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Need thread suggestions regarding best quick ratio steering boxes for my 1972 Cutlass please. Restoration almost complete. Steering now, but upgrading to disc will follow. 1972 Cutlass
Be aware that there are two different things you need to watch for in the Saginaw box. One is obviously the ratio, but the other is the thickness of the torsion bar. The latter is what controls the actual "feel" of the box. You can have a quick ratio box that is still "one finger" power steering.
Joe, is that the shaft in which the rag joint attaches? Pre 1977 is different than 1977 and after from what I have read.
I was looking into Borgeson. I will need to get a different rag joint and adapters for the power steering hoses I believe.
Joe, is that the shaft in which the rag joint attaches? Pre 1977 is different than 1977 and after from what I have read.
I was looking into Borgeson. I will need to get a different rag joint and adapters for the power steering hoses I believe.
The shaft with the splines on the RH side of the photo I posted is the input shaft to the box. The rag joint fits over it.
I've got a Monte SS box in mine. Also note, that your steering wheel plays a role in how your steering feels. I've had the box forever on my car, but also had a 16" steering wheel. I recently bumped that wheel down to a 14" and it really woke up the way it feels.
If a box that's not a direct bolt in is not available the best thing to do is send the original box to Lares Corporation for the conversion to quick steer. I did that on my 66 and I've never driven a better old car-period. Great road feel and it was about 2 1/2 turns lock to lock.
Last edited by 66-3X2 442; February 18th, 2023 at 07:08 PM.
^^X2^^
I did this to my stock gear box. My car had the variable ratio gear box ('72 convertible), a local rebuilder swapped out the internals to make it a fixed 12.7:1 ratio. I've done this to my previous 2 cars as well and it's a big improvement without making the steering too touchy. I've never asked to change the torsion shaft so the steering response was still pretty light, but I never felt like it was a problem for normal driving. Maybe an autocross application would want a heavier feel.
A great rebuilding / conversion source I've used previously and has been around a long time is HOME | steerandgear out of Columbus OH. Reasonable pricing and great to deal with by phone
Just as an aside I've had the Lares 970 box in my ragtop before and it's a decent 12.7:1 box generally with 3.25 turns lock to lock, but light on the road feel and had a tendency to allow wandering over uneven road surface conditions. Good driver box for short trips but not first choice for more focused driving.
Yes, the effort required on mine is quite low, but to me that's part of the magic of driving a car from the '60s. Light, yes, but rock steady at speed.
If a box that's not a direct bolt in is not available the best thing to do is send the original box to Lares Corporation for the conversion to quick steer. I did that on my 66 and I've never driven a better old car-period. Great road feel and it was about 2 1/2 turns lock to lock.
Great information. One of the benefits of this site 👍
Just as an aside I've had the Lares 970 box in my ragtop before and it's a decent 12.7:1 box generally with 3.25 turns lock to lock, but light on the road feel and had a tendency to allow wandering over uneven road surface conditions. Good driver box for short trips but not first choice for more focused driving.
Wandering is more a function of caster setting than the box.
Picked up a new Borgeson 12.7:1 steering box (800130) along with a matching new Borgeson high volume pump (800310). Will install next weekend. Picked up the required hoses and new rag joint as well. Hopefully the intermediate shaft is good. Will check during box change.
If it's something you don't mind throwing some money at, I recommend Powersteering.com.
They rebuild your own box and have quick ratio options. I'm extremely pleased with the results and it's your original box so there's no fitment issues.
My 72 steers better than new. Turnaround is a couple of weeks. Great customer service.
Installed a Bogenson quick ratio box and Bogenson pump to match last weekend. Drove car today.
Steers like a dream.
Thank You everyone for the help and support!
I’m 59, so I started driving cars that had tighter steering and no dead zone in the 80s’ as compared to 60’s cars.
About 25 years ago, maybe 30, I swapped in a 2.5 lock-to-lock steering box on my ‘66 big car from Lee Manufacturing (these days, its successor) in Southern California. I probably reacted to a promo article in Hot Rod or one of the other advertorial magazines (which have now moved to Motor Trend TV…)
I believe they also raised or lowered the fluid PSI pressure in the pump to improve road feel. I can’t recall quite what their pump pressure voodoo was. Poll the team here to see if they view that as a good or bad thing.
Since the first car went so well, I did the second big car the same way.
Both cars steer well, have no perceptible dead zone and go where you point them. I consider this a win for a ‘66 98 and ‘66 Starfire. A friend of mine who grew up in TX commented that she’d driven very similar cars in the old days and she felt (as I do) that I’d solved the dead/sloppy steering that they designed to in the 60’s.
The only downside I’ve seen is what I think is greater variation in fluid volume as it heat up in use. On startup I the occasional low-fluid groan, but once warm, no problem. But - if I top up the fluid to eliminate the groan, once the fluid expands, it spew out the pressure release valve on the cap and sprays onto the underside of my hood and cruise unit… I live with the temporary groan.
No knock on what Olds did at the factory, I just liked tighter steering and fewer turns lock to lock.
In sum, a very worthwhile upgrade. I think about this every time I go into SF on a freeway curve in Sausalito and remember how it was vs. how it is.
Maybe I am a bit on the lucky side when it comes to this.
Purchased car that had high mileage for frame off restoration. Drove after restoration, but prior to putting in new steering. Original box had gotten so bad that there was a catch going around curves let alone the leak.
New box took care of both issues and now I have tight steering as well.
February 18th, 2023, 04:32 AM
