ztim

It is not the thermostat. I even tried a second new one and then without any. After short distances it is fine, but a long drive, 10+ miles, the reservoir boils over when the engine is cut off.

Can it be the water pump? But wouldn't even a short drive freeze the motor? Any help would be appreciated.

Oldsguy

Check your radiator cap to see if it is holding pressure. If your system isn't pressurized the coolant will boil at a lower temperature and that might be causing it. Or, you might have a leak in the radiator or intake manifold which would allow pressure to blow off too. Check your coolant level when it is low and fill it. Does your system have a backflush valve on the heater core supply hose? Sometimes when people use it they get an air bubble introduced into the system there. That could cause trouble too.

ztim

Thanks Oldsguy. I'll check to see if I have a back flush valve. I do not think I have a leak anywhere but come to think of it, the radiator cap is kinda ragged. I'll try a new one and see if it would help.

Oldsguy

You should be able to have a shop test if for pressure if you don't have one yourself. Cheaper than buying one if you don't need it.

ztim

Now it seems there is a water leak at the water pump (gasket). I was able to get up underneath and tighten two bolts (one was loose). I can't get on the others. I think I might have to remove the radiator shroud. Do I?

Oldsguy

I would bet that the water pump is your original problem and I would bet that tightening the bolts won't fix it. If you are going to go to the trouble to change the gasket then you will have the water pump out to do it. Look at the pump and see if there is evidence of leakage where the shaft exits from the front of the water pump body. Most of those seals are just bushings and they do wear and become leaky with time. If you have to replace the water pump most have a gasket in the box with them. As to how difficult it would be to access all the water pump bolts ( I think there are 11 or 12 and a few are not bolts but nuts that tighten down on studs extending from the front of the block), you can' t do it easiy without removing the fan shroud, fan itself, and probably at least the alternator bracket as I think it bolts onto the water pump near the front and uses one of the water pump mounting bolts. Of course the belts and pulleys have to be removed too. It takes a little longer to remove the fan shroud but makes it much easier. Be sure to notice and mark the bolts and where they go as there are a couple different lengths. I think the hardest part is removing the fan itself first because it is usually a clutch type and hard to loosen the four bolts that hold it onto the pulley. It has a tendancy to free spin. I have seen two ways to mount the fan, one is with studs that are screwed into the end of the water pump shaft, the other is with bolts. If the water pump has ever been replaced before it may be with studs and nuts, if it is original it may be with the bolts only. The studs and nuts are easier I think as the bolts are sometimes almost too long to get out once they are loose. So, fan first, then shrould, then alternator bracket, then belts, then pulley, then water pump. Usually you can't remove the shroud first because the fan fits too snugly into the shrould inner area and you cant slip the shrould out all the way. Hope this helps and sorry for it being such a long post.

(edit) was the radiator cap good then?

ztim

Yes, the radiator cap is good. I am not sure if I am up to a job like changing the pump or not. I don't think I have all the tool for it.
Thanks for the help.
bob

Oldsguy

Bob,
You would need at least a 3/8" socket set with driver and extensions. A good set of box or combination wrenches including 1/2", 7/8", 9/16" and probably an extra 1/2" one. I think the fan blade nut/bolt size is 3/8" so add that to the list. A set of screwdrivers to take off the water hose clamps (if applicable) as you have to remove the radiator hoses and heater core hoses. If you know someone or have a buddy with experience it would help you a lot. I guarantee that you will learn a lot if you have never done this before and when you are done you will really feel like you accomplished something. Oh, and you will need a scraper to clean off the old gasket junk from the timing cover and the water pump if you ony replace a gasket. Anyway, good luck and keep us posted.

ztim

Thanks! I have all that so I might as well give it a shot. All I have to do, I guess, is to buy a new pump.

ztim

I bought a new water pump today. With tax it was about $33. I will put it on tomorrow.
Thanks

ztim

I am about half way done. That fan with the clutch sure is a bear. Once I get it all apart, I hope it is easier putting it back together. I gotta get back over there so I won't have time to check this site again until Sunday night. Will keep in touch. Thanks.

Oldsguy

It is Sunday night and I just read your last three posts. Good work! Once you are finished you will be very glad you did it. Saved some bucks too huh?

ztim

Yup, I'm saving some bucks doing the work and stuff myself. I'm glad I have been taking notes. It is helping getting things back together. There is more to it than I thought. Seems everything with a belt has a bracket hooked in somehow. I have to buy four new bolts. I have to wait until tomorrow ( it's Sunday here) for the store to open. The new pump did not have four threaded studs for the fan and clutch to bolt to. It just had four threaded holes. I hope to finish Monday if the rain stops.

Oldsguy

Good, too bad about the studs but they are pretty standard stuff and most auto parts places should have them.

ztim

I don't think I need studs, just bolts to hold everything together. I'm on my way now. I'll let you know.

ztim

I had to learn the hard way. I wish the auto parts store would have told me I need to buy studs when I bought the new water pump. Everything is back together now except for one belt that goes to the power steering unit. For the life of me I can't figure out how to loosen it to get the belt around the pulley. It was easier getting it off. Any ideas? I have to go back over there in a half hour or so. It's a two mile walk.

Oldsguy

Many auto parts employees don't really know how to do a job or what parts are needed, they just know how to look up a part in an application chart and collect your money. I am not sure about the power steering pump on your car but look for a bolt near the bottom of the pump that appears to go through the pump and would be a pivot point, loosen it, then there should be another bolt that is on the bracket that obviously is the one that actually holds tension on the belt because it will correspond to the slot in the bracket. About the bottom bolt, don't remove it, just loosen it so the pump will pivot. I hope this helps out.

ztim

I am having a heck of a time with that power steering belt. There is a bolt in the back of it that I can't get a wrench on. The front one is loose...the one behind the pulley. The one in back, I think, is going to have me remove the alternator. Does that sound right? The maybe I can get at least a box wrench on it. Any ideas? Thanks Oldsguy.

Oldsguy

Yes, I believe you are right, it is the back bolt that is the pivot bolt. As to how to get to it, I think using a box wrench is the way to do it. I don't know about having to remove the alternator. I can't envision it in my mind's eye, but if you have to then you must, it would at least be another learning experience. Then, when you have to remove/replace the alternator, you will know how. Sorry but I just don't remember for sure but it seems that I have never had to remove the alternator. All the V8's are similar but not exactly alike....maybe it's time to get a service manual.

ztim

I think you may be right although a box wrench can move maybe 1/8th of a turn if you can get it on. Not enough to break it loose. The alt bracket is in the way. You are right about it being a learning experience. A good one for sure. I'm sure glad I don't do this for a living! I'd starve. lol

Oldsguy

Well, I hope you can get it. I realize now that my post earlier this morning sounded sort of dis-jointed. My daughter woke me at 4 am (she works mid shift at UPS) with car troubles so I had been awake but not totally conscious I guess.

ztim

Thankyou

ztim

I did it Oldsguy! Turns out I was not putting enough pressure on the pry bar I was using. I moved the alt for nothing. Well, now I feel good about doing that job. Next I will learn about how to work the radio.

ztim

Since I put the new water pump on the car, the overheating stopped and the engine's dieseling stopped as well. I guessed on belt tension, but everything seems to be working fine.

Oldsguy

Wohoo! Good for you! I am so glad you were able to fix it on your own and glad I was able to help you out. I know exactly what you experienced, I am a big guy and sometimes am too careful for fear of damaging something, I bent a guys large No.1 12 inch straight slot screwdriver once leaning on it too much ( wrong tool for the job and using it the wrong way). The belt when correctly tensiones should have about a 1/4 to 1/2 inch of lateral play when you grasp it and wiggle it in the center of the two fulcrum points (did I exlplain that so you understand?).

ztim

Thanks for all the help, Oldsguy. The belts are right, then. I recall seeing on TV once about how to check the tension with a coin. I guess I did alright. Now I am trying to figure out why the dash brake light is on. I am in the process of finding the parking brake switch.

Thanks again

Oldsguy

Look for it near the mechanism. It works similar to the regular brake switch; when the pedal is not engaged the switch is in contact but "normally open" with the mechanism and when the mechanism is engaged then the switch closes, causing the inidicator to light as a reminder.