olds67

hello guys
We have got a problem in Italy with oil, as the case open ZDDP that was used once for your engines, here is not used by us and the cars have engine problems and sometimes break for bad lubrication.
the oil that we have here range from 5W40 to 10W40 or 20W50 semi synthetic oils but they are all.
What do you think?
and what do you recommend?
thanks

Olds64

I've heard alot about ZDDP. I think it is more important to change your oil regularly than to pay extra for a ZDDP oil.

olds67

here in Italy the last time so many Big Block are having problems breaking even new engines that come from the USA and think that the cause is oil.
hope not

1969w3155

You need to use a good break in oil and camshft lube when rebuilding the engines, and then a zddp additive if you have a flat tappet engine, especially if it has an aggressive lift camshaft. Your oils are fine, synthetic and semi-synthetic are good when used with zddp on these older engines.

olds67

yes to the cam shaft i used an oil for assembly,now i think is as you say,with a good synthetic and semi sinthetic oil and zddp.
and then 20 minutes of running at 2000 rpm

Lady72nRob71

Use 15W40 diesel oil regularly after break in. Diesels are abundant in Europe, so the oil should be also.
This is what I do over here in the US. Of course, the ZDDP is starting to be reduced from it also... Still much better than the cat-pee gas engine oil we have here.

J-(Chicago)

I believe the blue STP syrup has some zddp in it as well. not sure how much, but every bit helps. It is really thick though.

olds67

yes
you are here with us at almost all diesels.
and begin to turn even elettric cars.
seem dull

Dan Wirth

Below is a thread about a month old, that you may want to read. It is a discussion about the oils here in the US, and lack of ZDDP (Zinc and Phosphorous) and problems we are faced with as a result. There are many good advisors on this thread - with varied opinions.

https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...-car-zddp.html

The problem that you will need to deal with first is how to identify oils with ZDDP in Italy.

In the USA we have what is called an API (American Petroleum Institute) standard that would not likely be shown on European oil bottles. However, it is certainly worth checking out. We can tell by the API standards on oil bottles that carry the standard, if there is enough zinc and phosphorous by each distinctive rating. For example, SJ rated oil (an older standard) has acceptable levels of ZDDP, where SL (also an older standard but newer and more common than SJ) is approaching or has near acceptable levels.

On the thread mentioned you will find many different brands of oil that contain ZDDP, as well as recommendations.

olds67

perfect, you were very clear.
the oil API ourselves us here too, I have to see if the features are as I've written.
thanks

Bobsw32

Vavloline racing oil VR-1 has the ZDDP in it that we need for flat tappet cams

Blk71SX

This has been discussed at great length in another forum I frequent. A forum that is mostly pre WWII autos. The consensus is today's oils are more than adequate for flat tappet motors. Many cam/lifter failures can be attributed to sub standard, off shore camshafts that have flooded the market.

In the early 90s I replaced the anemic 305 in my 85 K10 and replaced it with a 350. I assembled it with a Crane HMV272 cam, Lunati Z28 springs, and a pair of heads from a 67 327. I DID NOT install hardened seats. The cam had approx .470/.510 lift. The truck routinely hauled 60 bales of hay (3000-3300 lbs) and pulled a 24 ft trailer full of swap meet parts around 4 states. The latter stages of the motors life was in town, short trip, go-fer duty. At 88,000 miles the valve springs were starting to fail (2 in 3 months) and there was evidence of a head gasket's impending failure. Three years ago I replaced it with a Goodwrench crate motor and gave the old one to a friend. He called me to his house one day to examine the tear down. I was truly amazed at the internals. The cam and lifters had only the slightest indication of wear! High lift, stiff springs and no real damage. This was with exclusive use of Castrol 10W30, and no pour in additives.

And the heads. No evidence of any seat damage from unleaded gas. He did a simple valve job and reused them.

Dan Wirth

I'm glad to hear that you have the API ratings in Italy. This should help you determine the right oil for your car. The older cars and trucks with flat tappet cam engines are most vulnerable to engine cam wear without (or having significantly less) ZDDP in today's latest API standard (SM and CI-4), and the engine wear issue that is under scrutiny.

I have found that through my (oil and ZDDP) research, the consensus on how much zinc and phosphorous levels that are acceptable, is between 1200-1400 ppm.

You can go to the web sites of the oil manufacturers and some will give you their levels of ZDDP, but others will not or may be unclear about it. Also, there are oil forums that have charted the running averages of ZDDP in the various brands and from the API ratings the manufacturers have posted on their oil bottles. (The link I gave you in my previous post gives this oil forum link info).

olds67

but it is not easy, they sell it with the name of anti-friction.

olds67

Can you tell me how much oil to put in 425, the manual says that I have QTS but we use the 5 liter or pounds and do not know how to decipher this.
thanks

Olds64

It should be 1 quart to every .95 liters. Your crank case capacity is 4.75 liters. I would start with 4.5 liters, put .75 liters into the oil filter, and put the rest in the crankcase. Then check your dipstick and fill it to the line.

olds67

ok
thanks.
tomorrow is a big day, I will make the first start engine.
when I took this car, the connecting rod were Crasch.

Dan Wirth

Is that the best they do? Too bad there is nothing further that refers to the standard ratings. Please see the thread I've mentioned to find several motor oils that should help you with a choice. Gastrol GTX Racing Oil 15W-40 is one, which may be available to you..

Mongoose

Tons of opinions on proper oil for older engines, for sure.

I received interesting insight from Lynn Welfringer @ Mondello's last night about engine oil for our Oldsmobile engines. His opinion is that we should use a conventional oil, like a Castrol 20-50, because our large diameter bearings have such high bearing speeds that they need a lot of oil "cushion", that a synthetic oil, which gets so thin, can't provide.

I think I've always just assumed that synthetic was the best you could use, and planned on using it in my freshly rebuilt motor. But historically I have always used conventional oils in my 455, but only because I was of the opinion that it wasn't good to switch to a synthetic motor oil in a motor that had been running conventional oils. Don't know where I heard that... or if its just a myth.

Anyway, I'm sure there are many of you out there that have run synthetics for years in your Olds motors with great success. But I plan on following Lynn's recommendation... he's seen a lot more motors in his lifetime than I have.

Lady72nRob71

Run the engine a couple minutes, shut off, then top off as needed.

Dan Wirth

Glad to here this, I've been running Castrol straight 40W over the summer (very hot in Arizona, so the heavier weight is important) and the engine was quieted significantly. The car ran very well and heard much improvement with lifter noise as well.

I've read (somewhere) that Castrol 20W-50 is similar in viscosity as a straight 40W. However, I have been considering a change to 15W-40, which a bit thinner oil and should be effective through out the year.

olds67

I used just the Castrol