joepenoso

My next dumb question....... an you guys are good.... I installed HEI and motor runs well no pre ignition but hot starts crank over slow, what do I do to fix that from this complete $ 50 e bay HEI?






Thanks In Advance
joepenoso

oldcutlass

First you need to get your timing light fixed and make sure your not too far advanced. Also make sure your battery cables are good and terminals are clean at both the battery and the starter. Also make sure you have a strong battery.

joepenoso

Terminals and battery are A1....timing light bulb will be my next purchase to assure total advance is correct/Assuming it is...is it possible to alter HEI so initial advance doesn't have to be so high in order to get total advance to 35 degrees?(CHEAPLY)
Thanks
joepenoso

MDchanic

Sure. At least some of the aftermarket (Crane, Mr. Gasket) HEI tuning kits should be able to provide you with a few more degrees, or you can search on line and see how you can increase the range with some careful grinding.

Or you can just go back to your points distributor, which has the correct amount of mechanical advance already.

- Eric

joepenoso

Go back to points?...After spending $50? In for a penny In for a dollar
LOL
Thanks
joepenoso

MDchanic

Another aphorism is "Once you're in a hole, keep digging!"

- Eric

joe_padavano

Step 1) quit using the bold font

Step 2) Google HEI mechanical advance limit , where you'll find the following threads:

http://www.nastyz28.com/forum/archiv.../t-141771.html

http://www.73-87.com/7387garage/drivetrain/hei.htm

http://www.chevytalk.org/fusionbb/sh...hp?tid/198509/

http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/limi...ce-141487.html

s i 442

I just did this last week.
Put the timing mark to the top of the tab, hook full time vacuum to the advance pod and idle down.
Engine will run smoother and cooler, should start easier.
This worked for me but I did use my dial back timing light and this is just where is happen to all fall into place.
I have 36 degrees of advance at 2800RPM, 15 initial. without messing with the weights and springs.
My distributor is also an Ebay $69.99 special, I also gapped my plugs at .43.
I gained alot of power because my old dist advance was stuck almost closed.
I used to be real skeptical about the full vacuum deal so one day I experimented 3 different ways and recorded every reading, number ETC and by far full vacuum was the best running set up.
I have set up 5 cars like this in the last year with positive seat of the pants gains!

MDchanic

Ha ha. I already had a run-around on this one, either with him or with Ozie (I forget), and I finally just gave up.

I agree, but good luck!

- Eric

Allan R

Has this HEI been recurved for his application?

joepenoso

No the HEI was installed as is straight from China to E bay to my doorstep. When the old HEI bit the dust, I transplanted one for the other.
Thanks
joepenos
PS is that better? I kinda liked the other look...... it made it easier to read and the added style allowed people to remember my earlier questions thereby making a more cohesive thread!!
Thanks
joepenoso

Allan R

You may like the bold type, but on internet it's generally considered to be 'shouting' or loud and aggressive talk.

I'd pull the springs from your old HEI swing weights and transplant them onto your new one to see if that helps.

joepenoso

Springs control rate of ignition advance not total advance ..the weight might control total I think
THz
joepenoso
PS A little bit of flair is good in this homogenius world

joe_padavano

Yes, and no. The springs do control rate of advance, HOWEVER, if the springs are too stiff the weights will never hit the full advance position. The little "tail" on the weights is supposed to control the total advance, when they hit the stops.

A little bit of spellcheck is also good in a homogeneous world.

And keep in mind that if you are asking people to take time out of their day to read your questions and provide answers, FOR FREE, you should probably make it as easy as possible for them to do so. Weird fonts (and, while we're at it, lack of punctuation, and run-on sentences, and adolescent "texting" styles) do NOT make it easier to read a post.

1970-W30

Can anybody explain to me what the so called advantages, other then the once a year points replacement, is with the HEI over a conventional distributor? I remember a CAR Craft magazine article testing a conventional distributor against a factory HEI back in a Dec. 98 issue. Turns out there was no horsepower gain at all at up to 4000RPM and only 2 hp gain at 5000 rpm. In my opinion, it is a waste of time and money, and the swap usually brings out a lot of unnecessary timing/wiring-up problems with these installations as seen by the high number of posts on this swap. Just my 2 cents worth........

MDchanic

You just answered your own question.

For high RPM applications, and applications where you don't intend to do any maintenance for 100,000 miles, HEI or other electronic systems have an advantage. Other than that, you're just making work for yourself.

- Eric

1970-W30

Chuckling, there sure seem to be a lot of guys that like to "make work for themselves."

joe_padavano

Most people today don't remember the early 1970s (or weren't born then). GM and other automakers went to electronic, high voltage ignitions in the early 1970s for one reason only - to comply with federal requirements that new cars meet emissions requirements without a tuneup for 50,000 miles (later changed to 100,000 miles). HEI and electronic ignition is NOT intended to be a performance improvement. Points and HEI will be exactly the same as long as the points are in good shape. Of course, once the points start to pit and wear, the electronic distributor will make more power, or more correctly, will not suffer the power loss of the point system. The higher voltage coil of the HEI system does have some advantages in firing off-nominal mixtures, but that's really a second-order benefit.

MDchanic

Of course, that's ASSuming that the respective distributors are both set up properly for the particular engine.

If you remove an original points distributor, and replace it with an HEI from a "smog years" motor (a most people do), you will have less performance and fuel economy with the HEI.

- Eric

oldcutlass

There are a couple of other advantages. The HEI will allow a higher initial advance with no mods and the chances of cross firing in the cap are less because of a bigger cap.


Disadvantages are when an HEI dies it's dead, not a simple side of the road repair. HEI's cost way more to rebuild if your having to replace a module, coil, rotor, and cap.


I can go either way after using both. Points just take an extra 15 minutes twice a year to keep it tuned.

MDchanic

And the higher initial advance is the problem, and the reason why people have to modify their HEIs.


Have you ever had problems with cross-firing?

- Eric

s i 442

I like the "in cap" 50000 volt coil, bigger 8mm wires, bigger gap for the plugs.
if 30 mins to swap out is just too much hassle just stay with points.

joe_padavano

Of course it does. Two point distributors with different advance curves will be different on the engine.

jag1886

Do you have your vacuum advance hooked up to manifold vacuum? This will make it hard to start when hot, I have mine hooked up that way and I put an electric vacuum switch it line that shuts the vacuum off just while cracking and it solved the hot start problem.

oldcutlass

joepenoso

To my friends at Classic Olds might be interested in my conclusion....total advance timing light was defective bulb was goo.... phoned Summit they are sending me a new timing light on their nickel YEAH!. Used the old non adjustable timing light set it at 10 degrees BTDC and now it idles well and no hot start slow cranking. A win win situation and I want to thank you for your help and interest
Thanks
joepenoso

oldcutlass

When you get your new timing light, you need to reset your timing because your only getting about 27ish deg of total advance, your engine will not be very happy there with an HEI.

MDchanic

I wasn't talking about an old, defective cap. I meant one in good condition.

- Eric

oldcutlass

Oh, now you want to get explicit.

You have to remember why the Hei was used. It was because GM wanted to increase the time frame between tune ups. With points, your looking at approx. a one year interval. What did we change every year when we did a tune up? Plugs, points, condenser, cap, and rotor, then we took the parts out of the trunk from last years annual tune and replaced them with the ones removed in the current year. Why did we change the cap every year? Carbon tracking and build up on the HV terminals under the cap.

The Hei, basically solved this yearly adventure, and reduced it to just checking, regapping, and or replacing plugs, and a fuel filter.