector" to the base of spark plug. Put more penetrating oil in cylinders but not full. Screw in the "special tool" and connect air from the compressor for a few minutes to help work the penetrating around the rings. Repeat with each cylinder.
.....Just my two cents worth
yep i used a shop vac to get most out but the rest is way down in there. i used a bore scope camera i got off Amazon to look into the cylinders and intake. im not sure if more junk is atound the valves or not.
i think 3 of the cylinders had my oil still in the cylinders..the rest leaked past so the ones with oil are my stuck ones. i dont have a welder but i heard about that compressed air idea. ill see if i can get a flex hose or some sort to get the debris. but not sure if it will work bec the nuts are walnut sized or a little smaller in some cases. pulling intake wouldnt be so bad just to clean it since it reeks of **** lol
I forgot to mention that you'll need to loosen the rocker arms on the cylinders you want to pressurize. The other cylinders may blow back some debris in the heads if the valves are open. Try some Fabreeze to make the "mouse fragrance" tolerable enough to work on.
I forgot to mention that you'll need to loosen the rocker arms on the cylinders you want to pressurize. The other cylinders may blow back some debris in the heads if the valves are open. Try some Fabreeze to make the "mouse fragrance" tolerable enough to work on.
that fragrance is thick enough to scrape off lol but ill see what i can do. im thinking of trying an atf/acetone mixture next too for a soak.
Pretty sure this car was for sale very close to me. Wanted to go grab it, but really did not have the time now that it would need.
Nice to see it getting some attention. Good luck with that engine.
im thinking of trying an atf/acetone mixture next too for a soak.
THIS^^^
ATF has all sorts of detergents in it. So many in fact that it's common practice to run ATF in older diesel engines to free up sticky injectors and injection pumps.
i tried atf/kerosene with no luck but read the atf/acetone may work better.
i do plan on fixing this one up. i couldn't part it out and id hate to see that happen to this toro since its not as bad as many ive seen from the rust belt.
Good luck with the initial project -- don't forget your "Marvel Mystery Oil" as a helper..... That 1962 Olds Starfire next door looks very sweet.......
If you need help with Engine Parts -- bottom end --- Pistons, Rings, Rod Bearings, Main Bearings, etc. --- I can help you with American Made Parts !!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you need top end parts -- Camshaft, Valve Lifters, Push Rods, Rocker Arms, etc., etc. --- I can also help you with American Made Parts !!!!!!!!!!!!
I have some GLORIOUS parts for both your toys --- I have N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Brake Pads & Brake Shoes for the '67 Toronado -- and they are CRITICAL for that car !!!!!!!
For the 1962 Olds Starfire -- I have listed presently, the Front Original Kelsey - Hayes "Big Bell" Front Brake Drums -- and Water Pumps, for A.C. & Non - A.C. cars; and a whoooooooooole lot more!!!!!!!!!
Always best to simply call me ---- Craig -- 516 - 485 - 1935....... West Hempstead, Longggg Island, New York....
Good luck with the initial project -- don't forget your "Marvel Mystery Oil" as a helper..... That 1962 Olds Starfire next door looks very sweet.......
If you need help with Engine Parts -- bottom end --- Pistons, Rings, Rod Bearings, Main Bearings, etc. --- I can help you with American Made Parts !!!!!!!!!!!!!
If you need top end parts -- Camshaft, Valve Lifters, Push Rods, Rocker Arms, etc., etc. --- I can also help you with American Made Parts !!!!!!!!!!!!
I have some GLORIOUS parts for both your toys --- I have N.O.S. ++ Asbestos ++ Brake Pads & Brake Shoes for the '67 Toronado -- and they are CRITICAL for that car !!!!!!!
For the 1962 Olds Starfire -- I have listed presently, the Front Original Kelsey - Hayes "Big Bell" Front Brake Drums -- and Water Pumps, for A.C. & Non - A.C. cars; and a whoooooooooole lot more!!!!!!!!!
Always best to simply call me ---- Craig -- 516 - 485 - 1935....... West Hempstead, Longggg Island, New York....
thanks for the info Craig! actually the first thing i tried was marvel mystery oil i heard that the drum brakes for the 67 were just ..good enough.. and its why they had come out with optional disc brakes in 67.
my starfire runs (i took intake off a few yrs ago to change gasket but haven't put back on yet) but i will be looking for a heat riser valve or a heat riser valve spacer since its been stuck in closed position. i was thinking of cutting valve out and having shaft holes welded up to make it a spacer. if you have a working wonderbar radio with foot switch i may be interested.
once i get things going with toro ill start looking for parts. i do need a carb for it.
next to the 62 is my 72 riv. i was backing out of that garage, lost brakes, and rolled into stuff laying against my workshop that faces the garage... dented my quarter panel up a bit. i have all the parts to get brakes working and hopefully it wont cost much to fix my dent.
If you don't mind spending 40 bucks, make the acetone and ATF mixture and fill it from the oil hole till it is full. Like 15 quarts. You'll come up the cylinders from the bottom. Drain before doing anything other than breaking it loose.
If you don't mind spending 40 bucks, make the acetone and ATF mixture and fill it from the oil hole till it is full. Like 15 quarts. You'll come up the cylinders from the bottom. Drain before doing anything other than breaking it loose.
never thought of that but that isnt a bad idea. i was going to drain it anyway so this may be plan ..d
back about 83 or so i had a 72 impala with a 400 small block,i also had a 67 chevelle that needed an engine,so i pulled the 400,had it setting on the driveway with a tarp over it.it was there for maybe 4 days.went to put it in and it was locked up.we tried everything to get it broke loose.finally after a few beers or maybe a few dozen i foret which we decided to pull all the plugs and squirt some gas in a cylinder,we then started flipping lit matches at the hole.WAHOOOF.engine shakes violently but stays upright.still locked up so try a different hole,after 3 or 4 it broke loose.man we got a good laugh out of it.
back about 83 or so i had a 72 impala with a 400 small block,i also had a 67 chevelle that needed an engine,so i pulled the 400,had it setting on the driveway with a tarp over it.it was there for maybe 4 days.went to put it in and it was locked up.we tried everything to get it broke loose.finally after a few beers or maybe a few dozen i foret which we decided to pull all the plugs and squirt some gas in a cylinder,we then started flipping lit matches at the hole.WAHOOOF.engine shakes violently but stays upright.still locked up so try a different hole,after 3 or 4 it broke loose.man we got a good laugh out of it.
December 3rd, 2018, 01:57 PM
i heard that the drum brakes for the 67 were just ..good enough.. and its why they had come out with optional disc brakes in 67.
