mikkim129

I have a 66 f85 And currently it has a 78 260 cutlas engine in it and a 2 sp tranny. What engines can I easily swap over to. I've been looking at the 425 but is that to costly and too much for power? Im not looking at racing it but I deff want some more hp than the 260.

VegasDelta

Any small block will be a bolt-in. A big block will go if you use the small block mounts & will bolt up to the tranny. Be careful of the small block tranny w/ a big block behind it.

mikkim129

sb tranny isn't able to take it?

texasred

A TH-350 transmission doesn't leech as much power and is lighter than a TH-400 (which is why a lot of racers prefer them). But you will certainly need to beef up the internals to handlle the torque of a big block over time.

C.J.

mikkim129

What engines do you reccomed?

Oldsmaniac

I would recommend a 330 as thats what it originally came with.....If ya want power then a 403 would be the largest small block from Olds.....That car has to be a real snail with a 260.....Good Luck with it....

texasred

I'll agree with the first and third statement, but a 403 (while the largest small block) is a poor choice IMHO because of the windowed mains. Too weak. Get a good 350 block with a free-flowing valve job and you won't go wrong.

Oh..the fourth statement. Certainly good luck!
C.J.

Oldsmaniac

The 403 is not that weak.....It is a popular build up engine in the G body to replace the 307....It will stand up to street and race applications as well....And from the initial thread we arent talking a high HP buildup.....I would have no second thoughts of building a 400 horse 403 and worry about it coming apart.......

texasred

Maniac,

Trans Ams certainly ran 403s and were terrors of the street in the 80s.

Having said that, there are an awful lot of performance Olds people who would take a 350 over a 403...and do every day. For pretty much the same amount of money put into a performance build, the 350 will spin faster, last longer, and put out more horsepower despite the fact it's got 53 less cubic inches.

As I said, IMHO. And you know what they say about opinions....

C.J.

BTW, I'm really not trying to flame or fight. My posts sometimes read harsher than they sound in my head when I'm typing.

jdorour

Both the 350 and the 403 have their good points. An early 350 block is stronger and will allow for more race specific use (high stress) but the 403 makes a very good street engine. If you add a set of big valve heads and a good cam combined with the big bore and short stroke a 403 is a real street terror. The 403 is a little harder to find now-a-days. The 403 is very stout - remember GM put 403's in motorhomes- but the guys are right it is not as rugged as a 350 in allout race applications. The 307 can be built but for the money you would be better off with a 350 and the 260 is junk. The 330 was a nice engine but has some limits. For one the 45 degree cam bank angle limits the cam shaft choice - same with the early 400 and the 425. The 400 (long or short stroke) will be very expensive to buy and you can get more out of a 455 for less money. The 455 is a monster and will bolt up to the transmission. The TH300 is a good trans and can be built to take the torque of a big block. They put the TH300 behind Olds 400's in 442's, Pontiac 389's in GTO and Buick 401 Nailheads in the GS.

Have fun!
John

mikkim129

Thanks guy alot of goog info.
Will the olds 350 bolt right in?

jdorour

The Oldsmobile 350 will bolt right up with no problems.

texasred

Betcha!

And they are more plentiful.

But I don't remember 403s ever being used in motorhomes. Just 455s.

C.J.

mikkim129

Thanks
Ok another question.
It has a 2 speed tranny. Is that a power glide? I've been told they are pertty indestructable and a few guys who race only use them(powerglides).
What are the thoughts of putting in a 3 or 4 speed?
One last note A buddy of mine wants to trade the tranny for a 4sp muncie he just rebuilt. Is that worth it in value? What about in modifyingit probably wont just fit right in would it?
Sorry about all the questions
I've had this f-85 for about 5 years now and didn't think much about it until I saw a shop calander. Let me say the girl was hot but I saw what my car could look like. My ex-brother in law restored it very shotty. Now I think I caught the bug to throw money at it.
Thanks again

Oldsguy

Well, I'll just say this, I think there are more than one type of GM two speed automatics and yours MAY not be the powerglide. If someone bolted up a 260 in your f85 I can't see them using a powerglide because they are desirable for dragracing as you mentioned. A drawback of using a two-speed on the street is poorer fuel economy and drive-ability, you may find the engine turning up too high before the shift, not to say it is too high for engine durability but just may be irritatingly too high for everyday use. As was mentioned earlier a TH350 or TH400 would be good depending on what engine you decide on. The muncie would require that you set up the car for manual operation with a clutch (hanging the clutch pedal, etc.)

Personally, I recommend you find an engine/tranny combo from someplace and drop them in together. If you can find a running set from say a wrecked car, then you are two steps ahead. A bone stock 455 from an early seventies B body has GOBBS of torque that would roast the tires in that little f85. If the engine is in good shape already you can spend your money on other stuff but if you are prepared to spend lots of money anyway then the 455 will respond very well to improvements. Also, depending on the length of the tranny tailshaft you may have to shorten the driveshaft to fit. However you go, getting an engine/tranny set together would put you ahead....

Good luck.

VegasDelta

That was probably the original TH-300 trans that was used in Buick, Olds & Pontiac cars. It's not the same as a powerglide, which was a Chev trans. It was used w/the stock 330 & 6 cyl engines of that time. There should be no problem with it standing up to any small block. A 3 or 4 spd auto will get you a little better fuel economy & will keep your engine from winding out as much. A 4spd muncie will need a clutch pedal & linkage, different brake pedal, a bell housing & a clutch assembly. You'll also probably have to have the end of the crank drilled to accept the pilot bearing, unless your engine had a manual trans from the factory.

mikkim129

Thanks guys
Good news I just found a car w a 455 running for less than $800. I believe the tranny is a 3sp.
the price for the scrap will cover the engine swap.

mikkim129

Also
Do you guys have any tips on the swap?
Is it worth putting on headers and a dual exhaust?
I posted a thread regaurding a crushed tail pipe. Did the 442 exhaust come out the rear? Does anyone ever route them out the sides?
Let me know If I ask too many questions

Oldsguy

VegasDelta, the TH300 was a two speed then..I didn't know that but it makes perfect sense with the 260 and you are right about the non-interchangeability (did I just type that?) of B.O.P. parts to other GMs.

Mikkim, I think you would be happier with dual exhausts if only for the nicer exhaust note. All dual exhausts exited out the rear in one form or another. If you mean DIRECTLY out the back horizontally, on 442 models I think the bumper would have had half-moon cutouts for that or maybe even circle cutouts. You will have to check with some 442 guys on that one though. As for headers, many people make headers for the 455 engine, the question is will they fit your car, the f85 is pretty small and I am not sure but that you might have some fitment problems. Not to say it couldn't be done as I am sure it has been before. At any rate if you run duals, 2.5 inch pipes are a good size for the 455 all the way back and remember selection of mufflers makes a world of difference. There are lots of sound bites of peoples' exhuasts on the web, they like to share them with others after getting a new system installed so search around beforehand if you aren't sure what you would like. I don't think performance would be as paramount as sound and durability since you mentioned the car is for street not racing. Try a site called Realoldspower.com. You may find some sound bites there. Good luck and keep researching. BTW get the 455/th400 combo....

mikkim129

I just fopund out the tranny is a gm turbo 400
I was under the impression that the f-85 cutlas and the 442 were all pretty much the same and the only difference was just options but Im just learning about the car so correct me if Im wrong. Which I probably am.

Oldsguy

A TH400? Well, thats good then. And I think you are right about the terminology, at least for the early years, I own a '76 f85 daily driver which is not as large as the Cutlass line but in the sixties I think the f85 had the same body as the Cutlass. As for the 442/Cutlass I do know that during the early years the 442 was an option for the Cutlass but somewhere in the seventies it became it's own name yet still used the Cutlass body.

mikkim129

Hey guys will a 73 olds delta 88 455 motor fit right in?

VegasDelta

Use the small block motor mounts. You may have to massage the exhaust a little.

bart

Hi There, '64 through 67' 442 was an option package on the f85,Cutlass line. With the exception of the front fenders, on the 442 had a rocket looking chrome piece half way up the fender '66 hade a different grille, trunk strip, tailights. The body itself between the the different models was exactly the same except the four door which would be different from the front fenders back. Personally if I were looking for an easy job I may lean towards the 330 which you can still find. As for the three speed, to convert you 2 speed to a three speed, shifter wise contact shiftworks they make a nice conversion kit so you don't have to bastardize anything. Myself however I have a '66 Cutlass and I am dropping in 425 because I have a soft spot for those engines. As for the dual exhaust there will be no cut-aways in your rear bumper for that, one bumper only 442,f85,Cutlass. Also I believe the 442 became it's own model in 1968 until 1971, '72 went back to being an option on the Cutlass. Thanks for listening...

Dave,,,,,otherwise known as bart

mikkim129

I've been reading about useing sb motor mounts. It was saying that the engine will sit about an inch higher and if I use a torker intake I may run into some hood problems.
If I use BB motor mounts I have to use the frame mounts as well and should move eaisly since there are already bolt hole .
Problem is I don't have BB frame mounts.
I have a elderbrock torker intake. Is this going to be a problem is I use sb motor mounts???

Ranzan

I have heard both sides ...some saythey fit and some say they don`t.... might be performer and torker intake difference??????? I have the torker intake for mine but it hasn`t sat in the engine bay yet

yogi442

I have a 66 442 with a 68 455 in it with Torker and it fits fine.

arcee1951

Lotsa options. I changed mine from a 6 popper to a 330. The 310 hp is ok, but the torque is light. If I had to do over???? probably a 350. There are lotsa options with a 350. I couldn't get headers to hook up on my 330. The right side went in fine, but the left, not so much.

The real tranny, IMHO, is the 200 4r I have in mine. I was worried about it holding together, until I talked to a guy, who took me around the corner of his house and showed me a Chevelle with a 454 in it. He asked me if my car had more horse than his 454. Find someone who knows how to build it though. PS. I had the guy build mine. Very strong tranny.

My tranny came out of a 1981 4 4 2. Under no circumstances should your rear end be less than 3.23's. I have 2.78's, and it will burn tires, but, on hilly terrain, it will keep shifting up and down between 3rd and overdrive, even at 70 mph. When they raise the speed limit to 90, all will be good.

Good luck, and have fun.

joe_padavano

The original post is from a DECADE ago. Hopefully the car is running by now (as if I'm one to talk... ).

FYI, I'd like to see a photo of a 1981 4 4 2.

Octania

I did not notice the date until halfway thru

The forum runs on computer language does it not?

How about a damn if-then-else statement in there to alert the user they are dredging up a decade old thread.

So, is our oldest thread out of high school yet?

:-)