leepear

Jim Stolman's old 1970 w-30 convertible 4 speed just bid to $197,000 at the recent Worldwide Auctioneers auction. Went no sale. Not bad for an oldsmobile that is unrestored with one paint job and a bench seat and gold interior. The oldsmobiles seem to be getting the interest of the bigger collectors. That with the recent Thorton $150,000 1970 442 red 4 speed convertible are some good numbers considering the soft collector car market. At least I won't loose too much if I ever sell mine.

Lee

jaunty75

Wow. Didn't sell at $197,000. What would it have taken to buy the car?

cutlassjoe

Probably $198,000...that is strong money for an Olds. Good to see.

jaunty75

Strong? I'd call it insane!

442much

A guy in our club has a numbers matching 1969 442 W30 Conv. 4 spd that has gone through a complete frame off resto. It's almost finished. He said he doesn't want to sell it (he doesn't need the money) and he also has a 1970 442 W30 Conv. next in line for a frame off and a done 1969 Hurst with 63,000 miles. Wonder what his 1969 W30 would bring at an auction when you see numbers like that.

507OLDS

The 69 will not bring the money that the 70 will.

coltsneckbob

Well, you make me think about selling my 70 w-30 convert. I have docs and all numbers correct......and $200K sounds pretty good.....and I have bucket seats.

GoodOldsGuyDougie

Would you take 190K-?

stevengerard

I'll take 180k for mine

507OLDS

If you guys have 1 of the 76 W30 4-spd convertibles built in 1970,and have docs to prove it,you're well on your way.That is the main reason Jim's car is fetching the interest that it is.Jim had a bunch of other nice & rare cars,and some cool parts too.

leepear

Mine has buckets too. But it was ordered with the poverty caps so it must be the poor guy version. I can probably only get 170k for mine.

Lee

JRVintage

My is loaded and I was told it was only worth $15000. I didn't think the automatic hurt the price that bad?

Diego

I believe the number for 4-speeds is 98.

I saw the gold car in the Olds showroom years ago.

442much

Here's my friends 70.

RaysW30.jpg

507OLDS

I think it might be 96,not 76,but regardless,the 4-spd W30 convertibles are the rare ones,and everyone wants the oddest,but popular novelty that they can find.What was more common or desireable back then,is opposite now.

stevengerard

Beautiful!!!!! really nice color, I'm not sure I've seen a convertible in that shade

leepear

It is all about the documentation of these cars. Weak documentation means most big collectors will pass on the cars. There was 96 built and currently 300+ in existence. Matching number, owner history, and documentation makes a huge difference. My car has been known by the w-30 convertible collectors for 20+ years. Jims car was on my list years ago and is known to be real. Plus he is a legit collector. I have known collectors to sell off cars with weak documentation to buy ones with strong docs. Those 200+ "hey my car is real" other cars have actually helped the real ones with documentation.

507OLDS

I did a 4-spd console about a year ago,for a guy that had a burgundy/white convertible like that.I thought he was in the US though,but maybe he just had me ship it to a US address.I know it went somewhere out there,like Washington state or something.
One of my hardtops is burgundy with white stripes & white bucket interior.

leepear

Another dead give away of phoney cars is fabulous color combinations. In the 70s colors were popular that are not popular today. There were three golds, two greens, two blues. One of my friends has a triple green documented w-30 convertible. There is a real one on 442.com that is green with a green interior. When you come up with a black with white or red with white or maroon with white you better have really good paperwork because they were not usually ordered that way. I have been tracking these cars for 25 years.

Lee

442much

Like the 70's bathroom sink, tub and toilet that I replaced when our home reno's were underway. We had the beautiful high class Harvest Gold colours (yellow). My friend had the "green".

507OLDS

That is the way I have been with the cars,and the parts.If I find something better,the weakest one goes.I have owned over 30 of these 70-72 cars,and I still have the 2nd & 3rd ones that I bought.I have also owned a 70 442 4-spd convertible,a 71 442 4-spd convertible,and a 72 442 4-spd convertible,but they just didn't spark my interest enough to keep them.The coolest of those 3 was the 71,the last 3 digits of the VIN were 442,but also not exactly the prettiest,sable brown,tan top,white stripe,white interior.The new owner is making a color change & that's his decision.

joe_padavano

Sorry Lee, but again if cash does not change hands, there is no determination of value as far as I'm concerned.

BlackGold

Which is one of the reasons I love my W-30, which is black with gold stripes. When I bought it, I wasn't thrilled with the black. But it's grown on me, and it's cool to have what was a rare color combination back then (even if it's quite common on today's cars). And yes, I have the documentation to prove it's original.

Joe, if reserve is not met, don't you still consider that high bid a good measure of present value? Or are you saying that a high reserve might indicate that the seller was just fishing and not really selling? Either way, it proves there's at least two people out there willing to pay that much.

coltsneckbob

Is that an offer???????

leepear

Joe is correct. Although everyone wants their cars to be worth big bucks the true value of their cars is only determined after the sale. Lets use the 1970 w-30 convt 4 speed as an example. I don't recognize your blue w-30 convertible but if it is documented correctly, 4 speed, 100 pt restored and that color combination you would be at the top of the scale for value. I am guessing out of the 96 made and 300 that remain only a few can be classified that way. Maybe 5 or 6 cars. Several of those are already in collections not for sale. Jim's car was a nice repaint that will need $100,000+ to make the top of the scale. The gold interior hurts that car although mint examples look pretty good. Where Joe is wrong is the bidders, one of which I know were willing to go the price bid and if the seller dropped the reserve he would have bought the car between 190k and 200k. That is not true for many of the auctions with shill bidders bidding up the price. The other unknown in the value of any car is the private sales which never get sales prices listed. I know a weak documented w-30 convertible 4 speed that sold two years ago for $199,000 and the new owner invested $75,000 to freshen it up. That was a very strong sale for a car that could be questioned for authenticity. So it is fun to guess what our cars are worth. The only way to really tell is get a buyer to pay the price.

Lee

70Post

You don't know if the bid was "real" or not. As long as it was below reserve the bidder risks little, if anything, in helping run the price up.

507OLDS

Didn't Elliot finally sell his twilight blue 70 W30 4-spd convertible?I think his also had the W27 rear.
That brings up another topic.You can add more novelties,like the W27 rear,but the documentation showing that such a thing came on the car is again worth some value in itself.
There is a legit sebring yellow one here,with a whole filing cabinet from the original owner,with every single paper related to that car.

leepear

I don't think he had the w-27. The guy Blake in Arizona had the only w-27 installed ones that I had seen documented. Elliot has his original 70 and the 71 (for sale) silver autotmatic loaded car. If you know the person with the sebring yellow one I would like to contact him. This car is not on my list as I have never heard of a yellow real one. Thorton's brother has a car recently bought off ebay that I also need the detail on along with the maroon one and blue one discussed above. If the maroon one was purchased in Canada it will have docs. The Thorton car wiill be a total replacement restoration, very rusty car. Prior owners help document the car as my list goes back 25 years. The 71s on the list are very complete and accurate. Lee

dc2x4drvr

I recall 4 '70 W30, 4 speed convertibles at Bowling Green, was this car part of that collection?

allyolds68

This is owned by a gentleman in Massachusetts. He bought it in the late 70's. He knows what dealership it came from and the dealer is still in business but doesn't have any documentation. It is 100% correct but without docs it's not a crazy money car

VikingBlue

Related to some of the points here, I have been high bidder on a couple of Ebay vehicles that did not sell....and I do believe that 'high bids' in auctions are the best measure of an item's value....disregarding shill bidding obviously.

One vehicle was listed 3 times and each time I was high bidder, yet the owner thought the car was worth more....apparently, the owner was the only one with that opinion.

Well advertised public auctions are the best indicators...IMO

leepear

The phoney, counterfeit or whatever you want to call them started in the early 80 not because of the value added to the car but because you could get the parts off old rusted and wreaked cars. Add a ram air hood and couple other w-30 parts. Sell the car and the next owner adds a couple more. Next thing you know it is a w-30 convertible without the paperwork. Now with the value difference in the cars there is even counterfeit docs. This is what makes the known cars so valuable. I have known Jim for years and his cars so will never question the gold w-30 convertible. Were as when a car comes from nowhere with weak docs it is questioned by the old school guys. I guess I am an old school guy.

Lee

Diego

I'm not sure what you mean. If I find a legit Rally Red car, who's to say that it isn't real just because it's not an Earth-tone?

By the way, there were three blues.

442much

Personally I'd rather buy a cheaper less documented car. How would I feel if I paid in excess of $200k only to have the car hit by someone not paying attention? What would the value be after a replacement hood, a new fender, quarter panel and door or frame work?. It's not original anymore.

If you don't want that to happen, pay the $200K + and enjoy looking at your paper weight in its climate controlled environment. That's fine for collectors who only bought the car as an investment. Or you buy a cheaper one and baby it like the well documented car but still enjoy it. If the unthinkable happens, since the car is not so well documented, a new fender, quarter and door won't really change a whole lot.

I want to drive them. That's how I get my kicks. I would like to buy as an investment...but I know I'd lack the willpower. I just can't let them be show pieces. Just my $.02

leepear

442much I agree. That is why I will never restore my 1971. It will always be my beater.

Lee

507OLDS

This is also why the 442's built in Lansing will always attract more bidders/buyers,compared to the ones built at other plants.You can thow all the pieces on,and "supposedly" it's a W30.
Docs are especially important with the W31's,since they are a Cutlass or F85,with no special VIN prefix.I have the sheet for mine,or else it would be gone like the others.

slowdime

my motherinlaw sells houses and she says the people that buy these cars do it for their ego

they arent really worth that much except to certain people

Uly49

I have a "Sebring Yellow" W-30 that is about 4 weeks from the restoration being completed. I have a build sheet as well as the broadcast card.
Please let me know if you need any further information. It is a great color and I am always surprised at the reaction of people when they see it...they love it and can't understand why more people did not order it....
Scott...

stevengerard

There's a Sebring hardtop W30 not far from me, I've only seen it moving need to go see it standing still one day.

Three Blues - all colors of the sky, Azure, Astro and Twilight

I think what Lee is saying is that there are more red, ralley red and black cars now then there were when they were made. Same thing back then the golds, greens etc were quite popular.

GoodOldsGuyDougie

coltsneckbob --No I'm just kidding!